Growl
Junior Strategist
Posts: 496
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Post by Growl on Aug 9, 2019 13:07:19 GMT
If a model has a negative upkeep on it, that removes pathfinder, would casting boundless charge on that model give it pathfinder for that turn, or does the upkeep still win out?
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Post by auraco on Aug 9, 2019 13:10:51 GMT
It depends on how it's worded, Transmute from Syvestro says lose pathfinder, but it doesn't prevent gaining it afterward, so things like relentless charge or boundless charge would get around it. Stuff like Baldur1's feat are worded differently, his feat say never have pathfinder, so it would prevent gaining it from boundless charge or relentless charge.
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Growl
Junior Strategist
Posts: 496
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Post by Growl on Aug 9, 2019 13:15:28 GMT
Your example of Sylvester was the exact situation. Hmmm, thanks.
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Post by steeltitan on Aug 9, 2019 13:45:45 GMT
Im sad to hear you have to fight Syvestro...
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Post by auraco on Aug 9, 2019 13:47:59 GMT
This is how we've been playing it in my area and how I've seen it ruled at the different cons I've been to, the privateer press rule forum might get you something more official than that though.
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Post by auraco on Aug 9, 2019 13:51:01 GMT
Im sad to hear you have to fight Syvestro... Is it that bad? Played twice against him so far, not easy matched, but I won both. I guess it depends on the exact list.
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Post by hocestbellum on Aug 9, 2019 14:00:19 GMT
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Post by michael on Aug 9, 2019 15:16:51 GMT
Let’s not use MK II rulings. The definitive answer is: if the effect says “loses”, then you lose it, but nothing prevents you from gaining it again. If something says “loses and cannot gain”, then you lose it and can’t get it back for the duration of the spell/feat/whatever. Baldur1’s feat is the archetypal example of this. The official rules forum ought to have dozens of current threads with this exact same answer...
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Post by hocestbellum on Aug 9, 2019 15:28:01 GMT
Hah, oops, not paying enough attention. Here you go:
LINK
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Post by michael on Aug 9, 2019 15:31:59 GMT
Thanks! I hate trying to use the search function when on a phone...
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Post by sand20go on Aug 9, 2019 22:00:53 GMT
Im sad to hear you have to fight Syvestro... Is it that bad? Played twice against him so far, not easy matched, but I won both. I guess it depends on the exact list. I think the best way he runs is with double railless, arc node, and then a tarpit unit (either halbies or rocketmen). It allows him to keep the assassination threat live and, with "sprays for days", remove a good chuck of models on feat. He wants to also have his debuffers (staple in CG): DBRs, The Supressor, and if points allow Gorman/Hutchuck which means most of our ARM 20 stuff is now ARM 18. It isn't nasty across the WHOLE meta but stinks into Khador.
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Juris
Junior Strategist
Posts: 578
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Post by Juris on Aug 12, 2019 17:34:02 GMT
Is it that bad? Played twice against him so far, not easy matched, but I won both. I guess it depends on the exact list. I think the best way he runs is with double railless, arc node, and then a tarpit unit (either halbies or rocketmen). It allows him to keep the assassination threat live and, with "sprays for days", remove a good chuck of models on feat. He wants to also have his debuffers (staple in CG): DBRs, The Supressor, and if points allow Gorman/Hutchuck which means most of our ARM 20 stuff is now ARM 18. It isn't nasty across the WHOLE meta but stinks into Khador. Prepare now for -4 ARM. The Hermit of Hengehold is here.
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Post by sand20go on Aug 12, 2019 17:38:31 GMT
I think the best way he runs is with double railless, arc node, and then a tarpit unit (either halbies or rocketmen). It allows him to keep the assassination threat live and, with "sprays for days", remove a good chuck of models on feat. He wants to also have his debuffers (staple in CG): DBRs, The Supressor, and if points allow Gorman/Hutchuck which means most of our ARM 20 stuff is now ARM 18. It isn't nasty across the WHOLE meta but stinks into Khador. Prepare now for -4 ARM. The Hermit of Hengehold is here. Yup. Do you get him for free? I would think the biggest challenge is keeping him alive - though having someone put 6 shots into him is 6 shots not into a railless. but that said I think you have to bite the bullet and take those shots. You can't allow the 2 raillesses to spray at arm -4 under syvestro's feat. Sucks but I think that is demanded.
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Juris
Junior Strategist
Posts: 578
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Post by Juris on Aug 12, 2019 17:43:03 GMT
Prepare now for -4 ARM. The Hermit of Hengehold is here. Yup. Do you get him for free? I would think the biggest challenge is keeping him alive - though having someone put 6 shots into him is 6 shots not into a railless. but that said I think you have to bite the bullet and take those shots. You can't allow the 2 raillesses to spray at arm -4 under syvestro's feat. Sucks but I think that is demanded. You don't get him for free. You have to spend his 5 points. But I agree, you must kill him when you can; if the CG player get's a turn in the mid-game where they can do a -4 ARM swing on your hard target(s) and attack them with all the sprays...that's bad.
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Post by sand20go on Aug 12, 2019 18:03:08 GMT
Yup. Do you get him for free? I would think the biggest challenge is keeping him alive - though having someone put 6 shots into him is 6 shots not into a railless. but that said I think you have to bite the bullet and take those shots. You can't allow the 2 raillesses to spray at arm -4 under syvestro's feat. Sucks but I think that is demanded. You don't get him for free. You have to spend his 5 points. But I agree, you must kill him when you can; if the CG player get's a turn in the mid-game where they can do a -4 ARM swing on your hard target(s) and attack them with all the sprays...that's bad. The good news is that if you can see him you shoudl be able to hit and damage him. _AND_ without a weapon he is stuck at sp5. Absent putting transmute on him his lack of pathfinder becomes an additional challenge. Guess? He is going to fall into a pattern of being put someplace in a forest or behind a building and then coming forth around turn 3-4 _IF_ the lines are on your side of the table to skew things over. I guess you could run him as a missile - but again, I think that players who understand what he does will look to kill him quickly.....and Damm if Hordes players are not going to be really irritate when they read about that "no forcing" rule ;-)
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