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Post by paradox on Nov 14, 2017 19:16:11 GMT
I dont want paladin bricks per se, but elite cadres or leaderships would help. Vilmon is a good start. Righteous Vengeance elite cadre is good. Especially in FM. Retaliatory Strike leadership was good, even if leadership isnt as hot as cadre, its better than B2B Cornerstone. Id rather it hand out Steady + Sturdy than Girded though, if it has to be defensive. It lets paladins be a sheltering wall without B2B requirements/traps.
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Provengreil
Junior Strategist
Choir Kills: 12
Posts: 850
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Post by Provengreil on Nov 14, 2017 23:25:00 GMT
I'm firmly of the opinion that the best way to buff durst is simply to use the find/replace tool on his card, with "b2b" and 2 inches". Paladins would be similar.
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Post by dazzla on Nov 17, 2017 20:18:25 GMT
Compared with the utility, offensive output of other solos and even models in units the Palladin is way behind. One option would be to give the palladin 8 boxes, increase ARM by 2. I definitely believe an additional attack is necessary or a sizable increase in the p and s in its single attack.
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Post by macdaddy on Nov 18, 2017 23:02:39 GMT
I'm firmly of the opinion that the best way to buff durst is simply to use the find/replace tool on his card, with "b2b" and 2 inches". Paladins would be similar. Yeah my biggest issue with durst in SR17 is just how hard it is to trigger b2b with the battlegroup and still spread out for the bigger scenarios
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Provengreil
Junior Strategist
Choir Kills: 12
Posts: 850
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Post by Provengreil on Nov 18, 2017 23:18:19 GMT
I'm firmly of the opinion that the best way to buff durst is simply to use the find/replace tool on his card, with "b2b" and 2 inches". Paladins would be similar. Yeah my biggest issue with durst in SR17 is just how hard it is to trigger b2b with the battlegroup and still spread out for the bigger scenarios I've been saying the same since we fist saw the scenarios. I love me some defense, hence picking this faction, but durst is waaaaayyyy too bricky for this scenario packet.
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regleant
Junior Strategist
Sometimes things go right
Posts: 267
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Post by regleant on Dec 29, 2017 7:23:37 GMT
I just realized that Faithful Masses doesn’t get the Battle Engine. I guess Paladins aren’t holy enough to get the rolling church? Made me sad when building my list.
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Post by correlion on Dec 29, 2017 8:06:31 GMT
It's because VoJ is a scrutator BE.
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Post by paradox on Dec 29, 2017 15:16:47 GMT
It's because VoJ is a scrutator BE. And thats because of the BE CID, which came shortly after EI dropped in NQ, and players complaining it wasnt available in EI.
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Fire Step
Junior Strategist
Everyday I'm Wrastlin'
Posts: 334
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Post by Fire Step on Jan 3, 2018 10:38:15 GMT
Yeah my biggest issue with durst in SR17 is just how hard it is to trigger b2b with the battlegroup and still spread out for the bigger scenarios I've been saying the same since we fist saw the scenarios. I love me some defense, hence picking this faction, but durst is waaaaayyyy too bricky for this scenario packet. I've actually found that with heavier battle groups in faithful masses (3+ crusaders) there's a lot less reliance on bulwark - they're there to just absorb damage from b2b champions, paladins and idrians.
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Post by chillychinaman on Jan 3, 2018 17:12:00 GMT
I've been saying the same since we fist saw the scenarios. I love me some defense, hence picking this faction, but durst is waaaaayyyy too bricky for this scenario packet. I've actually found that with heavier battle groups in faithful masses (3+ crusaders) there's a lot less reliance on bulwark - they're there to just absorb damage from b2b champions, paladins and idrians. I'm not doubting the defensive power that Durst brings, but isn't the issue that it severely hampers the manueverability, and thus the ability to score, in the current Steamroller ruleset?
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khobai
Junior Strategist
Posts: 108
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Post by khobai on Jan 5, 2018 4:15:24 GMT
Paladins should function as defensive anchor points within our army. This is how they should be changed:
Durst -> gains girded. gains cornerstone (this model and models in B2B cant be knocked down, pushed, or slammed)
Paladin of the Wall -> gains girded. gains +1 base ARM. stone and mortar stance now gives cornerstone and impervious flesh instead of +5 ARM.
Vilmon -> gains girded. gains 2" reach and rapid strike. gains leadership shield guard (paladins gain shield guard).
Champion -> gains cornerstone when mounted (instead of steady/sturdy). gains stone and mortar stance when dismounted, gains leadership righteous vengeance (paladins gain righteous vengeance).
That could be solved by replacing Bulwark with a new spell that gives Cornerstone to everything in his CTRL range (or just give him Solid Ground maybe).
And make Bulwark into a passive ability instead (battlegroup models that are in durst's CTRL and B2B with other battlegroup models gain +2 DEF).
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Post by chillychinaman on Jan 5, 2018 5:51:25 GMT
What is the rule cornerstone? I can't seem to find it anywhere.
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khobai
Junior Strategist
Posts: 108
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Post by khobai on Jan 5, 2018 6:58:49 GMT
cornerstone was an old rule mk2 durst had
durst and models in B2B with him couldnt be knocked down, pushed, placed, made stationary, etc..
although the version I would give paladins would be a bit weaker (it wouldnt prevent place or stationary)
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Provengreil
Junior Strategist
Choir Kills: 12
Posts: 850
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Post by Provengreil on Jan 5, 2018 12:59:02 GMT
Before anything more changes on durst, I think PP needs to try the fix they had with the merc jack(name escapes me) that has the ship cannon gun that needs a model next to it to fire: find/replace on his card "b2b" -> "within 1 inch".
It would solve so many little issues.
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