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Post by RamsesII on Mar 9, 2017 1:36:45 GMT
I honestly think you guys are overreacting. This is nothing like GW. I honestly think it was the best news I've ever heard when PP announced they were getting rid of a lot of junk in the official forums. All the forums were was a cess pool of nastiness and complaints. Everyone and their mother is a game designer and think they know Wmh better than PP does. I agree, there was a lot more negativity there. But there were much more reasonable things to try than carpet bombing such a big chunk of the forums. For example, identify the handful of forum warriors who are bringing the tone down by being toxic and aggressive while staying juuuust within the rules and ban them or send them a "knock it off or get suspended" warning. Or ban a contentious subject from the forums or move them to a new, strictly moderated forum. If those things had been tried and failed, then there could have been a case for just burning it down. But they weren't. Yeah it honestly feels like the lazy way out, and indeed is. Reminds me of the throwing rules. Instead of taking their time with it they just totally neutered it and took the easy way out.
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Post by trollsareblue on Mar 9, 2017 11:32:49 GMT
I honestly think you guys are overreacting. This is nothing like GW. I honestly think it was the best news I've ever heard when PP announced they were getting rid of a lot of junk in the official forums. All the forums were was a cess pool of nastiness and complaints. Everyone and their mother is a game designer and think they know Wmh better than PP does. You know what separates a game designer from a fan that spends hours playing a game? A title. A paycheck. That is all. People don't magically become better at something because they've been placed in a position that makes their ideas official. The lead designer at PP also has a RPG, and you know what? The rules are rubbish. They are awkward and unwieldy. I see no reason to assume the creator of one set of crap rules has suddenly become the god of design given a new outlet.
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Post by phantasmagorium on Mar 9, 2017 18:45:52 GMT
I honestly think you guys are overreacting. This is nothing like GW. I honestly think it was the best news I've ever heard when PP announced they were getting rid of a lot of junk in the official forums. All the forums were was a cess pool of nastiness and complaints. Everyone and their mother is a game designer and think they know Wmh better than PP does. You know what separates a game designer from a fan that spends hours playing a game? A title. A paycheck. That is all. People don't magically become better at something because they've been placed in a position that makes their ideas official. The lead designer at PP also has a RPG, and you know what? The rules are rubbish. They are awkward and unwieldy. I see no reason to assume the creator of one set of crap rules has suddenly become the god of design given a new outlet. Wait, are we talking about IKRPG? Because, as a long-time DM, that's one of my favorite rulesets to teach people; second only to 3.5/Pathfinder (and tied with Shadowrun).
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Haight
Junior Strategist
Posts: 396
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Post by Haight on Mar 9, 2017 18:50:47 GMT
No he's referring to Unhallowed Metropolis.
It's Jason Soles Victorian Gas Mask Chic Horror RPG.
I've never played it, but the two people i know that own it didn't have kind things to say. That's not exactly a huge sample though, and not exactly fair because its anecdotal in the extreme, and also hearsay.
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Post by gunmageintraining on Mar 9, 2017 18:53:21 GMT
Games go through cycles of balance. WarmaHordes is no different in this regard. Power Creep, imbalances, bad match ups which are mistaken as imbalance, recursive roles and hard counters, nevermind scenario and group-think bias all play into the calculation.
That said, player opinions should be valued, if taken with a grain of salt. Tournament results, even larger local ones, should be examined for trends and to see if there are any common themes. Haley 2 is always a pain to play, but I don't know if her win/loss ratio is excessively high in high-tier play. People know how to deal with her, just as people knew how to deal with eGaspy, Cryx, Karchev Slide and more. Sequential activation also adds further complications to the balancing equation so the best anyone's going to get is a rough guess... still...
Mk3 wasn't as well balanced as people would like. There were pretty significant holes (Skorne) at release and errata haven't really changed much. More so than that, is that optimization leaves large blocks of models out of consideration, which further complicates balances.
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Post by phantasmagorium on Mar 9, 2017 19:03:50 GMT
No he's referring to Unhallowed Metropolis. It's Jason Soles Victorian Gas Mask Chic Horror RPG. I've never played it, but the two people i know that own it didn't have kind things to say. That's not exactly a huge sample though, and not exactly fair because its anecdotal in the extreme, and also hearsay. Okay, cool. I was about to have to radically alter my feelings about which side of the debate I was on.
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Post by HeadHunter on Mar 9, 2017 21:29:02 GMT
the mods charged with enforcing said rules are literally saying "go somewhere else to talk about warmachine." To me, their attitude is the opposite of "community" I left the forums a few weeks ago because of the brutal moderation. I took a look at the new forums today to see if things had improved, but nope, they're FAR WORSE. I left the forums a few years ago for the very same reason. I made a comment about an overall mindset of certain players, not directed at anyone in the thread at all, and no one in the thread took offense - but got an infraction for it. When I sent a PM to the moderator to appeal this infraction, I got a second infraction for arguing with the moderator! I was polite and respectful in my communication, I wasn't airing dirty laundry in public... but the moderator felt I was challenging his authority. So I left the forums, and shortly thereafter lost interest in the game because of it. sold my stuff and didn't even think about WMH for nearly 5 years. All that time I could have been playing, participating in the game and the community, and spending money! But other game companies got my attention (and my dollars) because of how PP treated me. Yeah I had all of my posts from this morning deleted, received an infraction from PP for one post (with no warning because I said "let it wither" in regards to the forums, and now all of my posts have to be inspected by a moderator first. This lopsided, authoritarian, subjective and arbitrary moderation of their forum will do more harm than good. Building a "community" sounds like a noble aim, unless it's at the expense of driving people away for not praising PP at every opportunity, for daring to have a difference of opinion, for the slightest criticism of the company and its actions. They forget that those people are customers and if they even feel like they are being treated unfairly and not valued, they'll shop elsewhere. If you're not there to praise them you will get your ass banned and the post deleted. This kind of behaviour is usually the start of the end. In this instance people will fragment in several forums and such, a new player would probably come into these and what will find? They'll find the PP forums a ghost town, and since links to other community resources are prohibited (the stupidest possible move a company can make), new players will assume that the game is not widely played and poorly supported, and they will move on. With the high turnover of new players and the systematic alienation of veteran players, it will become a self-fulfilling prophesy and the game will die. A company that turns a deaf ear to the wants and concerns of its customers will soon find that it has no audience. But PP seems content to exist in its own echo chamber, surrounded by obsequious yes-men. The fact is, nothing has ever improved by anyone saying "everything's fine, don't ever change". The inevitable result of that attitude is stagnation.
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Post by javaman21011 on Mar 9, 2017 23:23:33 GMT
and Guild Ball recently hired DC to work for them(The guy who made Convergence of Cyriss). ...and they're releasing a new tabletop game this year, more of a skirmish level game with a world that involves fantasy elements... (Guild Ball is good fun too) Whats the skirmish game called?
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Post by malnorma on Mar 9, 2017 23:51:54 GMT
Whats the skirmish game called? They didn't even give a name. I posted a link to the video earlier, but here's one that jumps to about the right time: youtu.be/oxSrmKqpiZA?t=1595(We've been calling it NotMachine)
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Post by javaman21011 on Mar 10, 2017 1:29:09 GMT
Whats the skirmish game called? They didn't even give a name. I posted a link to the video earlier, but here's one that jumps to about the right time: youtu.be/oxSrmKqpiZA?t=1595(We've been calling it NotMachine) Sorry, should have caught up to all the discussions before asking, thanks for the link. I love CoC and was sad the first time i heard DC left.
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Post by sideshowlucifer on Mar 10, 2017 2:10:51 GMT
The funny and sad thing is they are going against the very things that they were founded on and the major reason for their initial success and they are turning in to exactly what they hated and made fun of. I don't know if their business will suffer or not, but their quality and reputation have suffered as a result. I plan on voting with my wallet and they won't get a single cent from me until I have faith in the company again.
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Post by ResolutePhoenix on Mar 11, 2017 10:36:57 GMT
All I can advise is that if their new direction is really troubling, vote with your wallet. That's pretty much the only feedback we have now. I was all in for Grymkin as my 8th faction in the game, but I'm really not wanting to support them at the moment with my money until I can get a better picture of the direction they are headed. I did exactly this. Today I went down to the local malifaux event, and people gave me some mdoels and a rule book and walked me through the first turn of the game. I even won against someone playing seriously! On my first game. The people were so incredible and friendly, and it convinced me to buy some models. This came from the money I was about to spend on a new skorne list. I'm sad to say that I think my WMH days are over for good.
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