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Post by Trollock on Jan 16, 2019 18:05:04 GMT
Takes the whole game to kill it. Birghid is dice minus 8 on two dice and the champion is dice minus 11 on two dice. It is very unlikely that the champion is in the back arc more than one round. With no BB it is a piece of cake to kill, but with ARM 20 the math is conpletely different
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Post by paradox on Jan 16, 2019 18:10:45 GMT
Takes the whole game to kill it. Birghid is dice minus 8 on two dice and the champion is dice minus 11 on two dice. It is very unlikely that the champion is in the back arc more than one round. With no BB it is a piece of cake to kill, but with ARM 20 the math is conpletely different 1. Youre too afraid of dice math, and are saying you wont take chances. 2. It doesnt have to be a single model. A turn or two of shots soften it, allowing 1 bigger hit a much better chance of finishing the deal. At this point, I feel its your own mental block that needs to be overcome, and only you can do that. Also, as I pointed out, Prey makes Brighid -6, not -8.
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Post by streetpizza on Jan 16, 2019 18:24:20 GMT
Some other solutions
- Play a list that has a damage buff. The tentacles are perfect magnets for attaching offensive spells to the unit. - Bootable shooting is the HM's bane. Raptor, pureblood and wold watchers all do fine at whittling it down especially when combined with point #1.
All in all if you really feel like you can't deal with them using the list your brought then guess what ... your list is bad into Legion. HM's need to be accounted for in the legion matchup.
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Post by Trollock on Jan 16, 2019 19:09:32 GMT
Takes the whole game to kill it. Birghid is dice minus 8 on two dice and the champion is dice minus 11 on two dice. It is very unlikely that the champion is in the back arc more than one round. With no BB it is a piece of cake to kill, but with ARM 20 the math is conpletely different 1. Youre too afraid of dice math, and are saying you wont take chances. 2. It doesnt have to be a single model. A turn or two of shots soften it, allowing 1 bigger hit a much better chance of finishing the deal. At this point, I feel its your own mental block that needs to be overcome, and only you can do that. Also, as I pointed out, Prey makes Brighid -6, not -8. Im assuming the hellmouth has arm 20 from the BB here, so Birghid is indeed dice minus 8 with prey. Sure i could "take a chance" and hope to roll double sixes twice for damage, but thats not really a solution. Dice math is not everything, but i do not think it can be ignored in a game. It should be used to guide ones decisions. Note that im not trying to make the point that "hellmoths are broken and the game sux!" But more im after any useful tactics that other players may have up their sleeves and that i have missed. My idea was "ill just murder the shit out of it with b&c" but without a damage buff they are not likely to finish the job. Throwing in some boosted shots the math goes to more comfortable levels, but then i am committing half my army to kill a "free" unit. The opportunity cost is that the three units of warmongers get to me
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Post by Trollock on Jan 16, 2019 19:17:56 GMT
Some other solutions - Play a list that has a damage buff. The tentacles are perfect magnets for attaching offensive spells to the unit. - Bootable shooting is the HM's bane. Raptor, pureblood and wold watchers all do fine at whittling it down especially when combined with point #1. All in all if you really feel like you can't deal with them using the list your brought then guess what ... your list is bad into Legion. HM's need to be accounted for in the legion matchup. I totally agree that a damage buff swings the probablility to comfortable levels. I totally agree that my list is not optimized for legion, but the legion list is not optimized for circle either. Do you think that a circle list needs a damage buff to be able to handle hellmouths? I know for a fact that our lord and saviour Tomasz plays krueger 2 bones against anamag PT, at least in the past. I just do not see hoe one handles hellmouths short of applying a heavy to the face. If they are in range of the BB a wyrd will only do about 1 point of damage, and it is not unlikely to do 0. Shooting seems totally invalid here (assuming ARM 20 and nondamage buff).
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Post by paradox on Jan 16, 2019 19:33:08 GMT
1. Youre too afraid of dice math, and are saying you wont take chances. 2. It doesnt have to be a single model. A turn or two of shots soften it, allowing 1 bigger hit a much better chance of finishing the deal. At this point, I feel its your own mental block that needs to be overcome, and only you can do that. Also, as I pointed out, Prey makes Brighid -6, not -8. Im assuming the hellmouth has arm 20 from the BB here, so Birghid is indeed dice minus 8 with prey. Sure i could "take a chance" and hope to roll double sixes twice for damage, but thats not really a solution. Dice math is not everything, but i do not think it can be ignored in a game. It should be used to guide ones decisions. Note that im not trying to make the point that "hellmoths are broken and the game sux!" But more im after any useful tactics that other players may have up their sleeves and that i have missed. My idea was "ill just murder the shit out of it with b&c" but without a damage buff they are not likely to finish the job. Throwing in some boosted shots the math goes to more comfortable levels, but then i am committing half my army to kill a "free" unit. The opportunity cost is that the three units of warmongers get to me See, youre still looking at just 1 models output, and not what could be compounded over several models in a turn or two. Or you could ignore it and attack other models. If its perfectly positioned in terrain and in 1+ defensive auras, sometimes you just ignore it and, say, TK Thags then pile shots into him. Or angle for the BB.
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Post by norka19 on Jan 17, 2019 4:11:11 GMT
That’s what I’m saying, in this scenario thagrosh is probably up far if he’s easily got his aura on what you got attacking his Hellmouth. He’s probably in range for a wolf champ leap or tk/Hellmouth sheningans. Don’t let him feel safe bunkering in the middle of the board
You can also hold LotF back and threaten him mid game
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