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Post by lorddragonmaster on Apr 23, 2019 17:19:21 GMT
I know OW2 limits the range on their guns by -5", but who it the next best? I am running JAWS (Hark) & AC (Vlad2), but seem to get shot off the table by GC. Sprays are killing me. Even my guns are counted when Makay runs double shield guard and can absorb 4 shots off the Vulcan. conflictchamber.com/?c3201b_-0T77f8njl5l4l3l3l2l7l17QgdjJKhador Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] Armored Corps [Vladimir 2] Vladimir Tzepesci, the Dark Champion [+27] - Victor [34] - Greylord Adjunct [4] Man-O-War Kovnik [4] Man-O-War Strike Tanker [5] Man-O-War Suppression Tanker [0(6)] Man-O-War Suppression Tanker [0(6)] Kommandant Atanas Arconovich & Standard [7] Man-O-War Demolition Corps (max) [14] - Sergeant Dragos Dragadovich [0(6)] Man-O-War Shocktroopers (max) [16] - Man-O-War Shocktrooper Officer [4] Man-O-War Assault Chariot [14]
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Post by auraco on Apr 23, 2019 18:35:57 GMT
It really depends on the exact list on the other side of the table. I've played Vlad2 Wolves into a couple of Crucible guard list and done fine, but I haven't played against Gearhart with crucible guard infantry, that list would be a terrible match up for Vlad2 wolves.
Clouds can work to a limited extent, but it depends on the CG list, guidance is limited to the one model. If they have the light jack that can remove clouds it gets harder.
Vlad2 is generally speaking weak into guns, and I don't think Vlad2 especially with a chariot (very vulnerable to shooting) is the right list to play in a match up that tends to be gun centric.
Our best casters to play into guns are Old Witch2, Zerkova1 and Sorscha3. Old witch2 and Zerkova can be build in different theme and work well here, Sorscha3 is pretty much limited to playing in Armored corps considering her kit.
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Post by sand20go on Apr 23, 2019 19:44:03 GMT
It really depends on the exact list on the other side of the table. I've played Vlad2 Wolves into a couple of Crucible guard list and done fine, but I haven't played against Gearhart with crucible guard infantry, that list would be a terrible match up for Vlad2 wolves. Clouds can work to a limited extent, but it depends on the CG list, guidance is limited to the one model. If they have the light jack that can remove clouds it gets harder. Vlad2 is generally speaking weak into guns, and I don't think Vlad2 especially with a chariot (very vulnerable to shooting) is the right list to play in a match up that tends to be gun centric. Our best casters to play into guns are Old Witch2, Zerkova1 and Sorscha3. Old witch2 and Zerkova can be build in different theme and work well here, Sorscha3 is pretty much limited to playing in Armored corps considering her kit. It is a painful match up. The problem with "AC" is that GENERALLY the list likes to bunch up and if you bunch up that just sets things up for the Railless+Slyvestro and DBRs to live the dream. In a lot of ways it is a match up that requires patience and practice. Also keep in mind that Slyvestro is likely casing purify for free (that is SO fair PP) so no IF on the S3's AC and then it is likely that a DBR is getting buffed by Alyce (so igores the clouds. Fairly easy (depending on positioning) for either/both/all the Railless and the Supression tankers to exploit Superfuel if/when he doesn't cast Purify for free to get into your cloud wall and spray for days.
OW2 As Auraco Said the OW2 lists (I think in any of the themes) is good because it reduces DBR effectiveness - both in respect to potentially minimizing range as well as getting to dictate which direction the blast deviates toward. Probably your first choice - as long as you have SOMETHING that hurts the effectiveness of Locke+Redline+Jackhammer kills on her. Her problem is the Rocketmen in that variant - you have to figure out in the kit how you deal with DEF 18 rocket being extremely irritating jammers. They are not doing Anything else under windstorm but they are contesting and jamming you. Kodiaks would seem viable - both because of vent steam and then the fact that she can help a bit with their power by cursing a target they would like to go after.
Vlad2. I think there is a way to play him which works but I think you have to build with CG in mind. You want at least 2 (maybe more) shield guards so that they can't tag you with DBRs and then you have to be both good (and smart) about the pieplates of no shooting. Need the adjunct as well as you can maximize focus and upkeeps. The attractiveness of Vlad2 is that he gets around a key number - 13 - which is the distance the Railless can be if they zap you with the 2 pow 14 sprays and then rep back. Having a threat of at least 13+ really helps with that. That is OW2's problem - you probably have to count on your jacks taking 2 turns of rust+sprays before they get into the mix. ONce they do they are in good shape but that is 2 turns which are going to be painful if they are smart about how they focus their attacks in to do work.
Zerkova Not a great answer. Lacks the Def fixer AND while her feat says no shooting Gearheart can be out of that. Clouds help a bit but are not perfect. Also with Superfuel/Jackhammer you have some vulnerabilities to their WALKING and running from outside of feat to get to her - forcing you to position a bit further back and thus reducing its effectiveness. I tried it a number of times - found it not as good on paper as it was in practice.
Butcher3 Current test candidate. The idea here is that the puppies create some serious deterrence. You can put them B2B with things that the DBR would like to shoot or position them in a way as to make it more difficult for the Railless (even with Bulldoze) to get into ideal position. He can handles the rocketmen and has silence of death for the Halbies+Morely combo. You do need a shield guard (or sac pawn) so you can avoid him getting debuffed with the rocket - Sylvestro is fully capable of shooting him off the table and easily (with superfuel) has the threat range to get there.
Now your mileage will vary. This is experiences playing into a top tier player (Juris). My mileage has been better against less skilled CG players. But if they understand how to leverage the kitting/debuff game (their advantage against us, IMHO) then you need to think about how you threaten the Raillesses after they repo, how you stop some of the longer range sprays and how you keep your casters safe from both DBR debuff+shooting and then Redline Running Jackhammers.
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Post by steeltitan on Apr 24, 2019 9:05:18 GMT
I've been brain storming on how to solve CG in my own recent thread here: lormahordes.freeforums.net/thread/8810/khador-crucible-guard-solving-problemsYou might find it useful to read through. Generally, I think CG is a bad match-up for Khador. Their high POW sprays make playing our infantry themes a bad decision and their ARM debuffs takes away the main strength of our Jack theme(s). So, bad overall. At the same time, they can play a strong scenario game, with things like Trancers, super hard Halbediers and bully zones with tough huge bases. I think any theme but Jaws (or maybe Jack-heavy WGK but I haven't tried that) will struggle real hard. Apart from Jaws (taking away ambush on Hutchuck and Anastasia is real nice and helps you on scenario), I've only tried Legion of Steel, just to try a more infantry focused list and it was the worst game I've ever played. I believe that was into McKay. The caster I've played against most often is Syvestro. I've played OW2 into CG most. Playing Jack heavy mitigates some of their tech (DBRs) and if you run enough of them, they can only rust and remove so many of them before you get to move in. It will help knowing what variant of CG you will go up against because they all have their own strengths into Khador. Part of the reason why I've been unsuccessful with OW2 is because I didn't manage to play late-game before clocking myself. I feel that, depending on how the game goes, late game is where you win. I've never managed to score early game and the games starting tipping SLIGHTLY in my favour (if you can call it that...maybe it would be more accurate to call it 'I wasn't losing quite so badly') around turn 4+. Thing is, you need a lot of Jacks to make it that far though as Syvestro, McKay and Gearhart can all remove 2-3 Jacks on feat turn. What i noticed though is that, as I got better playing late-game, OW2 wasn't strong enough. This is why I am now running B3 Jaws. The approach might hurt a little more (but hey, Windstorm didn't do anything versus those Sprays anyway and the AOEs aren't hurting our Jacks that much anyway) but once you get to the later turns, the combination of your left-over Jacks and B3 can really start to swing the game...this is based on limited experience however, because I just recently switched.
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Post by sand20go on Apr 24, 2019 19:12:21 GMT
I've been brain storming on how to solve CG in my own recent thread here: lormahordes.freeforums.net/thread/8810/khador-crucible-guard-solving-problemsYou might find it useful to read through. Generally, I think CG is a bad match-up for Khador. Their high POW sprays make playing our infantry themes a bad decision and their ARM debuffs takes away the main strength of our Jack theme(s). So, bad overall. At the same time, they can play a strong scenario game, with things like Trancers, super hard Halbediers and bully zones with tough huge bases. I think any theme but Jaws (or maybe Jack-heavy WGK but I haven't tried that) will struggle real hard. Apart from Jaws (taking away ambush on Hutchuck and Anastasia is real nice and helps you on scenario), I've only tried Legion of Steel, just to try a more infantry focused list and it was the worst game I've ever played. I believe that was into McKay. The caster I've played against most often is Syvestro. I've played OW2 into CG most. Playing Jack heavy mitigates some of their tech (DBRs) and if you run enough of them, they can only rust and remove so many of them before you get to move in. It will help knowing what variant of CG you will go up against because they all have their own strengths into Khador. Part of the reason why I've been unsuccessful with OW2 is because I didn't manage to play late-game before clocking myself. I feel that, depending on how the game goes, late game is where you win. I've never managed to score early game and the games starting tipping SLIGHTLY in my favour (if you can call it that...maybe it would be more accurate to call it 'I wasn't losing quite so badly') around turn 4+. Thing is, you need a lot of Jacks to make it that far though as Syvestro, McKay and Gearhart can all remove 2-3 Jacks on feat turn. What i noticed though is that, as I got better playing late-game, OW2 wasn't strong enough. This is why I am now running B3 Jaws. The approach might hurt a little more (but hey, Windstorm didn't do anything versus those Sprays anyway and the AOEs aren't hurting our Jacks that much anyway) but once you get to the later turns, the combination of your left-over Jacks and B3 can really start to swing the game...this is based on limited experience however, because I just recently switched. This is my thinking as well and my experience. Here is what I am CURRENTLY trying to test. Not sure it is right but my current test. conflictchamber.com/?c3201b_-0xdI7qkW7snmhFe3kUlOkZ9uchKhador Army - 71 / 75 points [Theme] Jaws of the Wolf [Butcher 3] Kommander Zoktavir, the Butcher Unleashed [+22] - Devastator [14] - Juggernaut [13] - Kodiak [13] - Ruin [17] Greylord Forge Seer [0(4)] Kovnik Andrei Malakov [0(4)] - Spriggan [17] Kovnik Apprentice Kratikoff [0(4)] - Rager [10] Ragman [4] Kayazy Eliminators [5] The Spriggan and Ruin give me 2 jacks which can threaten 13 so I can try to keep the railless semi-honest - ESPECIALLY if I put the Argus in front of them and then try to scare away the sprays. Rags is there so that if Butcher needs to go in and kill the Vulcan under Locke he can help and try to keep Butcher from having to blow his entire feat stack. Kodiak in the BG because it worked out for points _AND_ because they are good rocketmen and fairly good into Halbies. Devestator there to be a road block so the railless or the vulcan can not bulldoze with impunity. Arguably 9 points are questionable (the eliminators and the ForgeSeer). My thinking there is that you can use the elminators to try to minimize how much he gets up on points early (which he will because of how fast the army is under superfuel) and the ForgeSeer there so that Butcher is not focus starved and can still effectively camp. But arguably you could lose them and consider how to squeeze in Big Behemoth. Thoughts?
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Ganso
Junior Strategist
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Post by Ganso on Apr 24, 2019 20:40:07 GMT
I ran this at Kingdom Con, I left a few points out cause the list is going through changes after I got feedback at the con [Butcher 3] Kommander Zoktavir, the Butcher Unleashed [+22] - Marauder [11] - Marauder [11] - Ruin [17] - Greylord Adjunct [0(4)] Greylord Forge Seer [0(4)] - Behemoth [25] Greylord Forge Seer [0(4)] Kovnik Apprentice Kratikoff [4] - Marauder [11] Kayazy Eliminators [5] Kayazy Eliminators [5]
I went up against 2 very good CG players, both of whom qualified for Masters, and one of which ultimately ended up winning the whole thing. I lost both games, but both were very informative and I never felt my list choices were putting me at a disadvantage. Game 1 was vs Juris, who won KC Masters this year. He helped me see that I was too aggressive with my list and that I should mind the DFRs more. In game 2 some bad Target priority on my part meant that one Combat Alchemist was left alive, which was enough to Freeze my marshaled Behemoth, which put him out of commission for a round, and allowed the Vulcan to get closer It was a pretty cool game, there was some piece trading and position decisions that made it interesting. That player also qualified and I left feeling confident with my built.
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Post by sand20go on Apr 24, 2019 20:47:42 GMT
I ran this at Kingdom Con, I left a few points out cause the list is going through changes after I got feedback at the con [Butcher 3] Kommander Zoktavir, the Butcher Unleashed [+22] - Marauder [11] - Marauder [11] - Ruin [17] - Greylord Adjunct [0(4)] Greylord Forge Seer [0(4)] - Behemoth [25] Greylord Forge Seer [0(4)] Kovnik Apprentice Kratikoff [4] - Marauder [11] Kayazy Eliminators [5] Kayazy Eliminators [5]
I went up against 2 very good CG players, both of whom qualified for Masters, and one of which ultimately ended up winning the whole thing. I lost both games, but both were very informative and I never felt my list choices were putting me at a disadvantage. Game 1 was vs Juris, who won KC Masters this year. He helped me see that I was too aggressive with my list and that I should mind the DFRs more. In game 2 some bad Target priority on my part meant that one Combat Alchemist was left alive, which was enough to Freeze my marshaled Behemoth, which put him out of commission for a round, and allowed the Vulcan to get closer It was a pretty cool game, the were some piece trading and position decisions that made it interesting. That player also qualified and I left feeling confident with my built. Just fodder for thought According to Buy or Boost - a Fully loaded Ruin will kill a Railless with 36 boxes and ARM 19 88% of the time. One of the reasons I wanted to have 2 jacks that threaten 13 was so that he couldn't kite me. A Maurauder that only threatens 12 can be reasonably whittled down to goo over the course of 2 turns - especially if he can apply rust efficiently and not lose the Supressor.
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Ganso
Junior Strategist
Posts: 932
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Post by Ganso on Apr 24, 2019 21:57:13 GMT
I don't usually build list to hard counter specifics. I need Marauders to also keep other huge bases honest. Marauders threaten 12, and that's enough to keep any huge base from toeing any zone, and if they rather whittle down an ARM 20, 34 box jack over 2 turns instead of stepping into my thread without contesting, I call that a win. Which is exactly what happen during my second game, Marauders scared off a Vulcan and I had an early scenario lead (had I not been stupid I would have jammed the Toro that eventually killed Butcher ).
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Post by sand20go on Apr 24, 2019 22:01:55 GMT
I don't usually build list to hard counter specifics. I need Marauders to also keep other huge bases honest. Marauders threaten 12, and that's enough to keep any huge base from toeing any zone, and if they rather whittle down an ARM 20, 34 box jack over 2 turns instead of stepping into my thread without contesting, I call that a win. Which is exactly what happen during my second game, Marauders scared off a Vulcan and I had an early scenario lead (had I not been stupid I would have jammed the Toro that eventually killed Butcher ). 13 is also a magic number against Derps (they threaten 13 on the Charge) and Tridents (Rng 10 and Rep3). Indeed, having the BE's shoot 10 and repo 3 is actually fairly common across a Lot of factions.
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Ganso
Junior Strategist
Posts: 932
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Post by Ganso on Apr 24, 2019 22:28:41 GMT
If you want the Alpha, that's a consideration worth making.
On the other hand, if you want to punish them as soon as they step into a zone, I find that 12 is enough. Opponents will most likely contest with other, squishier things rather than risk losing a big anchor piece. Which again, is fine if you're going for scenario play.
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Post by steeltitan on Apr 25, 2019 8:12:55 GMT
I ran this at Kingdom Con, I left a few points out cause the list is going through changes after I got feedback at the con [Butcher 3] Kommander Zoktavir, the Butcher Unleashed [+22] - Marauder [11] - Marauder [11] - Ruin [17] - Greylord Adjunct [0(4)] Greylord Forge Seer [0(4)] - Behemoth [25] Greylord Forge Seer [0(4)] Kovnik Apprentice Kratikoff [4] - Marauder [11] Kayazy Eliminators [5] Kayazy Eliminators [5]
I went up against 2 very good CG players, both of whom qualified for Masters, and one of which ultimately ended up winning the whole thing. I lost both games, but both were very informative and I never felt my list choices were putting me at a disadvantage. Game 1 was vs Juris, who won KC Masters this year. He helped me see that I was too aggressive with my list and that I should mind the DFRs more. In game 2 some bad Target priority on my part meant that one Combat Alchemist was left alive, which was enough to Freeze my marshaled Behemoth, which put him out of commission for a round, and allowed the Vulcan to get closer It was a pretty cool game, there was some piece trading and position decisions that made it interesting. That player also qualified and I left feeling confident with my built. I think it's important to include which casters you went up against, just for completeness sake to have the OP understand how different casters impact Khador's chances of success. ]Just fodder for thought According to Buy or Boost - a Fully loaded Ruin will kill a Railless with 36 boxes and ARM 19 88% of the time. One of the reasons I wanted to have 2 jacks that threaten 13 was so that he couldn't kite me. A Maurauder that only threatens 12 can be reasonably whittled down to goo over the course of 2 turns - especially if he can apply rust efficiently and not lose the Supressor. Is the 88% without Silence of Death?
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Post by steeltitan on Apr 25, 2019 8:32:49 GMT
Sorry, double post because quoting multiple posts sucks...
This is the list that I'm currently running:
Kommander Zoktavir, the Butcher Unleashed - WJ: +22 - War Argus - Greylord Adjunct - PC: 4 - Ruin - PC: 17 (Battlegroup Points Used: 17) - Marauder - PC: 11 (Battlegroup Points Used: 5) - Marauder - PC: 11 - Devastator - PC: 14 - Devastator - PC: 14
Kovnik Apprentice Kratikoff - PC: 0 - Beast 09 - PC: 18 Greylord Forge Seer - PC: 4 Greylord Forge Seer - PC: 4 Yuri the Axe - PC: 0 Widowmaker Marksman - PC: 0
To explain some of the more exotic choices: I was planning on running Alexia 2 + Windowmakers but it seems impossible to buy Thrall Warriors. Alexia 2 offers some contesting flexibility and Windowmakers are one of the few answers versus Trancers (albeit not a great one). Windowmakers also provide early game souls for Alexia.
But considering I can't get Thralls and Alexia 2 is part of the order and everything is just pending, I upgraded the Rager on S0 to Beast09 and added Yuri and the WMM...aaaaaaaaaand I actually like it. Yuri is always a bit hit or miss but both solos are good contesting pieces and can do annoying and dangerous things (yesterday Yuri removed 4 out of 5 Assault Troopers on the charge...it was glorious). Beast09 as a shield guard for Butcher and S0 has been solid, in combination with the threat of Hyper Aggressive (it's optional so cannot be used against you). I generally keep Beast09 as a second wave / counter-attack model. I find that the extra jack really helps, it's still reasonably fast and Tresher adds some anti infantry to the list. It's also one of the few pieces that can actually charge halbediers with their ridiculous defense (set defense etc) and hit because of Murderous.
Although I don't want to tech against any specific caster or faction either, I love Marauders. They are gold against CG and still good enough anti-ARM pieces vs other armies, with Silence of Death. If you face something like Gearhart without huge bases, they are generally bait.
I recently started playing with 2 Devastators and I love it. As you can see, I don't have any units so can't score round zones (more on that later). The devs just say no to those zones by toeing in, hopefully supported by some terrain. They are one of the few jacks CG cannot JUST remove trivially. They generally have to commit multiple units plus supporting pieces to remove one and blow a feat if they want to remove both. As such, it really helps take the pressure off the rest of the army, to move in and do their thing. At least as important, it also really helps with clock management because they typically don't do more than one power attack a turn (not opening up), leaving me with more time for late-game, when Butcher shines.
A last word on not having units. I used to run 2x Elims but removed them...I seem to be one of the few people that made this bold decision. However, I think they are just not pulling their weight versus CG. With sprays, guidance, many boost effects for attack rolls and long threat ranges, they die too trivially. I removed them and never missed them.
And just to have you share in the glory, I went up versus Gearhart yesterday. He feated and did indeed remove a Devastator and two Marauders. However, to get Prey on them, he left Gearhart within a long, non-Vengeance, double-Impending Doom range of B3. Needless to say, B3 was victorious...
Having said that, I never really realized you could Impending Doom twice *shame*
...Such wins always feel a little gotcha but such opportunities is exactly why you play B3. I do expect that a focused opponent (my opponent is a good player but it's a small oversight to let your caster just a little too close, especially if you have so many models in the way) won't let you have those turn 3 wins and you really need to leverage B3 in the late game.
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Post by sand20go on Apr 25, 2019 15:32:53 GMT
Sorry, double post because quoting multiple posts sucks... This is the list that I'm currently running: Kommander Zoktavir, the Butcher Unleashed - WJ: +22 - War Argus - Greylord Adjunct - PC: 4 - Ruin - PC: 17 (Battlegroup Points Used: 17) - Marauder - PC: 11 (Battlegroup Points Used: 5) - Marauder - PC: 11 - Devastator - PC: 14 - Devastator - PC: 14 Kovnik Apprentice Kratikoff - PC: 0 - Beast 09 - PC: 18 Greylord Forge Seer - PC: 4 Greylord Forge Seer - PC: 4 Yuri the Axe - PC: 0 Widowmaker Marksman - PC: 0 To explain some of the more exotic choices: I was planning on running Alexia 2 + Windowmakers but it seems impossible to buy Thrall Warriors. Alexia 2 offers some contesting flexibility and Windowmakers are one of the few answers versus Trancers (albeit not a great one). Windowmakers also provide early game souls for Alexia. But considering I can't get Thralls and Alexia 2 is part of the order and everything is just pending, I upgraded the Rager on S0 to Beast09 and added Yuri and the WMM...aaaaaaaaaand I actually like it. Yuri is always a bit hit or miss but both solos are good contesting pieces and can do annoying and dangerous things (yesterday Yuri removed 4 out of 5 Assault Troopers on the charge...it was glorious). Beast09 as a shield guard for Butcher and S0 has been solid, in combination with the threat of Hyper Aggressive (it's optional so cannot be used against you). I generally keep Beast09 as a second wave / counter-attack model. I find that the extra jack really helps, it's still reasonably fast and Tresher adds some anti infantry to the list. It's also one of the few pieces that can actually charge halbediers with their ridiculous defense (set defense etc) and hit because of Murderous. Although I don't want to tech against any specific caster or faction either, I love Marauders. They are gold against CG and still good enough anti-ARM pieces vs other armies, with Silence of Death. If you face something like Gearhart without huge bases, they are generally bait. I recently started playing with 2 Devastators and I love it. As you can see, I don't have any units so can't score round zones (more on that later). The devs just say no to those zones by toeing in, hopefully supported by some terrain. They are one of the few jacks CG cannot JUST remove trivially. They generally have to commit multiple units plus supporting pieces to remove one and blow a feat if they want to remove both. As such, it really helps take the pressure off the rest of the army, to move in and do their thing. At least as important, it also really helps with clock management because they typically don't do more than one power attack a turn (not opening up), leaving me with more time for late-game, when Butcher shines. A last word on not having units. I used to run 2x Elims but removed them...I seem to be one of the few people that made this bold decision. However, I think they are just not pulling their weight versus CG. With sprays, guidance, many boost effects for attack rolls and long threat ranges, they die too trivially. I removed them and never missed them. And just to have you share in the glory, I went up versus Gearhart yesterday. He feated and did indeed remove a Devastator and two Marauders. However, to get Prey on them, he left Gearhart within a long, non-Vengeance, double-Impending Doom range of B3. Needless to say, B3 was victorious... Having said that, I never really realized you could Impending Doom twice *shame* ...Such wins always feel a little gotcha but such opportunities is exactly why you play B3. I do expect that a focused opponent (my opponent is a good player but it's a small oversight to let your caster just a little too close, especially if you have so many models in the way) won't let you have those turn 3 wins and you really need to leverage B3 in the late game. Like this list a lot. but are you finding utility with double ForgeSeers? Some games it is so nice to be able to fuel up jacks - in others I find them "meh". So, for example, you could keep one and then add in Ragman - who I find GOLD with Butcher3 because he can crank the damage and allow Butcher to get "more done with less" when he mulches a flank - providing additional focus to camp and, SOMETIMES, even allowing him to not have to feat to stay alive.)
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Post by lorddragonmaster on Apr 25, 2019 15:41:00 GMT
I appreciate all of the advice in this thread.
Just to give more info.
To date I have only gone up against Makay in GC (as the player seems to favor it). To be honest I only have a couple games with AC, and was previously playing JAWS with hark (which I have just recently swapped out Behemoth and a bit for 3 marauders). The list I am typically playing AGAINST is (from memory sorry):
Crucible Guard Army - 74 / 75 points [Theme] Magnum Opus
[Mackay 1] Captain Eira Mackay [+19] - Vanguard [10] - Vanguard [10] - Vulcan [35] Trancer [3] Crucible Guard Rocketmen (max) [15] - Crucible Guard Rocketman Captain [4] Dragon's Breath Rocket [0(5)] Railless Interceptor [16]
There might be alchemist in there instead of rocketmen because I was frozen once.
Typically: Vulcan runs up the Board with mobility (just outside charge range), and proceeds to kite me, spraying down anything that comes within it’s 19” threat. Vanguards sit within 3” of Vulcan & Makay, shield guarding (x4 because of theme), and the rocketmen sit behind a house and jump back and forth to pick off my solos/units. Railless just sits in a zone and fires at range.
I am still a VERY new player (only started in Jan), and I am playing against very experienced players. But I’d thought I’d ask here, as they aren’t gonna tell me how best to take them down.
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Post by Soul Samurai on Apr 25, 2019 16:14:22 GMT
Man, that sounds like a real negative play experience. Kudos for sticking with it.
Hmm, I'm not at all up to date right bow and have never played against CG, so tgis is probably a stupid idea, but I'm wondering if bringing something like a Vlad1 or Strak1 to try to just move fast enough to get a charge in is enough? A Juggernaut under Andy1 with BC from Sorscha 1 and Strakhov's feat threatens really far (15" I believe, at P+S21 with a free charge), alongside Strakhov's own 15" threat jack (even more if you can trigger Overrun, but 4 shield guard jacks might make that tough). Vlad's jacks are threatening 14" with BC and feat, but you can send more of them in and will have an easier time clearing the path with shooty units under Vlad.
Add 1" to all those threat ranges if you bring Spriggans of course, which might not be a bad idea because Bulldoze.
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