|
Post by Stormsmith Dropout on Jul 1, 2017 22:54:41 GMT
I recall Darius picking up some interest briefly a few months back when Stryker1 started hitting the tournament scene.
Does anyone play him. I think his feat is pretty much a gamble no matter what you bring.
Here's his pros and cons, as I see them.
Pros: -good stats make him fairly hard to kill -pretty good spells -interesting angles and threat extension that can be worked with crane, refuge and jackhammer -His feat can potentially repair 55 boxes on a damaged colossal, along with whatever the halfjacks do
Cons: -Feat can't be relied on, and may have little, or no, impact on the game -he's on a large base, so he can be targeted pretty easily -halfjacks are fragile, though interesting
For lists, I think you can either maximize full throttle, refuge, and crane by taking lots of heavies. Or you can try to get as much out of the feat as possible.
Heavy metal Darius 29* -Stormclad 18 -Stormclad 18 -Stormclad 18 -Ironclad 12 -Lancer 10 -Lancer 10 -Squire 0 Strangeways 0 Junior 0 -Charger 9 Jakes 0 -Charger 9
Or
Heavy Metal Darius 29* -Hurricane or Stormwall 39 -Hurricane or Stormwall 39 -Firefly 8 -Squire 0 Strangeways 0 Junior 0 -Charger 9 Jakes 0 -Charger 9
Anyway, those are my ideas. What are yours? Can Darius play out of theme? What lists can you design?
|
|
|
Post by Aegis on Jul 1, 2017 23:18:01 GMT
Darius was my main caster until themes dropped, and I had pretty good success with him.
Refuge+Jackhammer bring an huge non-linear threat range, and some pieces like Gallant or Stormclads love to be able to be jackhammered a lot.
Fortify is also quite nice against some lists that rely on moving your models, and Darius is one of the best Thunderhead casters we have with Crane + Energizer (from Jakes1), and Refuge on the top of it if the situation requires it.
That said, the list I was playing doesn't suit themes well, since while obviously Heavy Metal is what he wants to play, heavy metal doesn't allow Gallant and doesn't allow Stormknights to fuel Stormclads. He also loved Thorn (not only for Jackhammering around, but because Aranetrick Bolt + Disruption is pretty nasty on jacks, and Thorn itself can be a pretty good surprise assassin on anything but the most tough casters), Lanyssa (for even more threat range and free charges) and also Thor+Avalancher.
It can still be played around, but that list is a lot less effective without those things, while still not worth losing 15 points and playing out of theme.
The other option is to play him in theme with 2 colossals. That way the feat becomes more reliable, and he can play the list pretty well, but double colossals aren't fun to play imo, so at the moment I have dropped him.
In general the two lists you have proposed are pretty much fine, they will play well in casual games, but for tournaments probably there are better options around.
|
|
|
Post by droopingpuppy on Jul 1, 2017 23:42:11 GMT
conflictchamber.com/#c1201b8Zf69Hak2TfManaj9c9u9f9fCygnar Army - 75 / 75 points (Darius 1) Captain E. Dominic Darius [+29] - Hurricane [39] - Stormclad [18] - Squire [5] Alten Ashley [6] Arcane Tempest Rifleman [4] Captain Arlan Strangewayes [4] Journeyman Warcaster [4] - Firefly [8] Ragman [4] Horgenhold Artillery Corps [6] Horgenhold Artillery Corps [6] If I made the list... I think that Hurricane would be a good jack for him. Throw a Stormclad away and push Jackhammer arced by Hurricane would be a good trick for the early games. It can't channel a spell while engaged, though. Artilleries are just for my taste, and with some large to hugh bases it is easy to screen them too. Hurricane can knock the target down so they can reliably shoot at the enemy too. Squire seems not so bad with Darius than Sylys because sometimes he need to cast Jackhammer more, just as MKII Caine2 does.
|
|
|
Post by octaviusmaximus on Jul 2, 2017 0:36:05 GMT
I always found Darius to have an annoying amount of hopes that the enemy will cooperate as well as a lot of moving parts. I don't hate him, but I feel he needs just a *little* bit more help before he breaks into tournament rankings reliably.
|
|
|
Post by 36cygnar24guy36 on Jul 3, 2017 12:12:20 GMT
I played Darius solidly for a couple of months in the build up to Smogcon where I used him in ADR at the masters, so I feel like I know what I am talking about when I discuss him.
I want to address the old argument of:
'he does not have a feat, because your opponent will just one round stuff'
On the surface that appears to be a very good point, however I like to re-word it slightly to:
'your opponent must one round stuff'
the real strength of his feat is forcing your opponent to make hard decisions about what they have to commit to ensure the job is done, if you compile this with higher armour jacks, e.g. double colossal, 3 Centurions, you can create some headaches for your opponent
If they underestimate how much they need to get the job done, or get crap dice, then they are punished severely
If they overestimate then they have potentially traded unfavourably
If they try and nickel and dime you over several turns they will make no headway whatsoever
|
|
|
Post by octaviusmaximus on Jul 3, 2017 12:39:35 GMT
I played Darius solidly for a couple of months in the build up to Smogcon where I used him in ADR at the masters, so I feel like I know what I am talking about when I discuss him.
I want to address the old argument of:
'he does not have a feat, because your opponent will just one round stuff'
On the surface that appears to be a very good point, however I like to re-word it slightly to:
'your opponent must one round stuff'
the real strength of his feat is forcing your opponent to make hard decisions about what they have to commit to ensure the job is done, if you compile this with higher armour jacks, e.g. double colossal, 3 Centurions, you can create some headaches for your opponent
If they underestimate how much they need to get the job done, or get crap dice, then they are punished severely
If they overestimate then they have potentially traded unfavourably
If they try and nickel and dime you over several turns they will make no headway whatsoever
I dont know about this. If your opponent has the capacity to Nickel and Dime your stuff in a meaningful way then you will never get a good feat, just an OK one. But all opponents want to look at ways to one round your stuff. Forcing your opponent to pursue what is probably their best strategy never seems that great to me.
|
|
|
Post by 36cygnar24guy36 on Jul 3, 2017 12:59:07 GMT
I played Darius solidly for a couple of months in the build up to Smogcon where I used him in ADR at the masters, so I feel like I know what I am talking about when I discuss him.
I want to address the old argument of:
'he does not have a feat, because your opponent will just one round stuff'
On the surface that appears to be a very good point, however I like to re-word it slightly to:
'your opponent must one round stuff'
the real strength of his feat is forcing your opponent to make hard decisions about what they have to commit to ensure the job is done, if you compile this with higher armour jacks, e.g. double colossal, 3 Centurions, you can create some headaches for your opponent
If they underestimate how much they need to get the job done, or get crap dice, then they are punished severely
If they overestimate then they have potentially traded unfavourably
If they try and nickel and dime you over several turns they will make no headway whatsoever
I dont know about this. If your opponent has the capacity to Nickel and Dime your stuff in a meaningful way then you will never get a good feat, just an OK one. But all opponents want to look at ways to one round your stuff. Forcing your opponent to pursue what is probably their best strategy never seems that great to me. but you still get a feat
alternatively you can use the plentiful repair in your list to delay the feat for another turn, Darius had d3 +3, Halfjacks get 1 each, Arlan has d3+3, take a max unit of mechnaics for another d6 + 5 x d3. If they are just whittling you down from range, you can just fix that all back up and save the feat
|
|
|
Post by Stormsmith Dropout on Jul 3, 2017 13:02:39 GMT
Question: has anyone here had a Stormwall get one rounded in Mk3?
I run Stormwall and Hurricane (individually, not double colossal lists) plenty. I think it's died like once.
What can kill a Cygnar Colossal with AS in one go. I guess there are Marauders under Butcher1's feat turn. But what else?
|
|
|
Post by octaviusmaximus on Jul 3, 2017 13:17:02 GMT
Question: has anyone here had a Stormwall get one rounded in Mk3? I run Stormwall and Hurricane (individually, not double colossal lists) plenty. I think it's died like once. What can kill a Cygnar Colossal with AS in one go. I guess there are Marauders under Butcher1's feat turn. But what else? What armies can kill a Stormwall in one turn? The Child (easily, 2 in one go) Many Skorne Casters, Makeda with Hydra is damn good. Behemoth with a damage buff. Strakhov applying multiple heavies from downtown just off the top of my head.
|
|
|
Post by droopingpuppy on Jul 3, 2017 13:21:02 GMT
It is quite easy to remove a heavy warjack in a turn if you want to concentrate the resource in the current meta. It is hard to remove a colossal or gargantuan, though, and that's why Darius' feat have not much a meaning unless he takes at least a colossal.
And our colossals are already good enough, and they don't require Darius to run.
|
|
|
Post by Sarcastastic on Jul 3, 2017 13:34:20 GMT
I played Darius solidly for a couple of months in the build up to Smogcon where I used him in ADR at the masters, so I feel like I know what I am talking about when I discuss him.
I want to address the old argument of:
'he does not have a feat, because your opponent will just one round stuff'
On the surface that appears to be a very good point, however I like to re-word it slightly to:
'your opponent must one round stuff'
the real strength of his feat is forcing your opponent to make hard decisions about what they have to commit to ensure the job is done, if you compile this with higher armour jacks, e.g. double colossal, 3 Centurions, you can create some headaches for your opponent
If they underestimate how much they need to get the job done, or get crap dice, then they are punished severely
If they overestimate then they have potentially traded unfavourably
If they try and nickel and dime you over several turns they will make no headway whatsoever
I dont know about this. If your opponent has the capacity to Nickel and Dime your stuff in a meaningful way then you will never get a good feat, just an OK one. But all opponents want to look at ways to one round your stuff. Forcing your opponent to pursue what is probably their best strategy never seems that great to me. I play with some people who are more than happy to just cripple jacks and leave them next to useless so they don't have to commit extra stuff. With Darius, you essentially remove that avenue altogether for them. I mean, that's a plus at least.
|
|
|
Post by 36cygnar24guy36 on Jul 3, 2017 13:47:56 GMT
I dont know about this. If your opponent has the capacity to Nickel and Dime your stuff in a meaningful way then you will never get a good feat, just an OK one. But all opponents want to look at ways to one round your stuff. Forcing your opponent to pursue what is probably their best strategy never seems that great to me. I play with some people who are more than happy to just cripple jacks and leave them next to useless so they don't have to commit extra stuff. With Darius, you essentially remove that avenue altogether for them. I mean, that's a plus at least. precisely, if they cripple a jack to uselessness, then you can go with a Gobber mechanik, heal his movement and cortex, Arlan empowers him, he then runs/charges to engage an enemy, run a half jack to b2b, feat with Darius and then cast jackhammer.
|
|
|
Post by droopingpuppy on Jul 3, 2017 14:02:45 GMT
Also, even with Feat: Pit Stop, a warjack with crippled cortex have no focus points on it so it can't do much at that turn. Stormclad can have 1 focus, and you may use Empower it, though, but still it can't be fully focused.
|
|
|
Post by 36cygnar24guy36 on Jul 3, 2017 14:06:17 GMT
Also, even with Feat: Pit Stop, a warjack with crippled cortex have no focus points on it so it can't do much at that turn. Stormclad can have 1 focus, and you may use Empower it, though, but still it can't be fully focused. Darius has Jackhammer, he can get around not allocating focus, see my example further up
|
|
|
Post by droopingpuppy on Jul 3, 2017 14:07:47 GMT
Also, even with Feat: Pit Stop, a warjack with crippled cortex have no focus points on it so it can't do much at that turn. Stormclad can have 1 focus, and you may use Empower it, though, but still it can't be fully focused. Darius has Jackhammer, he can get around not allocating focus, see my example further up Ah... that's correct, indeed.
|
|