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Post by xxjedinitexx on Oct 25, 2017 17:20:08 GMT
I'd like to preface this with the fact that I've never actually played into Ghost Fleet before.
I'm starting to prep for a team tournament in a few months and if the WTC is any indication, Cryx and specifically Ghost Fleet are going to be a major concern. I know a lot of Grymkin lists can bring the tools necessary to deal with this matchup but I'm specifically curious about the Heretic list Patrick Dunford took to the WTC. He dropped the list versus Ghost Fleet in round 3 and won. The same list was also featured on Druid's Dice and was dropped into Ghost Fleet again for a win.
Can anyone explain to me what I'm missing about this list that makes it a viable drop? I get that the Heretic himself is resistant to Denny1's debuffs (aside from feat) and that the 4 heavies RFP but even with those, my gut tells me that there are not enough activations to clear out all the ghost dudes and the main things that would kill large amounts of guys, the frightmare's blasts and the rattler, don't rfp or have magical weapons.
If anyone here could let me in on the secret, I'd greatly appreciate it. Below is the list for anyone not familiar.
Grymkin Army - 75 / 75 points
[Theme] Dark Menagerie
(Heretic 1) The Heretic [+28]
- Cage Rager [14]
- Cage Rager [14]
- Crabbit [0(n/a)]
- Crabbit [0(n/a)]
- Frightmare [9]
- Frightmare [9]
- Gorehound [6]
- Rattler [8]
- Skin & Moans [15]
- Skin & Moans [15]
Gremlin Swarm [0(3)]
Gremlin Swarm [0(3)]
Gremlin Swarm [0(3)]
Gremlin Swarm [0(3)]
Death Knell [13]
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Post by LoS Jaden on Oct 26, 2017 5:33:14 GMT
I'd like to preface this with the fact that I've never actually played into Ghost Fleet before.
I'm starting to prep for a team tournament in a few months and if the WTC is any indication, Cryx and specifically Ghost Fleet are going to be a major concern. I know a lot of Grymkin lists can bring the tools necessary to deal with this matchup but I'm specifically curious about the Heretic list Patrick Dunford took to the WTC. He dropped the list versus Ghost Fleet in round 3 and won. The same list was also featured on Druid's Dice and was dropped into Ghost Fleet again for a win.
Can anyone explain to me what I'm missing about this list that makes it a viable drop? I get that the Heretic himself is resistant to Denny1's debuffs (aside from feat) and that the 4 heavies RFP but even with those, my gut tells me that there are not enough activations to clear out all the ghost dudes and the main things that would kill large amounts of guys, the frightmare's blasts and the rattler, don't rfp or have magical weapons.
If anyone here could let me in on the secret, I'd greatly appreciate it. Below is the list for anyone not familiar.
Grymkin Army - 75 / 75 points
[Theme] Dark Menagerie
(Heretic 1) The Heretic [+28]
- Cage Rager [14]
- Cage Rager [14]
- Crabbit [0(n/a)]
- Crabbit [0(n/a)]
- Frightmare [9]
- Frightmare [9]
- Gorehound [6]
- Rattler [8]
- Skin & Moans [15]
- Skin & Moans [15]
Gremlin Swarm [0(3)]
Gremlin Swarm [0(3)]
Gremlin Swarm [0(3)]
Gremlin Swarm [0(3)]
Death Knell [13]
Well I've been called out, guess it's only polite to respond  This list has a couple very strong tools into ghost fleet. First of all, the Heretic is not going to die to basically anything with proper positioning and a Crabbit. His minimum defensive stats against the list are 13/15 which is really good into RAT 4 guns. He's going to struggle to break armor on your heavies on feat turn without committing the Wraith Engine, which then makes the Skin and Moans too high DEF to shoot at. He can't reliably land a parasite thanks to Arcane Vortex. Frightmare's and Rattler can both get magical weapons from the Cage Rager (which is nice, and the Cage Rager has innate magical weapons), and two frightmares plus a couple spells from the Heretic = dead Denny outside of her feat turn. The Gorehound with Wraithbane is fantastic for going in and killing Blackbane, a Pistol Wraith, or the Hellslinger Phantom. Finally, the Gremlin Swarms can serve two purposes - they can block charge landing zones or contest on Denny's feat turn by sitting way away from the zones and apparating up and running. If the Wraith engine every comes in, they can also kill half of it on average ish dice. Finally, Shroud and Sacrifice are absurd into this matchup. Those two arcana make this game a game. |
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Post by ashurbanipal on Oct 26, 2017 13:01:42 GMT
Solid list.
However, without thread range extension you should keep an eye on scenario. If it's a fast one and Denny starts you are not that that good i guess (not an unwinnable match, but still... not good against a smart Fleet player).
Also, being able to fight the Fleet is not enough, as you usually want to be able to have a game against your opponents second/third list aswell. Of course the Heretic is a powerhouse, but his lack of thread range extension hurts pretty much.
I think of the Old Witch 3 in Menagerie to play against Cryx and others. It's just work-in-progress brainstorming and I would be happy about a discussion.
Of course losing Arcana hurts, but playing around Sacrifice and Shroud (in Menagerie) is possible for smart enemies with the right lists (remember: I also want to take other matchups than the Fleet) anyway.
With Windstorm and Boundless Charge OW3 offers excellent support for her army, while standing on Def14 + Dodge (Crabbit animus) Arm21 (Death Knell) 20 Boxes is pretty good. Her Abilities/Feat offer a lot of options for threating enemy beasts or casters/locks.
My current lists lookes like this:
Grymkin Army - 75 / 75 points
[Theme] Dark Menagerie
(Old Witch 3) Zevanna Agha, The Fate Keeper [+27]
- Cage Rager [14]
- Crabbit [0(n/a)]
- Frightmare [9]
- Gorehound [6]
- Gorehound [6]
- Rattler [8]
- Skin & Moans [15]
- Skin & Moans [15]
Gremlin Swarm [0(3)]
Gremlin Swarm [0(3)]
Gremlin Swarm [0(3)]
Lady Karianna Rose [4]
Dread Rots (max) [12]
Death Knell [13]
As she is horribly hard to play, i still have to practice a lot though...
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Post by xxjedinitexx on Oct 26, 2017 16:16:44 GMT
LoS Jaden Thanks a lot for the response. That all makes sense to me, I actually forgot about the magic weapons from Wraithbane for a bit there. ashurbanipal Thanks for the suggestions. I'm super excited for Old Witch actually. Unfortunately the past few months I haven't been able to purchase anything but 2 core boxes and I'm starting to worry I won't have time to test a bunch of different lists and then play whatever I decide enough to be good at it, hence the (mostly) shameless netlisting. After this tournament OW3 is at the top of my list to try out.
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Post by tseungtsu on Oct 29, 2017 19:29:29 GMT
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Post by potato on Nov 22, 2017 19:37:47 GMT
Just wanted to say that I am just starting to get into Grymkin and your blog has been a great source of info and ideas. Keep it up! |
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