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Post by dicebedamned on Jul 16, 2018 12:29:02 GMT
using Sevvy1 is key when doing the pop and drops, as the added one is for ALL attack and damage rolls, meaning it counts for multi spray targets and collateral damage rolls as well CRA at 5 for skyhammers is 16 on base, 11 on collateral. The way CRA works on AoEs is that you take the base, half it, and then add the number of models, meaning 10 goes down to 5 then + 5 for the cra and + 1 more for Sevvy1 ^-^ The sunburst crew is important for girded and dug in units. Even if they do not receive blast damage, they are still lit on fire. I have a list that involves 2 full units of skyhammers and 2 sunburst crews that I originally just made for shits and giggles. Turns out it's really effective against factions like Cygnar, which likes to use high def spams, ranged attacks, and light jacks. I think you mean Sevi0. Pop n Drop is Kreoss1's thing, so you would only have access to Sevi0.
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demonic
Junior Strategist
Posts: 649
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Post by demonic on Jul 16, 2018 19:42:10 GMT
ah, you mean the KO everything and then nuke it then? Cuz I don't even bother with that; you don't need to. 5 man CRA + sevy + arms master = RAT 8 WITHOUT aiming. by pop and drop I mean clearing the board with 4, 5 inch AoEs and 2, 4 inch aoes and then using the cleared out LoS to drop their caster. With how many units have steady or can give out steady now a days, knockdown is not as viable as a tactic as it once was, especially after everyone becomes warry about it from throws and slams kding their casters. However, Kreoss1 has Purification, which does give him a slight edge when armies are becoming continuously dependent on upkeeps and bubbles to stay afloat. The real clincher for me though is probably the sevy1 BoV combo that allows you to pop out POW 13 ashes to ashes and pow 15 immolations through his arc.
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Post by macdaddy on Jul 17, 2018 3:05:51 GMT
demonic pop and drop typically refers to a caster popping feat and dropping a caster. EG: Kreoss1 pops feat and proceeds to drop caster with explosions. You are just describing a typical ranged assasination run. Also rat 8 is fine but it’s way easier to miss than if thet arget were def5 and realistically you aren’t aiming. Sevvys bond with BoV lets the FIRST and only the first spell have +2 to attack and damage. So you get One super Spell and the rest are generic.
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blakeh1
Junior Strategist
Posts: 181
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Post by blakeh1 on Jul 17, 2018 19:38:08 GMT
using Sevvy1 is key when doing the pop and drops, as the added one is for ALL attack and damage rolls, meaning it counts for multi spray targets and collateral damage rolls as well CRA at 5 for skyhammers is 16 on base, 11 on collateral. The way CRA works on AoEs is that you take the base, half it, and then add the number of models, meaning 10 goes down to 5 then + 5 for the cra and + 1 more for Sevvy1 ^-^ The sunburst crew is important for girded and dug in units. Even if they do not receive blast damage, they are still lit on fire. I have a list that involves 2 full units of skyhammers and 2 sunburst crews that I originally just made for shits and giggles. Turns out it's really effective against factions like Cygnar, which likes to use high def spams, ranged attacks, and light jacks. I think you mean Sevi0. Pop n Drop is Kreoss1's thing, so you would only have access to Sevi0. Don't discount Malekus Pop 'n Drop. Run arc node, Move Malekus, Feat, Scourge, shoot with Reckoners, Sunburst Crew and any other fire damage types. Your not going to pull it off against anyone unless they are not paying attention, but the threat is there
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Post by greytemplar on Jul 17, 2018 20:20:26 GMT
Main issue with that is that he wants to go first so he can Scourge and feat, but he also wants to go after the jacks so they're in range so he can use Open Fire.
Just illustrates how much of a mess Malekus is. A package of good tricks that adds up to a poor performance overall.
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blakeh1
Junior Strategist
Posts: 181
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Post by blakeh1 on Jul 17, 2018 20:40:56 GMT
He doesn't really have the FOC anyway for Open Fire. I think you are better off arcing Immolation instead.
Spend 4 to cast Scourge, +1 to boost to hit unless you can get the arc node close enough to assure you don't drift off the target, with a Wrack that leaves him 3 FOC
Immolation boosted damage, then 3 Reckoner boosted damage shots (or 2 Reckoners and Eye Of Truth) and 2 Sunburst Cannon shots should end most casters. Warlocks could be hard to handle unless they left themselves low on transfers
That is 1 POW 12 at 4 dice for damage, 3 POW 14's rolling 4 dice for damage and two POW 15s at 3 dice for damage
Or you could skip the Immolation to leave his upkeeps in play if you don't want to go all in and have a backup plan or you worry about missing the Scourge against a really high DEF caster
Granted, the whole assassination can be prevented so you shouldn't build around that one trick, but it does pose a viable threat that your opponent must play around
Much like Feora's Engine Of Destruction. You can see it coming from a mile away, but it creates a "no go" zone of sorts
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Post by greytemplar on Jul 17, 2018 21:09:01 GMT
Well he would, if Open Fire was cost 1 like it should be. Scourge is also too expensive IMO. It should be cost 3. Or if that would make Denny too strong give him another KD spell.
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blakeh1
Junior Strategist
Posts: 181
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Post by blakeh1 on Jul 17, 2018 21:34:57 GMT
Well he would, if Open Fire was cost 1 like it should be. Scourge is also too expensive IMO. It should be cost 3. Or if that would make Denny too strong give him another KD spell. Didn't Denny lose Scourge? As far as Open Fire, its one of those spells that seem much better on paper until you realize the order of operations stunts you need to do to use it as well as the cost of it Actually, one of the best uses I find with it apart from an extra range attack early on in the game is getting that extra melee attack against something that you failed to finish off when you ran out of FOC on your jack Open Fire at 1 FOC would be amazing
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Post by greytemplar on Jul 17, 2018 21:46:25 GMT
Denny3 still has Scourge, unless I missed that change in the last CID.
The way I see it, Open Fire seems to be intended to be the middle ground between Jackhammer(cost 1, melee attack only, unlimited casting) and Broadside(cost 3, each model in BG makes 1 ranged attack, once per activation).
The issue is that it is too restricted to make it worth cost 2.
It either needs to be unlimited castings on the same model OR be cost 1 and limited to once per turn per model.
Malakus needs to be more focused on being a ranged caster. Really he should trade Scourge for Hot Shot or Open Fire for Broadside.
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Post by josephkerr on Jul 17, 2018 23:32:35 GMT
Denny3 still has Scourge, unless I missed that change in the last CID. The way I see it, Open Fire seems to be intended to be the middle ground between Jackhammer(cost 1, melee attack only, unlimited casting) and Broadside(cost 3, each model in BG makes 1 ranged attack, once per activation). The issue is that it is too restricted to make it worth cost 2. It either needs to be unlimited castings on the same model OR be cost 1 and limited to once per turn per model. Malakus needs to be more focused on being a ranged caster. Really he should trade Scourge for Hot Shot or Open Fire for Broadside. Ravyn is getting Open Fire with her feat and Snipe. She’ll probably throw an Open Fire every round. It’s Malekus kit that makes Open Fire a bad spell as opposed to the cost or the spell itself.
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Post by mydnight on Jul 18, 2018 1:52:14 GMT
Cygnar would love open fire what with defender, thunderhead, avenger, hurricane and stormwall. Open Fire also seems decent on PoM colossal? It would be okay on a vanqusiher if PP ever decides to 'fix' it
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Post by macdaddy on Jul 18, 2018 3:14:20 GMT
Cygnar would love open fire what with defender, thunderhead, avenger, hurricane and stormwall. Open Fire also seems decent on PoM colossal? It would be okay on a vanqusiher if PP ever decides to 'fix' it The issue is the rat 5 with little way to fix outside of flare and KD. (Sevvy0 helps a bit with this) Vanquisher would be great open fire target with his sexy Auto fire AOE. Interestingly enough, the CiD Judicator would love the extra HoF Spray.
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Post by greytemplar on Jul 18, 2018 21:38:44 GMT
It’s all if you have ranged buffs or not.
I suspect Malekus was designed before the choir hit buff was removed.
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demonic
Junior Strategist
Posts: 649
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Post by demonic on Jul 21, 2018 1:51:33 GMT
every faction is purposely lacking in specific areas. We are a nuke'm and duke'm sort of faction. You bomb them from afar with inaccurate shots until you can engage them and negate them from doing... well... just about anything. The key to the faction is maximizing both aspects.
With the deliverer Arms Master we can give the sunburst crew arcing fire to ignore all non-terrain LoS. It's also NOT inaccurate so a small hit buff is all it needs to spread chaos. If you design a list with little nuking capabilities, spending the 5 points for the sunburst crew is worth it if you plan on an attrition war against an infantry focused faction. With the changes to the Indictor, it's quickly becoming named as the most OP denial piece in our kit, especially when combined with the book. A full denial aspect as well as a paladin package would both love the addition if it could fit. I'm not too sure about an exemplar focused list, but if you are using it for mainly the blessed tool kit then you have a great piece for trying to take out those pesky ranged units that love to carve into our jacks before we can take advantage of it.
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Post by macdaddy on Jul 21, 2018 11:36:47 GMT
Well I’m hoping the Indictor is not the 8” bubble. Really hope the decs are smart anough to drop it back to 5”
I do think it would be nice to have another rat fixer for our jacks outside of flats and Eye of Menoth. Mallekus would be the caster to put it on.
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