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Post by Charistoph on Mar 8, 2019 3:30:02 GMT
So, Xerxis2 fulfills the quota of having a Cavalry Warlock and a Huge-based Warlock (and amazing to boot), but what about a Warlock riding the ubiquitous Ferox? All the other horse cavalry are fine in those routes, but why not the Ferox?
More seriously, though, how would you approach a Ferox-riding Warlock? Should it be a current Warlock, or should it be someone new?
While I would find it amusing for Jalaam to be riding a Ferox, I don't think it would be a good fit due to the strife between Venators and the melee troops. Xerxis already has his awesome ride (and is possibly too big for the Ferox), Zaal's a statue, Rasheth's far too heavy (he'd probably break the rhino's back), and Mordikaar is... indisposed.
For those who are left, that leaves Hexeris, Morghoul, Zaadesh, Xekaar, and Makeda. Hexeris is noted for having been a candidate to be a Cataphract, so may be too large, and is outside the Praetorian structure. Xekaar and Morghoul are Paingivers, so outside the Praetorian structure as well.
That leaves Zaadesh and Makeda. Honestly, I could see both in this light, but one is less likely than the other. Both are hard workers who appreciate a good challenge and not accept another doing something they cannot. They are both of the Praetorian school more than the other Warlocks are, and Ferox riders do come from the Praetorian school.
From there, Makeda has 3 versions (one a unit), while Zaadesh has two. Zaadesh is far younger and pushing to build up a strong core behind him, and if he can get Rhadeim fully behind him, that would be a subtle coup. From that perspective, what better way to show how strong you are than becoming an accomplished Ferox rider?
But that's only for the originals. A brand new Warlock coming from the east to take their place among the conquerors would be not be out of place and provide some refreshing new content, I think. Some stats will be a give like speed, but how much Fury would you allow for? For such a one, I would think 6 would be their max, but I could see (a frustrating) 5, depending on what else they brought to the table.
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gordo
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Post by gordo on Mar 8, 2019 13:57:51 GMT
Why not Radheim2?
Untouched design space: Dragoon caster
But to answer your original question best:
I would consider the following things intrinsic to the ferrox kit:
Pathfinder Jump Mount attacks
Jump lends itself to a close combat, skirmishing or assassinating caster. Praetorian caster says he would have a "warrior" focus.
For spells, I would say Tag Team to emphasize working closely with his beasts but still push the warrior theme. Blur or Dash to help deliver. Bloodlust to tally cement him into hi pushing units.
Elite Cadre: Ferrox of some kind (if you went the Radheim2 route, make it Dodge).
14/17 but with Shield for +2, MAT 7, PS 15-16 on spear, maybe a weak Shield attack, Sustained Attack, Fury 5 but give him Bloodboon or Ritual Slaughter to lighten the fury load. You basically want him to be able to commit well to melee without entirely forsaking the rest of his army, but still need to make a decision between going all in on melee or not.
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Post by Charistoph on Mar 8, 2019 14:30:26 GMT
Honestly, I thought about Radheim, but I didn't want him facing a Zaadesh situation where he'd be one of the best solos supporting himself, but still cannot be taken.
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Post by coolguyclay on Mar 8, 2019 17:24:57 GMT
Honestly, I thought about Radheim, but I didn't want him facing a Zaadesh situation where he'd be one of the best solos supporting himself, but still cannot be taken. This is a good point, I agree. (and haven't assembled Zaadesh 2 so never ran into this before). Now for a bizarre idea: Naaresh - Dragoon caster. Rides into battle in the mouth of a Ferox. Spell-casting mounted version - low HP and auto-damage while he rides (each time damaged from any source is a cumulative pain token - something like Baldeur2). Unmounted melee version is already "pain-inspired" - different spell list (Sturm and Drang type stuff...) Ability to dismount at start of control phase within 5" (Ferox spits him). Elite Cadre Ferox gain Berserk?
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bacon
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Post by bacon on Mar 8, 2019 17:28:10 GMT
A ferox caster would be cool but what kind of spell list and innate abilities do you think he should have? Jump,repo, steady, and pounce are a given since ferox have it, but were you envisioning him as, more as a super solo style caster like mak 3/barny 2 or a support style more like mak1/2?
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gordo
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Post by gordo on Mar 8, 2019 18:09:11 GMT
Honestly, I thought about Radheim, but I didn't want him facing a Zaadesh situation where he'd be one of the best solos supporting himself, but still cannot be taken. That's why I recommended Elite Cadre.
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Post by jagius021 on Mar 9, 2019 6:23:32 GMT
Feat: House of Pain - all FF models gain Jump (around) and boosted attack and damage rolls after using jump.
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Post by Charistoph on Mar 9, 2019 15:51:32 GMT
Honestly, I thought about Radheim, but I didn't want him facing a Zaadesh situation where he'd be one of the best solos supporting himself, but still cannot be taken. That's why I recommended Elite Cadre.
But if it's not Rhadeim, then this allows the Warlock to have other rules to work with instead of just being the Ferox Dodge Warlock, AND have Rhadeim available to work his shenanigans.
From a fluff perspective, he'd also just be a Lesser Warlock at this stage, because he's reached his current rank without Warbeast control, and so would just be learning how to harness it.
Feat: House of Pain - all FF models gain Jump (around) and boosted attack and damage rolls after using jump. While not possible, the idea of Mammoths and Hydras bouncing all over the place has me giggling with amusement. It would be really crazy useful for Aradus, though. And then a Bronzeback with Rush and Jump? *shudder*
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Post by redcathal on Mar 11, 2019 14:18:23 GMT
Honestly, I thought about Radheim, but I didn't want him facing a Zaadesh situation where he'd be one of the best solos supporting himself, but still cannot be taken. This is a good point, I agree. (and haven't assembled Zaadesh 2 so never ran into this before). Now for a bizarre idea: Naaresh - Dragoon caster. Rides into battle in the mouth of a Ferox. Spell-casting mounted version - low HP and auto-damage while he rides (each time damaged from any source is a cumulative pain token - something like Baldeur2). Unmounted melee version is already "pain-inspired" - different spell list (Sturm and Drang type stuff...) Ability to dismount at start of control phase within 5" (Ferox spits him). Elite Cadre Ferox gain Berserk? Naaresh riding a giant hedgehog/porcupine!
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gordo
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Post by gordo on Mar 11, 2019 15:23:57 GMT
That's why I recommended Elite Cadre.
But if it's not Rhadeim, then this allows the Warlock to have other rules to work with instead of just being the Ferox Dodge Warlock, AND have Rhadeim available to work his shenanigans.
From a fluff perspective, he'd also just be a Lesser Warlock at this stage, because he's reached his current rank without Warbeast control, and so would just be learning how to harness it.
Feat: House of Pain - all FF models gain Jump (around) and boosted attack and damage rolls after using jump. While not possible, the idea of Mammoths and Hydras bouncing all over the place has me giggling with amusement. It would be really crazy useful for Aradus, though. And then a Bronzeback with Rush and Jump? *shudder* Edited because I can't read, apparently
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Post by coolguyclay on Mar 11, 2019 18:10:54 GMT
Naaresh riding a giant hedgehog/porcupine! Yes! The ultimate in pain endurance. jagius021 That jump feat would be great. Kind of a mix of the Parry or Free move/push kind of feats and boosted attack, damage feats (Mak2, X1, etc). "...for first attack after using Jump" qualifier added, so not everything boosts for rest of the turn. Good for infantry and beasts - gives Skorne some movement shenanigans AND some Skornergy with Ferox that want the caster's Elite Cadre or spells, but already have Jump ; )
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boozy
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Post by boozy on Mar 16, 2019 7:07:57 GMT
As for a Dragoon, much as I would love it, I can't ever see PP give a defensive tech piece that strong to any faction. They build around assassination many models, and getting dismounted is a pure save against anything, once. That's still far too good to put on a warcaster/warlock.
As for who would actually be a good fit, I agree that Rhadiem and Zaadesh2 would be mostly likely, aside from a new warlock. If they wanted to go a crazy direction, make the Legends a warcaster unit on cats.
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gupp
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Post by gupp on Apr 18, 2019 20:00:05 GMT
We have so many "warior/beatstick" locks that i feel another one would be sort of not adding much, play wise, even if they are on a ferox...
i'd like to see epic Jalaam Riding one though, it kind of fits... focus more on his aspect of promotion and leader of a band of outriders rather than his role as a single hunter.
Signature spell- +2def and speed to a unit
feat: all of your army gains pathfinder and reposition 5"
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Post by coolguyclay on Apr 19, 2019 17:59:13 GMT
...While I would find it amusing for Jalaam to be riding a Ferox, I don't think it would be a good fit due to the strife between Venators and the melee troops. ... Just a quick aside, Shooting Calvary isn't too far out of the question. See Mongol's Calvary Jalaam is also known for not following hoskune code, a "whatever gets the job done" kind of fella. (Plus his cape is epic so would look good on a mount.)
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Post by Charistoph on Apr 20, 2019 0:24:20 GMT
...While I would find it amusing for Jalaam to be riding a Ferox, I don't think it would be a good fit due to the strife between Venators and the melee troops. ... Just a quick aside, Shooting Calvary isn't too far out of the question. See Mongol's Calvary Jalaam is also known for not following hoskune code, a "whatever gets the job done" kind of fella. (Plus his cape is epic so would look good on a mount.)
I'm not against Jalaam being a Cavalry caster and have nothing against shooting Cavalry, I just don't think that the Praetorians are going to bother giving any low class Venator lessons on how to ride their defining mounts, the Ferox. If he was on an Efaarit bletcher, or something new, it could be very awesome. I just don't think we'll ever see Jalaam on a Ferox any time soon.
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