crow
Junior Strategist
Posts: 310
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Post by crow on Nov 14, 2017 16:51:36 GMT
With how often you suggest them, it's caused me to spend a lot of time trying to figure out if I really am missing something.... Only thing I've ever kinda seen is you use them with Fiona, make one an ark node, hit a jack with it, place it in the back ark, and then sling spells like mad at enemy caster. When ur opponent kills it the following turn, simply recast the spell, then next turn repeat. Course it's easier said then done, and you'd probably be better off picking something more sturdy to be your arc node.
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boozy
Junior Strategist
Posts: 429
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Post by boozy on Nov 28, 2017 8:00:50 GMT
Swamp gobber river raiders make decent tree food for Wurmwood.
Honestly, I think their real value is being three solos that can contest with DEF 14 and Prowl for 4pts. If you can ever get them to do something offensively, great. I dream of an edit to Black Spot so I can put them in a Skarre2 list and watch the hilarity ensue.
As contesters though they have real value. Also if you're up against DEF 10 warbeasts that can pummel the crap out of anything (Skorne biguns), then the STR debuff is nice. Otherwise feed them to the Tree.
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Choco
Junior Strategist
Gorten, best feet in the game.
Posts: 571
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Post by Choco on Nov 28, 2017 17:36:03 GMT
Swamp gobber river raiders make decent tree food for Wurmwood. Honestly, I think their real value is being three solos that can contest with DEF 14 and Prowl for 4pts. If you can ever get them to do something offensively, great. I dream of an edit to Black Spot so I can put them in a Skarre2 list and watch the hilarity ensue. As contesters though they have real value. Also if you're up against DEF 10 warbeasts that can pummel the crap out of anything (Skorne biguns), then the STR debuff is nice. Otherwise feed them to the Tree. If I remember correctly they are hilarious with Helga on her feat turn.
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Post by Azuresun on Nov 29, 2017 23:58:35 GMT
Why would you be stupid enough to leave them somewhere that they can be easily killed? If your playing the infantry heavy army,they'll have an extremely hard time waddling through all the bods. Since I started playing in August,grog and doc have survived a lot more than they've died,and that's with the opponent knowing what they do Sprays and wandering blasts (and arcing fire, models with Acrobatics, guns on hills, etc) will pick the solos out pretty fast. It's not always the case, but there are a lot of lists against which they just can't do anything before they get blown away. For the OP, it depends on what you've got to work with, but I'd recommend Press Ganger units over Sea Dogs. Innate Tough, they can replenish themselves against infantry, and innate Advance Deployment helps with the victory condition for a pirates list (get in their face as soon as possible!)
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Xintas
Junior Strategist
Posts: 824
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Post by Xintas on Nov 30, 2017 14:45:25 GMT
I've always had a bit of an "Office Space" moment with the sea dogs. "What would you say...you do here?"
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Post by plungingforward on Nov 30, 2017 22:26:55 GMT
I've always had a bit of an "Office Space" moment with the sea dogs. "What would you say...you do here?" "We play CoI, where two attacks each and +1R mean we're pretty darn good en masse. Just don't be afraid to go through your hand..." But, yeah, I use them all the time in Warmachine (they were one-piece models and I'm allergic to metal glue, so rather than have my friend build me 30+ steelheads I chose pirates) and even at their best one gets the feeling that investing in something else would serve one better. Just so long as "something else" isn't high shields...
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Xintas
Junior Strategist
Posts: 824
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Post by Xintas on Dec 1, 2017 14:22:36 GMT
I've always had a bit of an "Office Space" moment with the sea dogs. "What would you say...you do here?" "We play CoI, where two attacks each and +1R mean we're pretty darn good en masse. Just don't be afraid to go through your hand..." But, yeah, I use them all the time in Warmachine (they were one-piece models and I'm allergic to metal glue, so rather than have my friend build me 30+ steelheads I chose pirates) and even at their best one gets the feeling that investing in something else would serve one better. Just so long as "something else" isn't high shields... Really good point! I keep forgetting about them when it comes time to make my CoI lists. Further investigation required...
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boozy
Junior Strategist
Posts: 429
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Post by boozy on Dec 1, 2017 20:37:04 GMT
This may be an old observation, but when discussing Pirates and their viability, shouldn't they be looked at with Gorten?
Doc Killingsworth goes a lot farther with no Knowckdown, and can be protected behind a wall with Gorten and Shield Guard. If Grogspar is within Gorten's control, he acts like a 7" expansion bubble. The full boat with no knockdow Tough is pretty good I think, outside of Grievous Wounds.
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Post by gobber on Dec 1, 2017 22:13:26 GMT
Yeah Gorten+Pressgangers is great. Assuming Rockbottom has already made his way into the list, I've also been loving the Devil's Shadow Mutineers with him. Feat turn tends to leave massive clumps of def debuffed enemies which Mar can berserk and overtake through. Some combination of PG's, Aiyana, DSM, and Eliminators and the cheap dwarven jacks makes it really easy to fit five advance moving heavies
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shoe
Junior Strategist
Posts: 706
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Post by shoe on Dec 1, 2017 22:25:31 GMT
This may be an old observation, but when discussing Pirates and their viability, shouldn't they be looked at with Gorten? Doc Killingsworth goes a lot farther with no Knowckdown, and can be protected behind a wall with Gorten and Shield Guard. If Grogspar is within Gorten's control, he acts like a 7" expansion bubble. The full boat with no knockdow Tough is pretty good I think, outside of Grievous Wounds. i played like 40 or 50 pirates with Gorton back when Mark 3 first came out thinking that would be pretty neato and then wormwodd kill them all in 3 turns! never did it again I was so sad
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boozy
Junior Strategist
Posts: 429
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Post by boozy on Dec 1, 2017 23:24:10 GMT
This may be an old observation, but when discussing Pirates and their viability, shouldn't they be looked at with Gorten? Doc Killingsworth goes a lot farther with no Knowckdown, and can be protected behind a wall with Gorten and Shield Guard. If Grogspar is within Gorten's control, he acts like a 7" expansion bubble. The full boat with no knockdow Tough is pretty good I think, outside of Grievous Wounds. i played like 40 or 50 pirates with Gorton back when Mark 3 first came out thinking that would be pretty neato and then wormwodd kill them all in 3 turns! never did it again I was so sad I was thinking only 29 models. Press Gangers, DSM, Sea Dogs+Walls, Hawk, Doc, Rockbottom, Bloody Brad Pitt, and Grogspur. Two Avalanchers and Rockrams to polish.
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shoe
Junior Strategist
Posts: 706
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Post by shoe on Dec 2, 2017 14:22:00 GMT
he get em all in 2 turns then!!!
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Xintas
Junior Strategist
Posts: 824
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Post by Xintas on Dec 5, 2017 15:09:06 GMT
he get em all in 2 turns then!!! Inb4 two list pairing.
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Post by gobber on Dec 6, 2017 3:47:12 GMT
Early mk3 wurmwood under the old steamroller rules isn't a good reference point anyway. Between the gallows groves, sentries/hellmouth, and soul collection that list can casually ignore steady supertough and is ideally suited to counter infantry swarms. Any list that relies on a mechanic like tough is going to have vulnerabilities. Gorten does not like dropping into masters of war, band of heroes, or mortality casters but the list is definitely worth playing around with. Everything's so cheap that it makes for a decent attrition list, while all the AD jamming people out of zones followed up by feating them out once they finally break through can make for a good scenario strategy.
Not investing too heavily in pirates makes a big difference as they don't really do heavy lifting themselves. If it takes two turns for your opponent to remove 28 pts of pressgangers (2 units+doc) they've probably done their job; the five advance moving dwarf heavies on top of that do the heavy lifting and you've got another quarter of your list left for stuff like eliminators.
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