Zeykk
Junior Strategist
Posts: 135
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Post by Zeykk on Aug 15, 2017 18:18:27 GMT
Hi everyone. The Irregulars theme force was just announced and judging by Pagani's reaction in the Merc Facebook Group, it'll be live in September. Recap: All Merc Casters, Solos, Units, Battle Engines, Non-character Jacks, R&B, WE&SJ and Tinker are allowed. 25 points of units and jacks give you a free command attachment or small/medium based solo that doesn't have the lesser warlock rule. Jack Marshalled jacks get Flank[friendly warrior model] One Heavy Warjack gets advance move per every unit. Gallant can be taken with Constance. Ace can be taken with Caine3 What are your thoughts about this? I wish jack marshal was a bit stronger or useful. I've only had success with Thor and Avalancher. I think Shaw would be a cool marshal, but he's only .5 reach Do you think this will be competitive, or overlooked in favor of kingmakers and hammer strike? Any wonky jank you can think of?
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Post by mberks69 on Aug 15, 2017 18:47:46 GMT
Looks interesting. Does ALL mean that the Cannon is in all lists too?
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Zeykk
Junior Strategist
Posts: 135
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Post by Zeykk on Aug 15, 2017 18:55:00 GMT
Yes, kinda of; The Commodore Cannon and Crew still requires a Privateer warcaster. So no, you can't take it with a non-Privateer caster in this theme.
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Post by mikethefish on Aug 15, 2017 19:03:36 GMT
It`s absolutely a competetive option. Right out of the gate, it's going to bring back Durgen Madhammer as a very solid tournament playable option. The Theme is basically custom-designed for him.
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Post by mikethefish on Aug 15, 2017 19:08:39 GMT
Also - I would't count on Caine being able to use Ace for too long. We shall see if that survives CID.
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Post by leotherat on Aug 15, 2017 19:12:06 GMT
It will probably be a while till it gets CID (just due to all of the themes needing to go through CID) so enjoy it while you can.
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juckto
Junior Strategist
Posts: 124
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Post by juckto on Aug 15, 2017 19:17:01 GMT
So ... non-Theme Mercs is dead?
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Zeykk
Junior Strategist
Posts: 135
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Post by Zeykk on Aug 15, 2017 19:18:26 GMT
CID won't impact Caine/Ace. Ace is Bonded to Caine. Therefore, Ace is allowed in any theme force that Caine is present in. They would have to rewrite the bonded rule. Which I'm ok with because it means no Thorn in Heavy Metal for Haley2.
Good point about Durgen. I've been looking for an opportunity to use him and have all but given up with him in Hammer Strike.
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Post by Trollock on Aug 15, 2017 19:31:49 GMT
So ... non-Theme Mercs is dead? non-theme lists in general are dead. not just mercs
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Post by mikethefish on Aug 15, 2017 19:32:41 GMT
CID won't impact Caine/Ace. Ace is Bonded to Caine. Therefore, Ace is allowed in any theme force that Caine is present in. They would have to rewrite the bonded rule. Which I'm ok with because it means no Thorn in Heavy Metal for Haley2. Good point about Durgen. I've been looking for an opportunity to use him and have all but given up with him in Hammer Strike. This doesn't follow, logically. It's not nearly as binary as you make it out to be. Ace is a Cygnarnan warjack, and not a Partisan or anything wacky like that. All's it would take is to put in a clause that required Bonded jacks to belong to the same faction, or to be a Partisan. But you never know - that might never happen, anyhow. juckto - yes, this is officially the end of non-theme merc armies. Literally no reason to use them outside of theme anymore. I guess if you wanted to do something like take Gallant with Magnus or something. But as cool as that combo is, would you really like to forfeit what...20 points or so, of free solos?
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Post by mikethefish on Aug 15, 2017 19:37:38 GMT
Oh, and for those who aren't impressed with Jack Marshals, I would say that you should give them a bit more practice.
I (and many competetive Merc players) use Meg with Talons or Buckaneers in Kingmakers for months now. There are a lot of fairly powerful combos, if you just sit down and look for them. Having Flank on tap is...really kind of amazing. All the cheap things - Talons, Freebooters, Buckaneers, Bashers - should really benefit from this upgrade. The Mangler has been seeing some experimental play with Jack Marshals already. Getting Flank, and a possible Advance Move should be more than enough to push it over the top
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Zeykk
Junior Strategist
Posts: 135
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Post by Zeykk on Aug 15, 2017 19:39:54 GMT
mikethefish That's still rewriting the Bonded rule in the main rulebook and will prevent Cygnar having access to Gallant in themes. Not a big blow as Constance is rather lacking, in Mercs and/or Cygnar. Just not sure if PP wants to go that far into a change. I agree it it 'could' happen. But I think they've already had it in mind. I don't really see the problem with having Ace in this theme, maybe you can expand on that point?
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Post by mikethefish on Aug 15, 2017 19:46:37 GMT
mikethefish That's still rewriting the Bonded rule in the main rulebook and will prevent Cygnar having access to Gallant in themes. Not a big blow as Constance is rather lacking, in Mercs and/or Cygnar. Just not sure if PP wants to go that far into a change. I agree it it 'could' happen. But I think they've already had it in mind. I don't really see the problem with having Ace in this theme, maybe you can expand on that point? I don't mean to get on your case here, but you did read what I said about Partisan, yes? Gallant is Partisan, and so would be very easy to have him not be excluded. Ace isn't a Merc jack. If they wanted him to be taken in Mercs, they would have already worked it out by now. Additionally it was specifically mentioned in the latest Caine novel that he had to ditch Ace when he went rogue, so it's apparent that Merc Caine doesn't use Ace anymore. I get that fluff =/= rules, but PP has pretty consistently shown that they like to have their rules accurately represent the fluff as much as possible. I just don't see Ace lasting too long as an allowable piece.
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Zeykk
Junior Strategist
Posts: 135
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Post by Zeykk on Aug 15, 2017 19:51:54 GMT
mikethefish You're right, I completely missed the part about partisans; my mistake.
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flogger
Junior Strategist
Posts: 296
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Post by flogger on Aug 15, 2017 19:56:59 GMT
I thought none of the theme lists were going to go throug CID until after they were all released. Kinda like "here's your stuff, let us know if anything is broken"? Otherwise it will take a while before we all get those lists in War Room
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