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Post by Ajax on May 31, 2017 0:33:55 GMT
Just a general discussion thread on Kara Sloan: How are people building her these days? Heavy Metal? Out of theme? How is she doing in the meta?
What do people typically build her to answer? Or does she only "ask" can you survive all the guns?New to the faction, not the game, but I'm not really sure how to approach her without defaulting to hunter shenanigans, and gunline lists aren't really something I'm used to coming from Trolls. Are there any tips/tricks that might not be immediately apparent to a new player, or should I just hope to shoot enough off the table before engagement to make attrition easy? Here's what I'm planning on playing this week: conflictchamber.com/#c1201b_-0n9a9E9E9k9kc0akazanaj9bCygnar Army - 74 / 75 points [Theme] Heavy Metal (Sloan 1) Captain Kara Sloan [+28] - Defender [16] - Defender [16] - Hunter [11] - Hunter [11] - Stormwall [39] - Squire [0(5)] Archduke Alain Runewood, Lord of Fharin [0(4)] Captain Arlan Strangewayes [0(4)] Journeyman Warcaster [0(4)] - Charger [9] |
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Post by Stormsmith Dropout on May 31, 2017 0:51:07 GMT
I'm toying with the absurd idea of Sloan of the Tempest.
Sloan 28*
-Defender 16
-Defender 16
-Hunter 11
-Hunter 11
-Hunter 11
-Charger 9
-Charger 9
Atgmp 11
Gun mage rifleman 4
Gmca 5
Gmca 0
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Post by Mydnight on May 31, 2017 5:19:59 GMT
My question is Sloan vs Caine3.
Caine 3 has magesight and generally superior firepower.
Kara has better range but that's pretty much it. Maybe she does better against a lower armour list relative to Caine3?
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Post by 36cygnar24guy36 on May 31, 2017 10:13:12 GMT
I played Sloan in my list pair for a fair while, but have now switched to Caine 3 for now, my Sloan list was:
Heavy Metal
Sloan
- Squire
- Stormwall
- Hunter
- Hunter
- Firefly
- Firefly
- Charger
- Charger
Arlan
Runewood
Junior
- Sentinel
The biggest drawback of Sloan I have found is that if your dice abandon you on the feat turn, then you are in for a very bad time, boosted rat 6s and 7s will still miss things with high enough defense, Warpwolves and Angelius in cover, Cryx Stalkers in cover, Dug in Barathrum, Ferox under Krea animus and Deflection. Caine 3 on the other hand with his feat can practically remove hitting from the equation, boosted rat 9s and 11s (against Calamity target) are unlikely to miss ever, even when shooting into melee.
Sloan is advantaged over Caine 3 in some match ups though due to her longer threat ranges, into Cygnar for example and Kreuger 2.
where Caine is going to pip her though I think is in the new Steamroller packet and the terrain guidelines, having the almost mandatory LOS blocking terrain in the centre, if it is forest it is happy days for Caine, whereas Sloan can only cry.
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Post by Ajax on Jun 1, 2017 15:34:28 GMT
Has anyone done the actual math between Caine vs. Sloan regarding damage output on similar lists? I'd imagine that the damage is about the same, since Sloan is doubling up on the number of shots that she's putting out, but that's all speculation. You make a good point about very high def models... and yes, the list is quite dice dependent on hitting.
That being said, how do we think she'll fare in SR2017? Seems like gunline/attrition lists will have a bit of an advantage overall, and at least for the games that I've played, I haven't noticed that the middle LOS blocking terrain has hurt too much (I think because my local store was playing it that way anyway).
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Post by 36cygnar24guy36 on Jun 1, 2017 16:19:41 GMT
Has anyone done the actual math between Caine vs. Sloan regarding damage output on similar lists? I'd imagine that the damage is about the same, since Sloan is doubling up on the number of shots that she's putting out, but that's all speculation. You make a good point about very high def models... and yes, the list is quite dice dependent on hitting. That being said, how do we think she'll fare in SR2017? Seems like gunline/attrition lists will have a bit of an advantage overall, and at least for the games that I've played, I haven't noticed that the middle LOS blocking terrain has hurt too much (I think because my local store was playing it that way anyway). I have not done the maths in detail, but let's say you compare a Charger on Caine to a Defender on Sloan, on feat turn they each get 2 x pow 15 shots. The Charger gets a boosted rat 9 and an unboosted rat 9, Sloan gets 2 boosted rat 6 (assuming she cast guided fire), they each have 1 boosted damage roll. Now for me the Charger wins hands down in terms of damage output on the feat, as it is 7 points cheaper |
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Post by danfromchicago on Jun 1, 2017 20:34:09 GMT
In order to do the math you need to know the target. Expected damage is a sum of probabilities.
That said, Math doesn't say anything about the board state. The Defenders with Sloan should hit first. Depending on positioning, it could be possible to take a few chargers off the table without suffering any meaningful retaliation. It would be impossible to say without seeing the board, knowing who went first and so on.
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Post by octaviusmaximus on Jun 1, 2017 21:58:09 GMT
In order to do the math you need to know the target. Expected damage is a sum of probabilities. That said, Math doesn't say anything about the board state. The Defenders with Sloan should hit first. Depending on positioning, it could be possible to take a few chargers off the table without suffering any meaningful retaliation. It would be impossible to say without seeing the board, knowing who went first and so on. Taking chargers off the board without retaliation? Who is doing that? Last night I played Caine 3 a few times. I killed fyanna, who was 2" out of her deployment and behind a wall and camping 2 focus on the top of 2. I then killed karchev, camping 6 and behind a wall of heavies, on the top of 2. I never pulled that off with Kara because people could abuse terrain and model blocking in a way that she couldn't account for unless she wasn't playing theme (and even then, meh). Caine is easily the better Kara as so far he threatens people far more and can use chargers more efficiently than kara can, and thr charger is the best gun jack in the faction. |
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Post by 36cygnar24guy36 on Jun 2, 2017 8:10:36 GMT
I think there is some confusion here, some people are talking about Caine vs Sloan in a head to head fight, and some are talking about Caine vs Sloan with regards to who is better in you list pair.
I think Caine is better for your list pair, but that Sloan would win a head to head vs Caine.
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