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Post by custardboy on Jul 6, 2019 0:04:54 GMT
There is a surprising lack of discussion here! The theme force remix is shaking stuff up a bit, and legion is well known for its poorly designed themes. Rather than wishlisting, what do you suspect will happen?
I think we may see Oracles and Children getting merged. Children doesn't work in large part because of its battlegroup restrictions. The defining feature of Oracles is that we get free stuff for beasts. With the restrictions on requisition points going, Oracles only exists as a theme that allows us to field our warbeasts. All the units/solos in Oracles except the Forsaken is also available in children already.
So what I *suspect* is that we will have the theme benefits of Oracles as +1 to go first is disappearing and unyielding on nephilim unbalances them. All beasts and nyss allowed.
Maybe Forsaken and Raptors removed from the allowed models to make them more unique in Ravens. Azrael and Zuriel I'm not sure, but they and Golab could be added to Ravens of War to properly define that theme along with new benefits.
The reason I don't expect Ravens and Children to be merged (despite all their theme benefits being against the new design) is that it would allow every legion non-ogrun unit.
Do you guys expect similar, or something completely different?
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Post by davycannonhound on Jul 6, 2019 3:16:34 GMT
I honestly expect CotD to get broken up and split between Ravens and Oracles. I don't know how, but thats the only thing I can figure.
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Post by thewaspinator on Jul 6, 2019 5:15:47 GMT
Yeah, I'm hoping this helps COTD a lot. Right now, that theme is kind of dysfunctional between being an infantry theme and a beast one.
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Post by voidbender on Jul 6, 2019 12:26:30 GMT
The (corrected) official word is that none of Legion's themes will be merging.
However, I think there was some indication of them opening up a bit. I suspect forsaken will become available in CotD, and I hope they take this opportunity to put every character beast in at least one theme. I've also heard whispers of a few point reductions, though nothing specific for Legion yet.
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Post by custardboy on Jul 6, 2019 13:18:34 GMT
They can't really open up the beast access in Children without outclassing Oracles right? It would just be the same theme but with more stuff. Either Oracles gets outclassed or Children keeps it's absurd beast restrictions.
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Post by voidbender on Jul 6, 2019 14:20:53 GMT
Yeah. They might be able to allow some lights, but I wouldn't be surprised if beast restrictions don't change for CotD. It would be nice for the bloodseer to have an animus worth copying in theme though.
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Post by dirtyharrypotter on Jul 6, 2019 19:24:31 GMT
Maybe Forsaken and Raptors removed from the allowed models to make them more unique in Ravens. Don't suggest such horrible things 😂
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gordo
Junior Strategist
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Post by gordo on Jul 6, 2019 21:15:02 GMT
So the real issue here is: how do you make people play any theme over Primal Terrors? What is Primal Terrors lacking that is worth the loss of Hellmouths?
Better question: what benefits could possibly make Legion warbeasts desirable when you don't have access to Hellmouths?
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Post by dirtyharrypotter on Jul 6, 2019 21:49:56 GMT
The throne?
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Post by josephkerr on Jul 7, 2019 2:08:52 GMT
So the real issue here is: how do you make people play any theme over Primal Terrors? What is Primal Terrors lacking that is worth the loss of Hellmouths? Better question: what benefits could possibly make Legion warbeasts desirable when you don't have access to Hellmouths? According to Hungerford, theyre looking into Primal Terrors and Hellmouth nerfs, maybe point increases or removing them from the requisition list. They probably agree with you and think the Hellmouth is over performing. If its 7 points and no longer free, do u think that frees up the other lists to shine?
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gordo
Junior Strategist
My star is green?
Posts: 548
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Post by gordo on Jul 7, 2019 5:30:52 GMT
So the real issue here is: how do you make people play any theme over Primal Terrors? What is Primal Terrors lacking that is worth the loss of Hellmouths? Better question: what benefits could possibly make Legion warbeasts desirable when you don't have access to Hellmouths? According to Hungerford, theyre looking into Primal Terrors and Hellmouth nerfs, maybe point increases or removing them from the requisition list. Â They probably agree with you and think the Hellmouth is over performing. Â If its 7 points and no longer free, do u think that frees up the other lists to shine? Remembering the beginning of mk3, I think without the Hellmouth, Legion war beasts are dead weight. I think that has not changed. They still suck. So... Unless they make Legion war beasts good somewhere, lists without the Hellmouth will not get played because they have roughly 25+ points of garbage. Which means only Primal Terrors is going to be played. So business as usual.
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Post by davycannonhound on Jul 9, 2019 2:57:33 GMT
I think Ravens may actually be the theme to be merged with others. Thematically, I think Grotesques would fit well in Primal Terrors (they're basically animals), and Striders would have no problem cooperating with Nyss tactics in CotD. I'd also like to see CotD get ALL lights available in the theme, not just Nephilim and Lessers. It wouldn't outshine OoA in beast selection, but it would open up the beast selection ENOUGH to give it some breathing room.
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Post by josephkerr on Jul 9, 2019 3:16:42 GMT
I think Ravens may actually be the theme to be merged with others. Thematically, I think Grotesques would fit well in Primal Terrors (they're basically animals), and Striders would have no problem cooperating with Nyss tactics in CotD. I'd also like to see CotD get ALL lights available in the theme, not just Nephilim and Lessers. It wouldn't outshine OoA in beast selection, but it would open up the beast selection ENOUGH to give it some breathing room. I think CotD becomes an infantry theme, finally, as all u need is the heavies then u can run three units with CAs or two units with CAs and Incubii, which helps list building a ton.
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eauc
Junior Strategist
Posts: 209
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Post by eauc on Jul 9, 2019 11:06:51 GMT
My personnal bets: - we don't get an insider overview because PP forgot about Legion. - we somehow get less viable choices post-reform. Maybe one less theme, or less free stuff (eg no more free hellmouth and sorceress). - we get some totally useless stuff as a compensation. Like, grots getting natural ambush or shit like that. Maybe free scather crew. That would be fun.
I mean, I hope I'm wrong, but those seem the natural outcome of what I've seen/read so far.
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gordo
Junior Strategist
My star is green?
Posts: 548
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Post by gordo on Jul 9, 2019 14:36:03 GMT
My personnal bets: - we don't get an insider overview because PP forgot about Legion. - we somehow get less viable choices post-reform. Maybe one less theme, or less free stuff (eg no more free hellmouth and sorceress). - we get some totally useless stuff as a compensation. Like, grots getting natural ambush or shit like that. Maybe free scather crew. That would be fun. I mean, I hope I'm wrong, but those seem the natural outcome of what I've seen/read so far. I'm excited for literally every other faction but Legion. I see this making their bad themes better, but not even close to good enough. Hopefully I'm wrong. Oh yeah, and I already heard they want to nerf Hellmouths in some way. So that's happening.
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