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Post by streetpizza on Jul 14, 2017 18:58:17 GMT
We may not be getting a theme force book before christmas but it seems like we'll at least be getting a plading dragoon and exemplar character solo ... neat! PIP 32124 Exemplar Warder Elias Gade – Protectorate of Solo (metal)
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Post by dragonpup on Jul 14, 2017 19:24:27 GMT
I would like to know more.
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spideredd
Junior Strategist
Summer Gamer
Posts: 588
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Post by spideredd on Jul 14, 2017 21:28:49 GMT
I like the idea of the paladin dragoon. Pity there's no Revelator in the October solicitations.
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thelat
Junior Strategist
Posts: 480
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Post by thelat on Jul 14, 2017 21:49:51 GMT
With any luck, he'll grant abilities to the other paladins.
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Miafan
Junior Strategist
Eater of Brains
Posts: 130
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Post by Miafan on Jul 14, 2017 22:36:54 GMT
Thanks, thats a nice sweet pill after sheer disappointment in Revelator model. Especially the Dragoon - if this guy is solid AND brings Vilmon and CO back to table I may yet start playing this game again.
Srsly though, only 2 freaking models? Cryx and Khador got metric tons of new stuff spoiled at LnL2017, not to mention Trollbloods earlier
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Post by Demeritus on Jul 15, 2017 1:00:49 GMT
Thanks, thats a nice sweet pill after sheer disappointment in Revelator model. Especially the Dragoon - if this guy is solid AND brings Vilmon and CO back to table I may yet start playing this game again. Srsly though, only 2 freaking models? Cryx and Khador got metric tons of new stuff spoiled at LnL2017, not to mention Trollbloods earlier Keep in mind they have theme forces announced, Protectorate will likely see something in 2018.
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doopsie
Junior Strategist
Posts: 341
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Post by doopsie on Jul 15, 2017 2:25:09 GMT
Thanks, thats a nice sweet pill after sheer disappointment in Revelator model. Especially the Dragoon - if this guy is solid AND brings Vilmon and CO back to table I may yet start playing this game again. Srsly though, only 2 freaking models? Cryx and Khador got metric tons of new stuff spoiled at LnL2017, not to mention Trollbloods earlier Also keep in mind that PP announced that, with going away from the books in Mk3, releases won't be even. So there are going to be times that some factions get tons, and others get little-to-none. So rather than weep about how Cryx & Khador got lots, lets celebrate that there is FINALLY another Paladin, the dude looks awesome, his rules are (from what little we see) pretty good, and also, he's on a freakin' horse!
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Post by macdaddy on Jul 16, 2017 1:26:57 GMT
I will be buying both!
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Provengreil
Junior Strategist
Choir Kills: 12
Posts: 850
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Post by Provengreil on Jul 16, 2017 1:55:22 GMT
Thanks, thats a nice sweet pill after sheer disappointment in Revelator model. Especially the Dragoon - if this guy is solid AND brings Vilmon and CO back to table I may yet start playing this game again. Srsly though, only 2 freaking models? Cryx and Khador got metric tons of new stuff spoiled at LnL2017, not to mention Trollbloods earlier Also keep in mind that PP announced that, with going away from the books in Mk3, releases won't be even. So there are going to be times that some factions get tons, and others get little-to-none. So rather than weep about how Cryx & Khador got lots, lets celebrate that there is FINALLY another Paladin, the dude looks awesome, his rules are (from what little we see) pretty good, and also, he's on a freakin' horse! I think the point is that we're tired of having to look for silver linings and being happy with, in many cases, less. At times it really does feel like the designers quite simply regret making this faction.
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doopsie
Junior Strategist
Posts: 341
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Post by doopsie on Jul 16, 2017 3:25:03 GMT
Ok. The problem is that said stance is, for one, quick unlikely and most probably highly hyperbolic (....is that a thing? Like "extremely extreme?"). There is no evidence that PP regrets making Protectorate other than a perceived slight in power level, models released, faction identity, or whatever the complaint flavor-of-the-week is. For example, with this complaint that we didn't get enough stuff at LnL. To my recollection, Cygnar got 1 (gun mage solo), CoC got 1 (warcaster), Ret got 2 (House Vyre jacks they've been waiting on for some time), Circle got one (solo that, at least at first glance, looks kinda bad to me), Skorne got 1 (warlock). So even if we excuse the Cygnar with "but they just got CID", does this mean that PP regrets making Protectorate AND Convergence AND Retribution AND Circle AND Skorne?
I disagree that we're (i.e. myself and those who hold the similar positions) being "having to look for silver linings and being happy with, in many cases, less." Rather, small-but-vocal portion of the forums have taken to the idea that Menoth IS less, at anything and everything, and will vehemently debate that at every opportunity. And frankly, it's getting boring. It's "grass is greener" cranked to 11, and I have little sympathy for such an attitude.
So let me very clearly state my stance: A model does not have to be the optimal choice in all situations to be good, so long as they are good in the role you intend for them (referencing argument about Avatar being bad because he is a "sub-optimal use of points" edit: Also the castigator, which is one of the better budget jacks but is frequently dismissed because the Kodiak can run and vent steam, but it can't run and combust). A faction does not have to have the absolute best example of a rule for that rule to still be a primary part of their identity (referencing argument about Menoth fire being weaker than Kallus2, AND debate about Menoth losing their identity as the denial faction because some casters can have stronger denial). If you would like to challenge me on this, please do so. These arguments are where I get my list ideas for what to play on Saturdays.
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Post by WantonRanger on Jul 16, 2017 9:22:26 GMT
Ok. The problem is that said stance is, for one, quick unlikely and most probably highly hyperbolic (....is that a thing? Like "extremely extreme?"). There is no evidence that PP regrets making Protectorate other than a perceived slight in power level, models released, faction identity, or whatever the complaint flavor-of-the-week is. For example, with this complaint that we didn't get enough stuff at LnL. To my recollection, Cygnar got 1 (gun mage solo), CoC got 1 (warcaster), Ret got 2 (House Vyre jacks they've been waiting on for some time), Circle got one (solo that, at least at first glance, looks kinda bad to me), Skorne got 1 (warlock). So even if we excuse the Cygnar with "but they just got CID", does this mean that PP regrets making Protectorate AND Convergence AND Retribution AND Circle AND Skorne? I disagree that we're (i.e. myself and those who hold the similar positions) being "having to look for silver linings and being happy with, in many cases, less." Rather, small-but-vocal portion of the forums have taken to the idea that Menoth IS less, at anything and everything, and will vehemently debate that at every opportunity. And frankly, it's getting boring. It's "grass is greener" cranked to 11, and I have little sympathy for such an attitude. So let me very clearly state my stance: A model does not have to be the optimal choice in all situations to be good, so long as they are good in the role you intend for them (referencing argument about Avatar being bad because he is a "sub-optimal use of points" edit: Also the castigator, which is one of the better budget jacks but is frequently dismissed because the Kodiak can run and vent steam, but it can't run and combust). A faction does not have to have the absolute best example of a rule for that rule to still be a primary part of their identity (referencing argument about Menoth fire being weaker than Kallus2, AND debate about Menoth losing their identity as the denial faction because some casters can have stronger denial). If you would like to challenge me on this, please do so. These arguments are where I get my list ideas for what to play on Saturdays. Right but I don't think what he said was hyperbole in the way you are implying and I feel like you have answered with what is currently bugging you (fair enough). Additionally there is definitely a core group of people on this forum who are hyperbolic in the other direction. You think everything is ok, always, you just don't get that that sort of attitude is just as useless in moving the faction forward as complaining that we are always underpowered. You kind of need a balance of positive and negative criticism. Menoth is in a bit of a weird place. It is still trying to find where it fits in to MK3 and I can understand perfectly that it sometimes feels like we spend a lot of time trying "to make things work" when some things should just work more easily. But acting the whole time like everything is basically where it should be and that people are asking that everything be the best in it's role is ridiculous. I mean the CID exists for a reason and Menoth is not really currently winning any best in role prizes... P.s. do we have any news on the new models abilities etc
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Post by droopingpuppy on Jul 16, 2017 11:17:13 GMT
Wow, the champion seems the non-character option!
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doopsie
Junior Strategist
Posts: 341
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Post by doopsie on Jul 16, 2017 13:48:26 GMT
Ok. The problem is that said stance is, for one, quick unlikely and most probably highly hyperbolic (....is that a thing? Like "extremely extreme?"). There is no evidence that PP regrets making Protectorate other than a perceived slight in power level, models released, faction identity, or whatever the complaint flavor-of-the-week is. For example, with this complaint that we didn't get enough stuff at LnL. To my recollection, Cygnar got 1 (gun mage solo), CoC got 1 (warcaster), Ret got 2 (House Vyre jacks they've been waiting on for some time), Circle got one (solo that, at least at first glance, looks kinda bad to me), Skorne got 1 (warlock). So even if we excuse the Cygnar with "but they just got CID", does this mean that PP regrets making Protectorate AND Convergence AND Retribution AND Circle AND Skorne? I disagree that we're (i.e. myself and those who hold the similar positions) being "having to look for silver linings and being happy with, in many cases, less." Rather, small-but-vocal portion of the forums have taken to the idea that Menoth IS less, at anything and everything, and will vehemently debate that at every opportunity. And frankly, it's getting boring. It's "grass is greener" cranked to 11, and I have little sympathy for such an attitude. So let me very clearly state my stance: A model does not have to be the optimal choice in all situations to be good, so long as they are good in the role you intend for them (referencing argument about Avatar being bad because he is a "sub-optimal use of points" edit: Also the castigator, which is one of the better budget jacks but is frequently dismissed because the Kodiak can run and vent steam, but it can't run and combust). A faction does not have to have the absolute best example of a rule for that rule to still be a primary part of their identity (referencing argument about Menoth fire being weaker than Kallus2, AND debate about Menoth losing their identity as the denial faction because some casters can have stronger denial). If you would like to challenge me on this, please do so. These arguments are where I get my list ideas for what to play on Saturdays. Right but I don't think what he said was hyperbole in the way you are implying and I feel like you have answered with what is currently bugging you (fair enough). Additionally there is definitely a core group of people on this forum who are hyperbolic in the other direction. You think everything is ok, always, you just don't get that that sort of attitude is just as useless in moving the faction forward as complaining that we are always underpowered. You kind of need a balance of positive and negative criticism. Menoth is in a bit of a weird place. It is still trying to find where it fits in to MK3 and I can understand perfectly that it sometimes feels like we spend a lot of time trying "to make things work" when some things should just work more easily. But acting the whole time like everything is basically where it should be and that people are asking that everything be the best in it's role is ridiculous. I mean the CID exists for a reason and Menoth is not really currently winning any best in role prizes... P.s. do we have any news on the new models abilities etc I don't, in fact, always think everything is ok. There are certainly things in Menoth that are in bad shape, and I won't disagree on that (Deliverers, Paladins & Purifier for example). But when I respond, it is almost always to a person being 100% negative (to bring very rough math in), and so to force the thread to come to a balanced position, I take the 90-100% positive position. If I were to take a 50/50 split position, the cumulative impression given by the thread would be primarily negative. I would much prefer to respond with nuance. But responding to a hyperbolic post (ex. "the Castigator is pure garbage! Why does PP hate Menoth so much that they gave us this useless jack when Khador gets the Kodiak!?! This game sucks!") with a measured response leaves the overall impression of the Castigator as bad, which it is not. Put another way, you go low, I go high. You go for the middle, I'll go for the middle. And sure, I'd love for Menoth to go into the CID. But at the same time, while not winning any awards, Menoth is generally pretty well balanced within itself, and so is a lower-priority for tweaks than Trollbloods and Cryx. Now Retribution going into CID is just bizarre, unless it's to test out new models like the Vyre lights.
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doopsie
Junior Strategist
Posts: 341
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Post by doopsie on Jul 16, 2017 13:51:12 GMT
Wow, the champion seems the non-character option! Well that is just all kinds of good news. I was all excited for a moment about running an all-cav Kreoss3 Exemplar Interdiction list, and then I checked and saw no paladins allowed Guess I have to go out of theme, which sucks.
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Provengreil
Junior Strategist
Choir Kills: 12
Posts: 850
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Post by Provengreil on Jul 16, 2017 14:59:54 GMT
On topic: I've been saying that I'd paladins are going to be stancibg all the time, they need to be anchors to the army. I'm really hoping that sturdy part gets spread around somehow, as drags and pushes have been a bane of mine.
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