Growl
Junior Strategist
Posts: 496
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Post by Growl on Sept 6, 2019 21:11:20 GMT
I was playing with 3 Marauders and they were ok, but realize that with a little change I can have some left over points, but then stuck with what to do? This is what I have so far;
War Room Army
Khador - Vlad2 Wolves Obliv (copy)
Theme: Wolves of Winter 69 / 75 Army
Vladimir Tzepesci, The Dark Champion - WJ: +27 - Greylord Adjunct - PC: 0 - Marauder - PC: 11 (Battlegroup Points Used: 11) - Ruin - PC: 17 (Battlegroup Points Used: 16)
Koldun Lord - PC: 0 Koldun Lord - PC: 0
Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 - Greylord Escort - PC: 3 Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 - Greylord Escort - PC: 3 Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 Greylord Outriders - Leader & 4 Grunts: 17 Kayazy Eliminators - Leader & Grunt: 5
THEME: Wolves of Winter
Any thoughts on what I could switch around or add? I was debating dropping the escorts, but still don’t know what I would do with the points?
edit: are eliminators really necessary, I do love them btw, or min outriders? But still, then what?
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Post by Armchair Warrior on Sept 6, 2019 21:27:25 GMT
Growl, well, you’ve got lots of choices there. Some ideas: - Upgrade the Marauder to a Destroyer (3 pts), and add one UA (3 pts). - Pay for one of your solos (4 pts), and take a free Ternion. Use your remaining 2 pts to upgrade the Marauder to a Kodiak. - If you dump the eliminators, you can add in a 5th unit of Doomreavers, which I like. You still have a point left over... Go Grolar, or 2 14pt jacks. If you want to keep the eliminators with this build, you might consider paying 4 points for Saxon since you didn’t use up a merc slot, which then brings me back to the Kodiak for the pathfinder and heavy boiler.
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Growl
Junior Strategist
Posts: 496
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Post by Growl on Sept 6, 2019 22:05:59 GMT
@armchair warrior great suggestions! I felt the Marauder was good still as a threat to Huge Bases, plus potential for slams and stuff, switching in Ruin I thought was good for potential self fueling, spell denial, reach, and dispel. I love the Grolar, and the potential for him I think is pretty good. The eliminators are such great models, but in the few games I’ve played with them, they haven’t done much at all, which is mostly my fault, but they weren’t needed. So I was feeling like maybe they were redundant points. Saxon is a good idea, but just for pathfinder, seems like a lot of points, but of course could be worth it when needed. I noticed you didn’t touch the outriders. You think a full unit is worth it?
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Growl
Junior Strategist
Posts: 496
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Post by Growl on Sept 6, 2019 22:31:32 GMT
What about this?
War Room Army
Khador - Vlad2 Wolves Obliv (copy)
Theme: Wolves of Winter 75 / 75 Army
Vladimir Tzepesci, The Dark Champion - WJ: +27 - Greylord Adjunct - PC: 4 - Marauder - PC: 11 (Battlegroup Points Used: 11) - Ruin - PC: 17 (Battlegroup Points Used: 16)
Koldun Lord - PC: 0 Koldun Lord - PC: 0 Saxon Orrik - PC: 4
Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 - Greylord Escort - PC: 3 Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 - Greylord Escort - PC: 3 Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 Greylord Outriders - Leader & 2 Grunts: 10 Greylord Ternion - Leader & 2 Grunts: 0 Kayazy Eliminators - Leader & Grunt: 5 Kayazy Eliminators - Leader & Grunt: 5
THEME: Wolves of WInter
The ternions can put clouds on the eliminators and the eliminators can run forward 14” to set up a cloud wall. This keeps them central and therefore a threat for FEAT and such, and they can be hard to remove. A good AOE will get them of course, but most other shooting should have a hard time, in the meanwhile, reavers or whatever can be safe behind. Saxon is there for pathfinder and flag scoring. 3 outriders is less than 5, but can still get work done.
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sorokin
Junior Strategist
Posts: 775
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Post by sorokin on Sept 6, 2019 22:47:14 GMT
I will take the PS4... you can keep the kid. Admittedly Crucible Guard does not have a huge presence in my meta; mostly Elves/Circle/Trolls/Scorn and Cygnar. Fenris is probably the weakest model in the list as my opponents have learned to pop the revers once they fall over, but what to replace him with? He does a good job of wandering around with Alexia and keeping their bubbles overlapping. A second Koldun Lord would be nice, and maybe another solo. The Void Archon costs just as much and brings another damage buff. Its also extremely mobile.
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Post by sand20go on Sept 6, 2019 22:47:24 GMT
What about this? War Room Army Khador - Vlad2 Wolves Obliv (copy) Theme: Wolves of Winter 75 / 75 Army Vladimir Tzepesci, The Dark Champion - WJ: +27 - Greylord Adjunct - PC: 4 - Marauder - PC: 11 (Battlegroup Points Used: 11) - Ruin - PC: 17 (Battlegroup Points Used: 16) Koldun Lord - PC: 0 Koldun Lord - PC: 0 Saxon Orrik - PC: 4 Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 - Greylord Escort - PC: 3 Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 - Greylord Escort - PC: 3 Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 Greylord Outriders - Leader & 2 Grunts: 10 Greylord Ternion - Leader & 2 Grunts: 0 Kayazy Eliminators - Leader & Grunt: 5 Kayazy Eliminators - Leader & Grunt: 5 THEME: Wolves of WInter The ternions can put clouds on the eliminators and the eliminators can run forward 14” to set up a cloud wall. This keeps them central and therefore a threat for FEAT and such, and they can be hard to remove. A good AOE will get them of course, but most other shooting should have a hard time, in the meanwhile, reavers or whatever can be safe behind. Saxon is there for pathfinder and flag scoring. 3 outriders is less than 5, but can still get work done. You can only bring one unit of eliminators as your merc option in Wolves (sadly)
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Growl
Junior Strategist
Posts: 496
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Post by Growl on Sept 7, 2019 1:22:27 GMT
sand20go ack! I knew something didn’t seem right. How’s the rest of the list look? edit: changed it to this; War Room Army Khador - Vlad2 Wolves Obliv (copy) Theme: Wolves of Winter 75 / 75 Army Vladimir Tzepesci, The Dark Champion - WJ: +27 - Greylord Adjunct - PC: 4 - Marauder - PC: 11 (Battlegroup Points Used: 11) - Grolar - PC: 18 (Battlegroup Points Used: 16) Koldun Lord - PC: 0 Koldun Lord - PC: 0 Fenris - PC: 8 - Fenris (Continued) Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 - Greylord Escort - PC: 3 Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 - Greylord Escort - PC: 3 Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 Greylord Outriders - Leader & 2 Grunts: 10 Greylord Ternion - Leader & 2 Grunts: 0 Kayazy Eliminators - Leader & Grunt: 5 THEME: Wolves of Winter --- GENERATED : 09/06/2019 21:25:49 BUILD ID : 2089.19-07-18
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Post by sand20go on Sept 7, 2019 1:36:21 GMT
Should work. Only points I would watch with table time is the adjunct and if you feel you get value from him in your meta. You could upgrade (for what this list does well in scenario play) the maurader to a devestator. But that change is not a no brainer.....you need to feel I think what you like.
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Growl
Junior Strategist
Posts: 496
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Post by Growl on Sept 7, 2019 11:17:27 GMT
sorokin weird btw, I cannot find the void archon on my Warroom?
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Post by Armchair Warrior on Sept 7, 2019 13:06:56 GMT
Growl, the Void Archon hasn’t been pre-released yet so it’s not in Warroom, although we’ve seen the 3D render. We’re all just speculating based on its final rules in CID. In general, I think there are a lot of sideways way to shuffle the pieces around in a Wolves list so a lot of it comes down to taste and personal preference. For instance, I’d rather have a 5th unit of doomreavers than max out the Outriders in my Vlad 2 list. I don’t think either answer is wrong. I believe the same thing is true about including the Elininators. They’re the cost of a half a unit of Doomreavers, so you can add them or set aside more points for more doomreavers. I think they’re both good answers. In general, I like the list you’ve posted. I think the Eliminators and Fenris are great targets for the Ternion clouds (the Eliminators because they’re stealth units and hard to shoot absent sprays) and Fenris because he doesn’t like getting shot in the first place. The jack package is tight. Personal preference again, but I like adding either Fenris or Alexia 2 over 2 more Outriders. Give it a whirl!
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sorokin
Junior Strategist
Posts: 775
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Post by sorokin on Sept 7, 2019 13:26:04 GMT
sorokin weird btw, I cannot find the void archon on my Warroom? Which is why i dont use warroom for list building
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Growl
Junior Strategist
Posts: 496
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Post by Growl on Sept 8, 2019 12:24:24 GMT
Ok I’ve gone mad! I was thinking that one of the problems I’ve been facing with my wolves list, is getting enough reavers etc up the board under shooting lists, or lists with long threat ranges etc. the eliminators are great, but die easily to AOEs so even if I put a cloud on them from ternions, opponents don’t even have to hit them. So I was thinking this, which is an idea I’ve been trying to make work for like ever;
War Room Army
Khador - Vlad2 Wolves Obliv (copy)
Theme: Wolves of Winter 75 / 75 Army
Vladimir Tzepesci, The Dark Champion - WJ: +27 - Greylord Adjunct - PC: 4 - Demolisher - PC: 16 (Battlegroup Points Used: 16) - Juggernaut - PC: 13 (Battlegroup Points Used: 11)
Koldun Lord - PC: 0 Koldun Lord - PC: 0 Fenris - PC: 8 - Fenris (Continued)
Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 - Greylord Escort - PC: 3 Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 - Greylord Escort - PC: 3 Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 Greylord Outriders - Leader & 2 Grunts: 10 Greylord Ternion - Leader & 2 Grunts: 0 Kayazy Eliminators - Leader & Grunt: 5
THEME: Wolves of Winter
Ternions put clouds on the eliminators and one other thing, (maybe an Out rider?), assail on the Demolisher who trampled forward 10”, eliminators run up to either side of the demolisher, B2B of course, now can’t be hurt by blasts, and provide like a 5” or so screen, plus the outrider if used, and whatever LOS blocking terrain piece there is out there. I haven’t worked out all the math, but with good positioning, you could even have the eliminators block charges against the demolisher while being B2B against 1” threat melee dudes. In the meantime, you have centrally located murder girls who are “relatively” safe and are good FEAT targets, and a bunch of bad things behind your screen, like Fenris, or a bunch of doomreavers etc. it would slow down your approach a little, but I think it would be very difficult for many lists to crack, especially because Vlad could put a Wind Blast or 2 out in front to prevent long range Sprays as well. Oh well, just thoughts...
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Post by Soul Samurai on Sept 8, 2019 12:55:23 GMT
Does Stealth still do anything these days? I have a vague impression that most armies now have caster-independant ways to ignore Stealth? Or is that just us and Cygnar?
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Growl
Junior Strategist
Posts: 496
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Post by Growl on Sept 8, 2019 14:37:15 GMT
@soul samurai I’m not sure if your comment on stealth was in response to my previous post, but in case it was, I was not implying that the eliminators are impossible to hurt, just that it would be tougher to remove them, and therefore the ternion clouds have a better chance of lasting and helping the army move forward. I do believe there are lots of things out there now that can remove stealth. Again a couple of wind Blasts could also help to make those kinds of shots extra difficult. Likewise, if something tries to melee the eliminators, they are a robust def17 in combat.
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Post by Armchair Warrior on Sept 8, 2019 14:48:30 GMT
Against lists without sprays, you’re probably OK with that tech. After putting Assail on the demolisher, you can essentially send them and the eliminators off to independently hold some zone while the rest of the army does work.
Can someone explain to me why the damn Demnolisher opens up when it uses its guns? Does it need to spread its arms for balance?
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