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Post by hocestbellum on Aug 29, 2018 11:14:29 GMT
I have some questions about your lists! I'm all in favour of Zerkova1 Armoured Corps, as I think it's a solid list that can deal with a lot of things. But why Atanas? And why Sylys?
Atanas' abilities seem mostly redundant; you have a source of better pathfinder, and you have better damage mitigation through the cloud wall and the feat. I'm not convinced you have enough models for Tactician to be worth it, and as such 7 points for Retaliatory Strike seems very steep. Given that you have two spare points that's a second Drakhun. Or another tanker and a unit of mechanics. Or something.
Sylys I've never found to be as useful as Ragman. You're hitting at P14, predominantly, so a damage boost is always useful. Zerkova only has the one Upkeep, and has a better range extender than Sylys. Sure, they stack for some lovely 17" Hex Blasts, but a 15" Hex is almost as good and allows you to cover the damage boosting hole that Zerkova has.
What sort of things would you be looking to use Hark to deal with?
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Post by welshhoppo on Aug 29, 2018 18:20:48 GMT
I have some questions about your lists! I'm all in favour of Zerkova1 Armoured Corps, as I think it's a solid list that can deal with a lot of things. But why Atanas? And why Sylys? Atanas' abilities seem mostly redundant; you have a source of better pathfinder, and you have better damage mitigation through the cloud wall and the feat. I'm not convinced you have enough models for Tactician to be worth it, and as such 7 points for Retaliatory Strike seems very steep. Given that you have two spare points that's a second Drakhun. Or another tanker and a unit of mechanics. Or something. Sylys I've never found to be as useful as Ragman. You're hitting at P14, predominantly, so a damage boost is always useful. Zerkova only has the one Upkeep, and has a better range extender than Sylys. Sure, they stack for some lovely 17" Hex Blasts, but a 15" Hex is almost as good and allows you to cover the damage boosting hole that Zerkova has. What sort of things would you be looking to use Hark to deal with? Ah you've discovered where my missing 2 points come from. Atanas was originally a Drakhun. I dropped him down and I also had ragman in there, but he became Sylys. Basically I found that my man o wars got stuck. I had a few games where a Hellmouth tentacle blocked up a unit, so having tactician is very handy. Also, the no knockdown tough really helps with the game plan, and retaliatory strike means that occasionally a man o war might kill what tries to kill it. Ragman man got dropped because I found that as the easiest model to kill, he'd often just die. Even with sac pawn, he was fall over dead and only affected one game. The free upkeep means that watcher can always be up and still allowing maximum cloud coverage. However he's mostly there for assassinations. Turns out Zerkova is really good at making warcasters stationary before throwing a second boosted spray at them and boosting her magic stick. Then a pair of boosted bombards. Then anything else I have. And Hark is my main drop. He goes into anything except Vyros, Legion and Rask.
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Post by michael on Sept 19, 2018 14:28:20 GMT
Ah you've discovered where my missing 2 points come from. Atanas was originally a Drakhun. I dropped him down and I also had ragman in there, but he became Sylys. Basically I found that my man o wars got stuck. I had a few games where a Hellmouth tentacle blocked up a unit, so having tactician is very handy. Also, the no knockdown tough really helps with the game plan, and retaliatory strike means that occasionally a man o war might kill what tries to kill it. Ragman man got dropped because I found that as the easiest model to kill, he'd often just die. Even with sac pawn, he was fall over dead and only affected one game. The free upkeep means that watcher can always be up and still allowing maximum cloud coverage. However he's mostly there for assassinations. Turns out Zerkova is really good at making warcasters stationary before throwing a second boosted spray at them and boosting her magic stick. Then a pair of boosted bombards. Then anything else I have. And Hark is my main drop. He goes into anything except Vyros, Legion and Rask. That is basically the reason I can’t stand Zerkova1. She has a great feat, and then absolutely nothing left in the tank after that. She relies on a very unreliable crit on Frost Hammer to have any meaningful personal impact after the feat. I also must face a lot of very fast armies, because I feel like Zerkova1’s cloud wall rarely does anything for me. I get some clouds out turn 1, and then my opponent seems to be in my face, and there’s no meaningful use of those clouds for the rest of the game. She seems to need to play midline due to her lack of arc nodes (or reliance on aiming/boosting for her gun to hit) and Watcher, but a 15/15 at midline is a death sentence for her.
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Post by thebuoyancyofwater on Sept 20, 2018 5:01:12 GMT
Remember those clouds give -2 to attack rolls too. So even if you're in walk and smack range you can give your guys +2 DEF.
Cheers, Dave
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Post by welshhoppo on Sept 20, 2018 6:54:15 GMT
I mean, I found Zerkova to be pretty decent, she only wants to cloud up prior to engaging, then she wants to be the model furthest up the field on feat turn, then she changes into an infantry blender the turns after that by throwing out all kinds of support. Sometimes just putting out three ghost walks and shooting something.
I am more than likely going to change her to Vlad2 or Sorscha3, I think she's slightly better in LoS, but as that theme seems somewhat incomplete at this moment in time, I'm going to try out someone else.
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Post by michael on Sept 21, 2018 12:55:46 GMT
Remember those clouds give -2 to attack rolls too. So even if you're in walk and smack range you can give your guys +2 DEF. Cheers, Dave I have tried to leverage that, but it never seems to gel in practice. I tend to find that I am better off allocating to my jacks and killing stuff instead of hoping that +2 DEF proves meaningful.
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Post by michael on Sept 21, 2018 13:03:08 GMT
I mean, I found Zerkova to be pretty decent, she only wants to cloud up prior to engaging, then she wants to be the model furthest up the field on feat turn, then she changes into an infantry blender the turns after that by throwing out all kinds of support. Sometimes just putting out three ghost walks and shooting something. I am more than likely going to change her to Vlad2 or Sorscha3, I think she's slightly better in LoS, but as that theme seems somewhat incomplete at this moment in time, I'm going to try out someone else. Welsh, Your turn 1 and 2 experiences mirror my own, but the “infantry blender” part does not. After feat turn, I usually find that Z1 can’t safely secure the threat zone around her. Once she’s up front but no longer protected by her feat, she tends to want to do multiple things simultaneously (blast somebody into an arc node with her gun, cast Frost Hammer, cast Hex Blast, allocate, camp) but lacks sufficient resources to do more than one of those things, and needs to beat a rapid retreat out of the enemy’s face on T3 or face certain death. That leaves her out of position on T4+ to do any of the above, and she becomes a no-support caster who can only meaningfully influence the game by allocating. I have found, time and time again, that she has a fantastic feat but that she is dead weight in my army after feat turn. I would be interested to see how it plays out differently for you. I’ve been trying to make Z1 work for nine years now.
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Post by welshhoppo on Sept 21, 2018 14:16:14 GMT
I mean 15/15 isn't that bad at keeping her safe from small arms fire. It is all about finding the best spot 10 inches away, turning a scmuck into an arc node and then sending out a pair of frost bites.
Also, in a rare rare rare so rare it's double rare event, here is me on an actual stream.
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mrtuna
Junior Strategist
Posts: 117
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Post by mrtuna on Jan 24, 2019 22:04:00 GMT
Hoppo we miss you
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