unded
Junior Strategist
Posts: 760
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Post by unded on Oct 13, 2017 15:02:17 GMT
I like bone grinders for souls (don't have any yet though), but I'm specifically looking at the newly-promised combo of Fulcrum + Lynus and Edrea, which would not allow bone grinders in a theme.
-und_ed
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Post by macdaddy on Oct 13, 2017 15:03:30 GMT
Posse aren't terrible, they are comparable to Skinwalkers, trading extra tankiness for an extra attack. Posse also currently look like they will probably be getting cheaper and have their re-roll prayer affect any missed attack instead of just against living models. I wish Circle had more buffs that could affect out-of-faction models, if we did I would probably bring Posse all the time. They might be pretty good Sac Pawn models in Masters. The issue is then you really are not using them for their intended purpose. unded If only secret masters allowed 2 merc/minion units and solos. That would be awesome...
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unded
Junior Strategist
Posts: 760
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Post by unded on Oct 13, 2017 16:29:21 GMT
I wish. I actually need 3 solos - I really want to get some use out of Alten Ashley + 2 Efaarit scouts.
Then again, I'll probably just play out of theme. Legion and Circle have such meh themes, I really don't feel much playing out of theme.
Cryx, on the other hand, has amazing themes. I feel like a kid in a candy store with my Cryx right now.
-und_ed
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Post by macdaddy on Oct 13, 2017 16:42:14 GMT
I wish. I actually need 3 solos - I really want to get some use out of Alten Ashley + 2 Efaarit scouts. Then again, I'll probably just play out of theme. Legion and Circle have such meh themes, I really don't feel much playing out of theme. Cryx, on the other hand, has amazing themes. I feel like a kid in a candy store with my Cryx right now. -und_ed Yeah, Honestly our themes are pretty lackluster. Not sure why... Oh lord...cryx...what did you guys do to the devs to get such wonderful things/ Was there some ritual sacrifice or did you plant someone to give Soles some TLC and whisper sweet nothings about theme ideas?
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unded
Junior Strategist
Posts: 760
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Post by unded on Oct 14, 2017 17:32:51 GMT
We've been supplying the Wills with a steady supply of pleasure thralls.
Remember, dead girls never say "no"!
-und_ed
P.S.
I actually feel like Cryx themes aren't OP, but are actually the gold standard that PP has just missed with the other factions. If you look back to the early spoilers (just before MKIII dropped), they promised radically different game-play dependant on themes, differences that make you view the toys you know in a new light. Cryx themes have achieved this in spades, now if only the other factions' themes would catch up.
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Post by mindwormjim on Oct 14, 2017 21:12:26 GMT
I don't know. I actually feel like Circle themes are generally around the ideal power level. They limit what models you can take but in return allow you to play those models in new ways and without invalidating non-theme lists. Devourer let's you start with corpses which is awesome, Wild Hunt gives you a great ambush unit, Bones makes it much easier to run constructs with casters who aren't Bradigus or Baldur, and Call helps you run huge beast packs by making them more fury efficient. Secret Masters SHOULD be about having a bunch of minion troops backed by Druids, it's just for some reason they only let you take one unit.
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Post by macdaddy on Oct 15, 2017 5:05:32 GMT
undedI think my issue is less with the themes being op, and more with 3 very specific casters that can abuse almost all of them. Particularly Coven and Skarre1. It also seems like the rest of the themes in just about every other faction are lagging behind in raw benefit power compared to cryx themes but I don’t think the themes themselves are OP. (Despite some of my initial reactions) I am actually kind of hoping Masters is our theme that is incomplete in model selection. If that’s the case we may be getting some new cool Blackclad models in the future. It would be so much better if it allowed us to double up on minions options though. And it would make the theme unique...
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unded
Junior Strategist
Posts: 760
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Post by unded on Oct 15, 2017 10:24:38 GMT
Where you say "abuse", I say "make great use of".
I love the fact that I can build very different lists with the Coven in different themes (I started Cryx back in MKII wanting to play 'jack-heavy Coven lists. They were very ineffectual, so I branched out a bit since then, but Black Industries now lets me return to my initial dream). I could also play them happily in the satyxis theme for a fast list, play double-soulhunters in infernal machines or even try a dark host bane-spam although honestly the coven seems wasted on a bane list. That versatility and significantly altered playstyle is precisely what themes are supposed to do.
I just want the same level of theme effects in my Legion and Circle now, because instead of being actively inspiring, the Legion and Circle themes feel more like shackles.
-und_ed
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Post by macdaddy on Oct 16, 2017 14:13:28 GMT
To be fair, I would much rather things be brought in line with say, protectorate who IMO has amazing internal balance and is where the rest of the game factions should be balance wise. (obviously there are discrepancies like the medium based infantry but for the most part protectorate has an incredible stable)
Making everything as powerful as coven, skarre 1, and denny ghost fleet would just turn things into 40K levels of power creep and that would make me a sad panda.
I still think the only bad circle theme is secret masters and wild hunt just needs some staying power. The tharn theme, bones, and call are all awesome and IMO pretty thematic. Now that minions are allowed in all those themes I think it helps us unlock them a little bit more.
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unded
Junior Strategist
Posts: 760
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Post by unded on Oct 16, 2017 16:27:14 GMT
I think you've got some pretty skewed notions of the Coven here Mac.
The coven have always been a good, middling-power caster in the Cryx stable. Versatile enough to see table-time, never a hard enough question that you have to build for them. Then MKIII hit, and the coven got an undisputable nerf.
I think you've just had some bad games against them. The Coven lists that are scaring folks are all ghost fleet, which has a lot more to do with ghost fleet than the Coven.
As for circle themes... ugh. So horribly limiting, none of them inspire you to want to use them. You pick them up as a grudge purchase because you don't want to play 12 points down. Think of Cryx themes as buying ice-cream - you actually want to use the theme, not just catch up on lost points. Circle and Legion themes are like buying insurance - nobody wants to do it, but you all know you kinda have to.
-und_ed
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