Nakai
Baby's First Wargame
Posts: 4
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Post by Nakai on Apr 15, 2019 10:44:18 GMT
Hi all, I'm a totally new player with some old experience in WH and WH:40K. Me and my friends just decided to start playing Warmachine/Hordes in skirmish style, first goal: 10pts lists. I'm going to play Legion, mostly 'cause I love the figures. I'd like to play beasts, and based on what I've read, Thag 2 or Absy 2 should be my way to go (I also love Thag2 miniature).
I usually like to play lists with precise tactic and objective, even if a "plan B" would always be nice to have.
Any suggestion for a 10pts list, beastly, that could work well? (I'll probably play mostly Vs warmachine's.)
My first choice would be a Thag 2 if it could fit, as I said, but I'm open for any suggestion!
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thelat
Junior Strategist
Posts: 480
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Post by thelat on Apr 15, 2019 16:36:55 GMT
Abby1 might be worth looking into at that point level, too.
A note, the Legion has a reputation left over from MkI and MkII of being THE BEAST FACTION. We don't really live up to that anymore, but it can still be played.
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Post by dirtyharrypotter on Apr 15, 2019 16:59:22 GMT
Im thinking typhon, a nephilim boltthrower, 4 points to play with (four 1-pt solos) and a freebee in either oracles or children. Oracles gives you forsaken, children the warlord.
What ever you choose, all these models are usefull, it's a perfect start for gathering legion.
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thelat
Junior Strategist
Posts: 480
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Post by thelat on Apr 15, 2019 19:34:15 GMT
Im thinking typhon, a nephilim boltthrower, 4 points to play with (four 1-pt solos) and a freebee in either oracles or childeren. Oracles gives you forsaken, childeren the warlord. What ever you choose, all these models are usefull, it's a perfect start for gathering legion. Listen to this guy.
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Nakai
Baby's First Wargame
Posts: 4
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Post by Nakai on Apr 15, 2019 23:23:15 GMT
Im thinking typhon, a nephilim boltthrower, 4 points to play with (four 1-pt solos) and a freebee in either oracles or children. Oracles gives you forsaken, children the warlord. What ever you choose, all these models are usefull, it's a perfect start for gathering legion. Speaking about Thag2, right? Thank you for the tip, may I ask you how would you play this list? I mean, I never had a game before, so I still have to learn which my strenghts are!
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thelat
Junior Strategist
Posts: 480
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Post by thelat on Apr 16, 2019 4:31:13 GMT
Im thinking typhon, a nephilim boltthrower, 4 points to play with (four 1-pt solos) and a freebee in either oracles or children. Oracles gives you forsaken, children the warlord. What ever you choose, all these models are usefull, it's a perfect start for gathering legion. Speaking about Thag2, right? Thank you for the tip, may I ask you how would you play this list? I mean, I never had a game before, so I still have to learn which my strenghts are! Typhon and the Bolt Thrower are just great all around, but between Scourge, sprays, and the ability of the Bolt Thrower to mess with formation, it covers a lot of bases for Thagrosh2. Abby1 gives you a different approach, but she doesn't Kill Things Dead like Thagrosh2.
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Post by dirtyharrypotter on Apr 16, 2019 10:03:03 GMT
Im thinking typhon, a nephilim boltthrower, 4 points to play with (four 1-pt solos) and a freebee in either oracles or children. Oracles gives you forsaken, children the warlord. What ever you choose, all these models are usefull, it's a perfect start for gathering legion. Speaking about Thag2, right? Thank you for the tip, may I ask you how would you play this list? I mean, I never had a game before, so I still have to learn which my strenghts are! That you may First of all, this revolves around eThags looking awesome! Secondly, his feat. There is two ways of using it, defensively and offensively, and I think its rediculously powerfull in small games (though increasingly harder to use in bigger games, so enjoy the ease with wich to use it for now, but realise it's not that easy later on). Choose how to use it at the start of the game and act accordingly. This choice depends on your opponent's list, terrain, etc. Bit of personal preference as well, defensive use is easier imo. What it does is give the beasts in his battlegroup an extra move and a melee attack at the end of your turn. I said this list can use it both defensively and offensively, and that's because they have ranged attacks. Defensively: Typhon has up to three 8" sprays, the boltthrower has his 10"ballista (14" with his animus). They can shoot and use the feat to move away at the end of the turn, which puts 14" or more between then and their targets, keeping them safe from many attacks. In the meanwhile thagrosh can cast his scourge spell from a safe distance through a spellmartyr (he should allways have at least one imo). This is a lot of safe shooting for such a small game. Offensively: Typhon hits like a truck, has an animus that let's him heal and eThags can put an armourbuff on him. You can charge in, tear something to pieces and at the end of the turn, make a move and attack to finish something off or lock something in combat. eThags is a beast, he can charge in along with him (and probably use the armourbuff on himself). The boltthrower has a neat skill that allows him to charge something, kill it and then shoot something. It won't come into play often but can surprise players that put soft targets in front of him, extending the threat of his gun. It has a push effect, which is something you must be aware off when using the feat offensively. You don't want to push something out of range. So basically you have high grade ranged and melee attacks (which eThags can turn up even further, note manifest destiny also effects thagrosh himself), are reasonably sturdy (for Legion) have good movement and a flexible feat. You should be the one deciding when things go down, how they go down. At least in smaller games where he can be super oppressive.
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Post by dirtyharrypotter on Apr 16, 2019 12:29:43 GMT
I forgot a really important part about defensive use of the feat. It doesn't effect Thagrosh himself, but you can use your beasts to shield him from countercharges after he played forward aggresively. He should be able to kill what ever he touches, and is quite tough, but certainly not indestructible. You want him to bully and stay safe(ish) afterwards, and putting some bodies inbetween is a good way to do it.
Especially in small games, if you can kill some prime targets and prevent your opponent from getting to thagrosh, that's an excellent way to use the feat and bring home the bacon next turn.
One other point: As an alternative to the boltthrower you should consider the seraph. It has an excellent gun and a killer animus that is way more usefull (in this list) then the one on the boltthrower. It's more expensive and only leaves room for one spellmartyr, but since it will help you to play more aggressively with typhon and thagrosh that's ok. It is a very usefull beast for a lot of warlocks, every legion player has one, and a nobrainer for eThags (perhaps even mandatory in bigger games).
I think the boltthrower list is more flexible, but if your prime goal is to bully with Thagrosh, take a seraph.
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Post by ForEver_Blight on Apr 16, 2019 15:08:43 GMT
Thagrosh2 is a shining example of "play at your own risk" An all offensive tool kit with no real emergency out for himself. But man can he be a bully. Things to bring: spell martrys - good with any caster in faction with offensive spells (meaning all of them). Scourge is only range 8 and a large base can have LoS blocking problems. Worth their weight in gold. Shepherds - fury managment and psuedo~ long leash. Never a bad choice in any beast saturated list. Can be chosen as Free in Oracles. Things to remember: 1 - Thagrosh spawns his own lesser warbeast (Once) when taking damage. 2 - Excessive healing proc's even if you transfer the damage 2a - Take the first small damage roll. Transfer the next and still roll D3 to heal. 3 - as stated he does not benefit from his own feat. Manifest Destiny does last through the feat attack. 4 - Cloud/elevation/cover are still your friends. Just because you can sac-pawn doesn't mean you want to hand them the opportunity to shoot you freely. 5 - You WILL be fielding less battle group models, usually heavies, than the opponent. Especially against Warmachine factions. But Thagrosh IS a heavy warbeast. 6 - Rapture can blows things up, literally. If they have some cheeky infantry in the way Thagrosh can box them and create a LoS blocking bunker for himself that all our beasts can see through. 7 - Scourge is poooooweeerrful. Look for low defense models next to high defense (or just generally vulnerable) targets and let the AoE catch them. Use it to stop advancing heavy beast/jacks or shield wall units. it can be cast along with Manifest Destiny if you are Super safe. Things to consider: Typhon is strong. but also high in points. In small games you are going to be outnumbered to start with, typhon puts a even further behind. Carniveans are a bit cheaper (two spell martyrs worth) and have a more statistically reliable armor buff. Legion is still a heavy shooting faction. Getting into a brawl without first getting some chip damage usually puts us on the back foot. That's why the bolt-thrower was recommended above. Boosted Pow 14 does some work. Ravagores can also be an option since Manifest Destiny helps with the melee output and they are again even cheaper than Carniveans. Get a multi-kit and some magnets and you can try which works best for you. Honorable mentions Raeks have long leash and so will benefit from all of Thargosh's toolkit while up to 28" away from him. Get behind troopers, solos, or casters. Naga Nightlurker has a great Animus (grants blessed and magical weapons) for Legion since we don't have much to deal with enemy spells. Against an armor/defense buffed enemy the Naga is always appreciated. If you want to really build out the list and see the possibilities read the fantastic article here by Lanz
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Post by dirtyharrypotter on Apr 16, 2019 17:01:50 GMT
Yes the carnivean is a good choice as well. The main reason I recommended typhon is that eThags allready brings an armourbuff himself. Some tech that removes/negates that buff will also deal with spiny growth, whereas excessive healing might still work.
Of course some tech removes it all, but in general it's harder to deal with both an armour and a healing buff. And then there's the bond ability to consider.
Under eThags I'd need a very specific list to choose carnivean over typhon. In large games I do take both though, carnivean is great with him for all the reasons mentioned above (good gun, good melee) and comes with pathfinder which typhon lacks. Not allways an issue, but a big problem ones it is.
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Nakai
Baby's First Wargame
Posts: 4
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Post by Nakai on May 8, 2019 22:15:57 GMT
Sorry people, I forgot to thank you all for the great job and the usefull advices! My first order has just been delivered and ATM I’m fully immersed in assembling and painting. I hope to unleash the fury of the Legion on a table ASAP, bringing your tips with me on the road to the glory of Everblight!
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Post by dirtyharrypotter on May 9, 2019 10:22:09 GMT
Cool. What list did you settle on for now?
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Nakai
Baby's First Wargame
Posts: 4
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Post by Nakai on May 17, 2019 19:36:35 GMT
I bought the components for both the lists above: eThag - Typhon - Seraph/Bolt Thrower - solos (forsaken/warlord - spell martyrs - shepard). I also got a carnivean/scythean/ravagor multikit which I'm going to magnetize, harriers and shredders for eThag's drop and a Neraph I'll share my experience after the very first games!
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