sorokin
Junior Strategist
Posts: 775
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Post by sorokin on Nov 9, 2018 21:04:50 GMT
Is the ret board really that bad? I've never been there. There are worse boards... Sounds like there should be a tier list.
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Post by Havock on Nov 9, 2018 23:28:54 GMT
Just my take on this as somebody who basically just started the game: Whenever I lurked on this forum I always wondered why people insistantly tried to squeeze things like Nyss, Boomhowler and Co., Kayazy Assassins, Devil Doggos or Croe's into their lists. Whenever i saw that, I looked at their cards online and thought to myself... yeah these guys don't seem all that great, so what is it about them? Know I know the answer. They are relics of the past people are still attached to. Well Eliminators are still great, if squishy, but yeah, by and large, it's people with legacy Mk2 (and even mk1) collections just trying to make them work.
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germanicus
Junior Strategist
No jokes round ear...
Posts: 358
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Post by germanicus on Nov 9, 2018 23:58:49 GMT
Is the ret board really that bad? I've never been there. Depends when you're there... it's alright for the most part (and it doesn't matter whether you're referring to here or Facebook funnily enough). Anyway, in the context of Nyss Hunters, no, that was just me, as I do think they are good, but mainly because I speak as a predominantly Ret player as we have easier access to tools to let them do their thing. Granted, their stock has fallen a bit in Shadows thanks to the tweak to MHSF, but they're still a solid pick in Defenders where you can bring along their buddy for +1 MAT/RAT and Immunity to Cold just to double down with 4Shade. Certain builds that aren't necessarily tournament winning can make them really good (borderline obnoxious) jammers.
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sorokin
Junior Strategist
Posts: 775
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Post by sorokin on Nov 10, 2018 0:25:05 GMT
Just my take on this as somebody who basically just started the game: Whenever I lurked on this forum I always wondered why people insistantly tried to squeeze things like Nyss, Boomhowler and Co., Kayazy Assassins, Devil Doggos or Croe's into their lists. Whenever i saw that, I looked at their cards online and thought to myself... yeah these guys don't seem all that great, so what is it about them? Know I know the answer. They are relics of the past people are still attached to. Well Eliminators are still great, if squishy, but yeah, by and large, it's people with legacy Mk2 (and even mk1) collections just trying to make them work. Well of course Eliminators are great, I will never question the glory of ninja waifus!
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sorokin
Junior Strategist
Posts: 775
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Post by sorokin on Nov 10, 2018 0:32:16 GMT
Is the ret board really that bad? I've never been there. Depends when you're there... it's alright for the most part (and it doesn't matter whether you're referring to here or Facebook funnily enough). Anyway, in the context of Nyss Hunters, no, that was just me, as I do think they are good, but mainly because I speak as a predominantly Ret player as we have easier access to tools to let them do their thing. Granted, their stock has fallen a bit in Shadows thanks to the tweak to MHSF, but they're still a solid pick in Defenders where you can bring along their buddy for +1 MAT/RAT and Immunity to Cold just to double down with 4Shade. Certain builds that aren't necessarily tournament winning can make them really good (borderline obnoxious) jammers. Partisan units seem to work anywhere but in mercs it seems. Assassins are great in khador bt not in mercs, Nyss are good in Ret but not in mercs. Caines Hellslingers are better in cygnar than in mercs. At least Eleiminators and Idrians are good there. Well spelling it out like that; 2/5 could be worse i guess.
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germanicus
Junior Strategist
No jokes round ear...
Posts: 358
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Post by germanicus on Nov 10, 2018 3:17:28 GMT
Partisan units seem to work anywhere but in mercs it seems. Assassins are great in khador bt not in mercs, Nyss are good in Ret but not in mercs. Caines Hellslingers are better in cygnar than in mercs. At least Eleiminators and Idrians are good there. Well spelling it out like that; 2/5 could be worse i guess. Eh, it's always that case of balance... both against Mercs and the Partisan faction which is a tough act. It would always swing one way or another and it's easier to crock the Mercs because of the inevitable whine of 'why bother making it friendly faction what it does jack-all in said faction'? and the like. And given that the Mercs are open to other factions anyway, it makes Partisans even more of a pain to deal with. Weirdly, most partisans seen are Ret (Silly Willy, Lanyssa and Eiryss), who have access to fewest Merc/Mins of the main factions.
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Post by Netherby on Nov 10, 2018 13:42:32 GMT
The funny thing is, Mercs are quite a strong faction these days. Even though a large number of their models never see play in a Merc list.
Some units are probably seen more as faction partisans first and mercs second, which is how you end up with them not working well in one or the other. To be fair, it's a pretty tricky thing to balance a model that can be taken in multiple factions.
Like maybe the fixing the Nyss to be good in Khador makes them broken as heck in Ret...
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germanicus
Junior Strategist
No jokes round ear...
Posts: 358
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Post by germanicus on Nov 10, 2018 14:08:06 GMT
Some units are probably seen more as faction partisans first and mercs second, which is how you end up with them not working well in one or the other. To be fair, it's a pretty tricky thing to balance a model that can be taken in multiple factions. Like maybe the fixing the Nyss to be good in Khador makes them broken as heck in Ret... Exactly... to me, any adjustment to Nyss Hunters (outside of a points drop, which IMO is all that's needed to see them taken more often... but only in Ret, I can't really speak for any other faction) will definitely bust them in Ret owing to the presence of the Priest, who makes them an expensive (or not... the Priest can be a free option), but damned flexible module without being expressly good or bad either way, which is why they don't make tournament winning lists much but still see a modicum of success. Less so now because the CID didn't do anything for them (awww... no AM for you, but that WOULD be busted, in all honesty). Nyss Hunters + Priest vs any Sorscha or Koldun is their worst nightmare straight out the gate, funnily enough.
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Post by Soul Samurai on Nov 10, 2018 16:16:29 GMT
Perhaps it's a good thing that they aren't great right now? At the very least it saves people from buying the models and then having to pin those damned things.
Me? I spent like two months assembling and modding them to be less ugly, so I'm going to keep using them just to see a return on that investment.
Maybe someday I'll even paint them too...
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sorokin
Junior Strategist
Posts: 775
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Post by sorokin on Nov 10, 2018 16:21:54 GMT
Hey, at least you can put Cylena on the board as a Warcaster now. Albeit only in unofficial games.
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Post by Soul Samurai on Nov 10, 2018 17:00:50 GMT
Hey, at least you can put Cylena on the board as a Warcaster now. Albeit only in unofficial games. My last game I ran Vinter -1 just because I had bought the Vinter and Leto IK models ages ago.
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sorokin
Junior Strategist
Posts: 775
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Post by sorokin on Nov 10, 2018 18:35:34 GMT
Hey, at least you can put Cylena on the board as a Warcaster now. Albeit only in unofficial games. My last game I ran Vinter -1 just because I had bought the Vinter and Leto IK models ages ago. Buying herindividual parts an a small base doesn't cost more than 10 dolalrs in the store. Maybe I'll do that at some point just so I can run some Cylena-1 lists. She seems to be the ultimate pew pew caster. Edit: Ugh, they only sell bases in bundles of 12, so it'll be 11 dollars. Dammit.
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Post by Havock on Nov 11, 2018 1:52:23 GMT
I'd play the shit out of Cylena-1 if I was allowed to bring her to a SR.
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germanicus
Junior Strategist
No jokes round ear...
Posts: 358
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Post by germanicus on Nov 11, 2018 5:19:45 GMT
I'd play the shit out of Cylena-1 if I was allowed to bring her to a SR. Hey, I'm Cryx these days, I'd play the shit out of Jezraell with Denny0 just to troll the local Cygnar players to hell if it was SR legal!
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