demonic
Junior Strategist
Posts: 649
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Post by demonic on Jul 31, 2017 2:47:12 GMT
alright... I officially feel extremely stupid, as I've only played menoth lists with 1 wrack... now that I'm using casters that thrive on focus use, I've been placing more than 1 wrack in a list.
Can a single caster take focus from more than 1 wrack a turn? For example, Durant using Manifest Destiny, cost 3, and then taking a focus point from 3 different wracks. The way they word it on the card is unclear; although it says a caster can only take 1 point a turn, it never says anything about if you have additional wracks. At the same time, it does say, clearly, that they can only use the ability once per turn, thus is it the actual ability, or that singular wrack's version of the ability.
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Post by greytemplar on Jul 31, 2017 2:53:14 GMT
You only get to pull off 1 wrack per turn. It is a little clunky on the wording, but it does actually say that. Its because the rule says the warcaster can only use the ability once per turn. It's not the wrack using the ability.
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demonic
Junior Strategist
Posts: 649
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Post by demonic on Jul 31, 2017 3:00:41 GMT
alright, so using 3 wracks is pretty pointless, better to pull in a mechanik and set the wracks far enough appart that one will always be in ctrl
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Post by greytemplar on Jul 31, 2017 3:11:35 GMT
Its not totally pointless, they do explode. Though I certainly don't add 3 unless I need more filler. I have plenty of lists where I have 3 wracks, usually because I already have 3 mechaniks or another mechanik isn't adding anything.
Generally, you only need 2-3 turns of use out of a wrack. The probability of a single wrack surviving for 3 turns is 29.62%. So in terms of needing that focus to be there, it is pointless. However as you say positioning can be a problem depending on your control area. 3 wracks would mean you are practically guaranteed to be in range of at least 1.
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Post by paradox on Jul 31, 2017 3:16:58 GMT
I generally take two wracks in most lists. They now only explode on a 1-2, and this is usually sufficient for most games.
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demonic
Junior Strategist
Posts: 649
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Post by demonic on Jul 31, 2017 3:37:09 GMT
My Reznik1 list needs to be able to use them for all turns x.x; I do understand now why people complain so much about his focus though, as I was thinking I could recover 3 until the jacks clean up a bit. (FYI, when I say "clean up" I'm talking about eliminating the majority of the infantry, solos, and screening units. After that turns really simplify and things become more steady, as whoever has the most pieces at that moment can go for scenario while the other needs to plan assassination or a turning point)
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Provengreil
Junior Strategist
Choir Kills: 12
Posts: 850
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Post by Provengreil on Jul 31, 2017 14:30:24 GMT
My Reznik1 list needs to be able to use them for all turns x.x; I do understand now why people complain so much about his focus though, as I was thinking I could recover 3 until the jacks clean up a bit. (FYI, when I say "clean up" I'm talking about eliminating the majority of the infantry, solos, and screening units. After that turns really simplify and things become more steady, as whoever has the most pieces at that moment can go for scenario while the other needs to plan assassination or a turning point) can you imagine if Reznik could ignore that limit?
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Post by greytemplar on Jul 31, 2017 16:28:29 GMT
He should. In CID we should push for him getting that as an ability in both versions.
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Provengreil
Junior Strategist
Choir Kills: 12
Posts: 850
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Post by Provengreil on Jul 31, 2017 17:04:22 GMT
He should. In CID we should push for him getting that as an ability in both versions. just the first, I think. That one actually has emphasis on wrack play. Rez 2 is much different and, frankly, does not need that level of buff.
The problem would be getting him into CID at all. he's not an exemplar and they aren't doing "faction" CIDs.
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Post by greytemplar on Jul 31, 2017 17:10:34 GMT
Well, every one of the themed CIDs has had a lot of stuff that was decidedly not in that theme. Northkin had Mulg and the Sea King. The Trencher CID had tons of other Cygnar stuff that had nothing to do with Trenchers.
Plus if you look in the fluff, Reznik works with Exemplars a lot. Plus he is the High Executioner. And Exemplars are the enforcement arm of the Hierarchy. So they actually go together quite well.
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Provengreil
Junior Strategist
Choir Kills: 12
Posts: 850
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Post by Provengreil on Jul 31, 2017 17:18:24 GMT
I'll set my expectations dial to "cautiously optimistic". I have confidence that if he gets in, we can get the tweaks to his abilities and possibly feat to make him work.
The wrack thing, possibly a +1 to spellcasting attacks (effective FOC 7, but not with a stack of 7 nor the CTRL of one would be fine) and not helping hordes with their fury would all be nice.
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demonic
Junior Strategist
Posts: 649
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Post by demonic on Jul 31, 2017 17:21:44 GMT
would you prefer it to max their fury instead?
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Provengreil
Junior Strategist
Choir Kills: 12
Posts: 850
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Post by Provengreil on Jul 31, 2017 17:31:28 GMT
would you prefer it to max their fury instead? it's a rough question. Absent a clause "can only be forced once during your opponent's next turn", which is clunky and unlikely, it really doesn't compare at all to disallowing allocation. Maxing fury would hurt more, particularly if you also do it to the warlock, but that's then almost akin to disrupting and then freezing every warjack.
I think the best way to even it out would be to nix the allocation bit, target only warlocks and warcasters for focus/fury removal, and then give it an entirely different component to aid in the assassination attempt. As is, half the feat is basically wasted most times.
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Post by greytemplar on Jul 31, 2017 17:37:07 GMT
I think the feat might be more flexible if it said you could add or subtract any amount of focus or fury. So you could drain a warlock/warcaster for an assassination run, or you could max out a warlock and all his beasts so they'll all likely frenzying and the warlock can't do anything about it.
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Provengreil
Junior Strategist
Choir Kills: 12
Posts: 850
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Post by Provengreil on Jul 31, 2017 17:50:18 GMT
The fever dreams for reznik, IMO, is arc nodes and upkeeps. His armies should HATE these things. FM: purgation and witch hound triggering if a spell is arced, regardless of target, would be amazing.
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