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Post by maplewhisky on Jan 5, 2018 23:35:26 GMT
Regarding Def15 Griffina with free Elusive, Kaya3 can have a Def17 Griffons with free Elusive and Repo. See where I'm getting? Don't get me wrong, I myself prefer Una2 as well, she asks a harder question. I lost with Una against Orion, it left me traumatized, couldn't do a thing this game. I do think Kaya would be a better drop due to fog of war and soothing song. Kaya is also better into Haley3, Lylyth3, Twins, Nemo3, Issyria and probably some more, it depends on a build really, not only the caster itself. Generally, if your opponent has a way to ignore stealth, has magic attacks and high accuracy, you're screwed with Una. But barring legion those are casters I'm looking to play my offlist into! With regards to legion specifically I'm not 100% sure what I'd like to play, they're a hard time for Circle in general and I'm sad to hear you say Una struggles too as I haven't tried that yet (the only caster I've played vs them is Wurmwood). Krueger was pretty good in my experience vs your kind of general legion in mk2, but I feel like he might get flattened by a few specific gunlines, particularly with enough guns that out-range Windstorm. A lot of Legion 2 lists looked like Cygnar drop / Cryx drop pre the Haley2/Ghost Fleet nerfs, and in my experience neither of them were particularly well optimised for Circle. I need more games against them, nobody (but me) plays them around here.
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Post by Lord_Randall on Jan 6, 2018 0:52:35 GMT
maplewhisky: if you want to skew a little bit Krueger2 for the Haley 3 match, play a pair of Guardians. She can't soften them at range beacause most of her shooting (longunners excluded) is short ranged, and she need to commit heavily for deal whit them. The key for beating haley3 is force her to come at you.
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Post by maplewhisky on Jan 6, 2018 1:20:13 GMT
How exactly do Guardians force her to come to you though? My current Krueger2 list (aimed mostly at Haley3) is: Krueger2 -Woldwrath -Woldwarden -Woldwyrd Lynus & Edrea Sentry Stone Sentry Stone Shifting Stones Shifting Stones Blackclad Wayfarer Blackclad Wayfarer Blackclad Stoneshaper Gallows Grove Celestial Fulcrum 75 Idea is blow away the clouds, shoot up some stuff, feat, Windstorm, do it again next turn. Not particularly complicated but it should work. Lightning Storm & the Woldwrath aoe is a lot of area denial vs her infantry too. I have a couple variations, mostly playing around with the battlegroup / Fulcrum. I agree making her come to you is important, but I don't see how Guardians particularly achieve that.
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Post by maplewhisky on Jan 6, 2018 21:40:02 GMT
Coming in with a quick update (and to further derail Tomasz's thread). I played a game with the above list vs Haley3 Gravediggers. In what I understand is a fairly standard build? Big unit of infantry, Trencher Longgunners, Thorn, Ironclad, Grenadier, bunch of trencher solos, Ragman. Turn 1 he walked up and clouded. I put Krueger really far up with 2 forests in front of him and everything hid behind windstorm, except some mannikins which I put 2 lightning storms into and a Woldwrath shot, making a big wall of "you can't go here" to try and disrupt the cloud wall / force him to clump up. That worked! So in his turn he clumped up a bit, pushed past as best he could, killed off the mannikins I'd given him, took a couple potshots and put 9 damage into my Battle Engine. In my turn 2 I had a hard decision of which side of the cloud wall to dissipate, I ended up going with the flank that had my Wrath and Warden on it instead of my Engine. A mannikin got dropped near the cloudwall, shot in the butt by Edrea with her AoE touching 2 clouds which disappeared. Then I got to just rain down lightning hell from the Wrath and Warden with some mannikin sprays to finish off pesky feign death models who toughed. On the other side the Engine managed to get somewhat past the cloud wall and put a few potshots into the Trencher Long Gunners, the big gun deviated onto an Express Team and the gunner exploded to a freak boost, and the lightning gun and some mannikins put away a few more Trencher Infantry & some Long Gunners. Then Krueger rocked up, dropped a Lightning Storm on a Mannikin, feated and pushed everything (sans echoes) way back and then Wind Stormed behind his 2 forests, scoring 2 CPs. I took a picture here, but didn't for the rest of the game as it was mostly cleanup from there. The Woldwrath being able to knock down the echoes despite not being magical is a big boon, as later on in the game he got to punch a shifting stone, knocking down a whole bunch of trenchers and Haley Past who then had to deal with a very angry Wyrd! Basically, if anyone is like me and struggling for a Haley3 drop I'd recommend the above list. (The picture may not be so useful if you're not Vassal literate, but hopefully you can get the jist from the position of Blue & Green roughly what's going on!)
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demonic
Junior Strategist
Posts: 649
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Post by demonic on Jan 7, 2018 0:58:44 GMT
both shifting and sentry stones are immobile objects and, thus, cannot be slammed, moved, or placed. On the other hand, all wolds are magical.
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Post by maplewhisky on Jan 7, 2018 2:53:00 GMT
I'm not 100% sure what you're referring to or replying to but go read your cards.
Shifting stones can be placed by whatever as long as it's not placing them out of formation (as per the rules applying to every model in the game).
Sentry Stones can only be placed by Strange Growth.
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demonic
Junior Strategist
Posts: 649
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Post by demonic on Jan 7, 2018 4:51:42 GMT
so you shifted them? Shifting stones cannot be moved, only placed. You cannot move a shifting stone through a throw, slam, or push.
I didn't realize that they made the woldwrath non-magical. It should be something to bring up, though, considering that every other wold's attacks all have magical; why is the garg the odd one out?
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Post by maplewhisky on Jan 7, 2018 12:33:18 GMT
so you shifted them? Shifting stones cannot be moved, only placed. You cannot move a shifting stone through a throw, slam, or push. I didn't realize that they made the woldwrath non-magical. It should be something to bring up, though, considering that every other wold's attacks all have magical; why is the garg the odd one out? ...yes? Why are you asking me this? Could you show me somewhere where I implied otherwise? I already know all of this.
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Post by musza on Jan 8, 2018 9:59:52 GMT
I'm also curious, not sure what demonic is trying to say. demonic, do you know Woldwrath has an Earth's Shaker? Great battle report and congrats on beating Haley3! I like your list and I'll probably try it one day. I myself played Krueger2 into cloud wall recently but had no tech to deny it. I will post a Video Battle Report of it soon.
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Post by maplewhisky on Jan 8, 2018 16:03:07 GMT
I'm also curious, not sure what demonic is trying to say. demonic , do you know Woldwrath has an Earth's Shaker? Great battle report and congrats on beating Haley3! I like your list and I'll probably try it one day. I myself played Krueger2 into cloud wall recently but had no tech to deny it. I will post a Video Battle Report of it soon. Yeah with anti cloud wall tech and all the anti infantry I'm packing (2*Stones, Fulcrum & 3+ lightning AoEs is maybe a bit excessive...) it wasn't really much of a game, just me taking his toys off the table. But I'm fine with that, I hate Cygnar. I'm excited for your batrep! No cloudwall tech seems like it'd make the matchup a bit harder, but you can still at least make walls of lightning aoes to stop her advance dead. After playing more with Krueger I'm starting to think he likes sentry stones more than most any caster in our faction, simply because they let him -really- stand in dumb places with Wind Storm / Feat. Pushing Wind Storm a couple extra inches up the table is often super relevant, because you can often say "you either walk into the lightning aoes or aren't in the zones". Big fan. What's your current Kaya3 list? I'll give her the old college try today and see how she feels compared to Una.
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demonic
Junior Strategist
Posts: 649
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Post by demonic on Jan 8, 2018 20:19:45 GMT
oh, I see, attack the stone that is an auto hit to trigger the 4 inch aoe on high defensive targets without steady. Makes complete sense inside my head now x.x
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Post by musza on Jan 9, 2018 0:22:06 GMT
I'm also curious, not sure what demonic is trying to say. demonic , do you know Woldwrath has an Earth's Shaker? Great battle report and congrats on beating Haley3! I like your list and I'll probably try it one day. I myself played Krueger2 into cloud wall recently but had no tech to deny it. I will post a Video Battle Report of it soon. Yeah with anti cloud wall tech and all the anti infantry I'm packing (2*Stones, Fulcrum & 3+ lightning AoEs is maybe a bit excessive...) it wasn't really much of a game, just me taking his toys off the table. But I'm fine with that, I hate Cygnar. I'm excited for your batrep! No cloudwall tech seems like it'd make the matchup a bit harder, but you can still at least make walls of lightning aoes to stop her advance dead. After playing more with Krueger I'm starting to think he likes sentry stones more than most any caster in our faction, simply because they let him -really- stand in dumb places with Wind Storm / Feat. Pushing Wind Storm a couple extra inches up the table is often super relevant, because you can often say "you either walk into the lightning aoes or aren't in the zones". Big fan. What's your current Kaya3 list? I'll give her the old college try today and see how she feels compared to Una. Yeah, I myself need to play more Krueger2 to see what he likes. I haven't play him until recently and my list need some work. I use double Fulcrum and I max our on 11 fury with my warbeasts which is far from optimal. I'll switch back to a single Fulcrum and add a unit of Sentry Stone & Mannikins, Bog Trog Mist Speaker (for the sweet eyeless sight) or Lynus & Edrea (great idea man, thanks for sharing!) and a third Wyrd... or replace Wyrds with Wights and see how it plays out. my Kaya3 list is: Circle Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] Call of the Wild (Kaya 3) Kaya the Wildheart [+27] - Gorax Rager [7] - Gorax Rager [7] - Pureblood Warpwolf [17] - Scarsfell Griffon [8] - Scarsfell Griffon [8] - Scarsfell Griffon [8] - Shadowhorn Satyr [12] - Warpwolf Stalker [19] - Wild Argus [7] - Wild Argus [7] - Druid Wilder [0(4)] Blackclad Wayfarer [0(4)] Blackclad Wayfarer [0(4)] Shifting Stones [0(3)] Swamp Gobbers Bellows Crew [2] The only thing I change from time to time is replacing a Wild Argus for a Winter Argus and Bellows Crew for a Chef. I still haven't decided which variant I like better... not that it makes a huge difference BTW. I'm uploading the video tomorrow, it's my first one so it took me a bit to put together and write some background music for it.
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demonic
Junior Strategist
Posts: 649
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Post by demonic on Jan 9, 2018 2:16:53 GMT
the consensus in our group tends to see Kreugar2 as the ultimate Cygnar drop with a bones army. With Windstorm, he negates ranged tactics, rebuke limits one of the enemy units from doing any serious damage, lightning storm with 3 casts (like from geomancy) is the exact same thing as Kreugar1's feat. He has gallows to bring important pieces within the killing range of your slow ass models, telekinesis for tricks, and his feat... dear god his feat is a scenario winning god.
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Post by musza on Jan 9, 2018 14:23:06 GMT
Here it is! My first Boosted Rolls series video batrep. Kruger2 fights agains King of Nothing, enjoy!
BTW. I'd love to hear some feedback from you guys. Do you like the video or not. Would you like me to speed it up a bit or maybe slow down, do you like the music in the background, what would you like to see in the future episodes etc.
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Post by maplewhisky on Jan 9, 2018 17:35:21 GMT
Enjoyed the report! I think the format is good, overlay is great! Just turn down the music but I see the people on YT are telling you that already.
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