|
Post by macdaddy on Sept 11, 2017 13:32:03 GMT
Ashen Veil on the paladin champ aint garbage. Yeah thats true. But I am struggling to find a place for him in my lists. I feel like you have to force him into the list.
|
|
|
Post by W0lfBane on Sept 11, 2017 13:58:24 GMT
Ashen Veil on the paladin champ aint garbage. Ashrn veil is the only useful one imo. The rest are hot garbage. I really wish they would change up the reclaimer and give him something similar to mrk2 i loved him in mrk 2
|
|
|
Post by macdaddy on Sept 11, 2017 14:02:46 GMT
Ashen Veil on the paladin champ aint garbage. Ashrn veil is the only useful one imo. The rest are hot garbage. I really wish they would change up the reclaimer and give him something similar to mrk2 i loved him in mrk 2 How in the world is future sight not useful?...
|
|
|
Post by paradox on Sept 11, 2017 14:18:09 GMT
Ashen Veil on the paladin champ aint garbage. Ashrn veil is the only useful one imo. The rest are hot garbage. I really wish they would change up the reclaimer and give him something similar to mrk2 i loved him in mrk 2 I'm not prepared to write them off. A backfield cloud (even if it does disappear on death) can be useful. I have a Durst paladin list I can try to shoehorn a reclaimer into. The idea there is that the paladins die hard, so souls should be scarce. But maybe it's enough? I'm working out whether Sevy1 or Vindy in FM might also work with a champ/reclaimer combo. DW + AV and deliver that champ. He's 17/22. Vindy can TP, where Sevy provides EoM.
|
|
|
Post by paradox on Sept 11, 2017 14:19:46 GMT
Ashrn veil is the only useful one imo. The rest are hot garbage. I really wish they would change up the reclaimer and give him something similar to mrk2 i loved him in mrk 2 How in the world is future sight not useful?... Agreed. This is why I love judi. Rev is great, and people look at me funny when i say I love judi (or drop it on the table). But MAT6 hurts. Boosting after the fact is great.
|
|
|
Post by W0lfBane on Sept 11, 2017 14:51:08 GMT
Ashrn veil is the only useful one imo. The rest are hot garbage. I really wish they would change up the reclaimer and give him something similar to mrk2 i loved him in mrk 2 How in the world is future sight not useful?... How is it? I'm sure it's situationally useful but most of the time when your warjack rolls a 5 when needing sixes you're still going to lose 1 focus when you really wanted as many attacks as possible. If something has it natively is great but if you want to hand out buffs there are other buffs you want.
|
|
Provengreil
Junior Strategist
Choir Kills: 12
Posts: 850
|
Post by Provengreil on Sept 11, 2017 15:27:17 GMT
I've already been playing sanctifiers marshalled by reclaimers. It's not as skornergistic as it sounds because, as has been pointed out, you only ever need like 2 souls on the reclaimer anyway. Two turns of a key model with future sight, usually the caster, is all you really need.
I didn't try it in faithful masses because my points were going to paladins, but I've used it to excellent effect with thyra in guardians, as well as several casters in exemplars under the same assumptions of use. In masses, it should be particularly useful because zealots get to die twice, and allowing their souls to simply evaporate is a waste.
Do note it's a 2 inch reach on the castigator chassis that turns off incorporeal: this covers native threat range as well as most reasons to bring magic weapons in a theme lacking them.
|
|
|
Post by ForEver_Blight on Sept 11, 2017 15:37:04 GMT
Sanctifiers in FM are great. I'm learning Thrya with the theme and they really just go off not needing Thyra to do anything for them. Heck they can sit outside control and just get a cluster of dude around them to keep functioning.
To the marshal idea. The only thing I liked in Cryx was the overseer and combos with him. I definitely want to pick up at least one of each of Protectorates'. Take aim + a vassal + choir means a Vanquisher can still put out an good shot that has pretty great damage - Pow 18 boosted hit/damage rat 7 and he can choose which to boost after the roll with future sight.
|
|
|
Post by paradox on Sept 11, 2017 15:44:26 GMT
How is it? I'm sure it's situationally useful but most of the time when your warjack rolls a 5 when needing sixes you're still going to lose 1 focus when you really wanted as many attacks as possible. If something has it natively is great but if you want to hand out buffs there are other buffs you want. It really is alot more than that. It allows you to hard roll for those 8s or 9s on two dice on rolls that count, but where you want more focus efficiency too. It's more about table-top play than on paper discussion. Its a tool. If you don't see the use, fine. But it's more than making up missing by 1. It's about MAT6 vs DEF14, for example. Maybe you roll a 7, but maybe you roll a 5. It could be worth rolling for that 3+ on the 3rd die, depending on the game. Or maybe it's an odd case where the inaccurate shot randomly rolled an 11 vs a DEF 15 caster, and you really would not mind a direct rocket hit. a 3+ gets you there. Maybe the RAT5 sprays with a max 3 focus wants to boost both damage rolls, but can only boost one to-hit. Boosting after can let you fish the first shot with alot more confidence. But that's just based on my judi play.
|
|
|
Post by greytemplar on Sept 11, 2017 16:10:02 GMT
If you field that Sanctifier under a Bastion Seneschal or a Reclaimer Gatekeeper and give it the Crush order, it gets another +2 dmg and an extra attack, on top of Ignite+Hand+Battle+Souls. No Bastion Seneschal in Faithful Masses. Even then it would still be 1 damage(and +3 to hit) shy of what it could get under Amon because it misses synergy.
|
|
|
Post by greytemplar on Sept 11, 2017 16:11:40 GMT
How in the world is future sight not useful?... How is it? I'm sure it's situationally useful but most of the time when your warjack rolls a 5 when needing sixes you're still going to lose 1 focus when you really wanted as many attacks as possible. If something has it natively is great but if you want to hand out buffs there are other buffs you want. Future Sight is useful, but its not 3 points+soul competition useful. If his other abilities were better he would be an interesting choice.
|
|
|
Post by ForEver_Blight on Sept 11, 2017 17:16:22 GMT
How in the world is future sight not useful?... How is it? I'm sure it's situationally useful but most of the time when your warjack rolls a 5 when needing sixes you're still going to lose 1 focus when you really wanted as many attacks as possible. If something has it natively is great but if you want to hand out buffs there are other buffs you want. I see it as more important on ranged models, where the number of attacks are fixed and fury/focus are limited. In melee yeah you just buy another attack unless that one attack has something special behind it (charge dice, crit effect on the dice that are already showing but didnt hit, or that pow 20 knockdown 1/turn thing on the CoC jack) But with a single ranged shot and only 1 focus on the jack, it lets you better control how to spend the single boost.
|
|
|
Post by W0lfBane on Sept 11, 2017 17:22:55 GMT
Having put tabletop time with them i end up using the ashen veil only. And for everblight has a compelling reason for future sight. But the lists i have that would want it don't have that many souls to make use of it. And the lists that have the souls don't care for it because it doesn't help with my hiting then in mellee. Like i said it's situationally useful but not in the situations that i have
|
|
Provengreil
Junior Strategist
Choir Kills: 12
Posts: 850
|
Post by Provengreil on Sept 12, 2017 16:32:35 GMT
If you field that Sanctifier under a Bastion Seneschal or a Reclaimer Gatekeeper and give it the Crush order, it gets another +2 dmg and an extra attack, on top of Ignite+Hand+Battle+Souls. No Bastion Seneschal in Faithful Masses. Even then it would still be 1 damage(and +3 to hit) shy of what it could get under Amon because it misses synergy. it is, however, caster independent. For everything amon does, look at our poll in a different thread: a lot of people, myself included, don't actually like playing him all that much. The marshalled sanctifier combo just....happens. Of course, the sanctifier can also score full focus without needing allocation, so it's still a hefty addition to an amon list. threat 12 pathfinding heavies swinging for mat 11 pow 23 are disgusting.
|
|
martini
Junior Strategist
Posts: 119
|
Post by martini on Sept 13, 2017 18:10:17 GMT
Sanctifier base Mat 6 P+S 16 Under Reclaimer +2 dmg and additonal attack Ignite from caster +2 dmg Battle from Choir +2 dmg Theme bonus +2 Mat, +2 dmg Thats Mat 8,P+S 24 and additional attack.
If under Amon you trade +2 dmg and additional attack from Reclaimer and +2 dmg from Ignite for Synergy bonus +3 Mat +3 dmg.
So it is 1 over in dmg, 1 over number of attacks and 3 under in Mat. Seems a fair trade im you consider rest of the package Amon gives.
|
|