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Post by thebuoyancyofwater on Feb 25, 2019 10:37:53 GMT
Ok, just played around a bit more and this is kinda tempting to try with Strakhov2:
Wolves of Winter Strakhov2 +22 Quicken -Kommando -Kommando -Rager -10 -Ruin -17 Inviolable Resolve Fenris -8 Koldun Lord -4 Koldun Lord -4 Sergeant Nick -4 Doom Reaver Swordsmen -10 -Greylord Escort -3 Doom Reaver Swordsmen -10 -Greylord Escort -3 Doom Reaver Swordsmen -10 -Greylord Escort -3 Steelhead Halberdies (Max) -11 Last Stand -Koldun Kapitan Valachev -0(4) Greylord Ternion -0(7)
Halberdiers die to Last Stand (but can CMA to reduce the impact) then Nick can replace them. Also on feat turn they become DEF15 ARM18 against charges or something like that. Generally people are worrying about the reavers too much to spend many resources on them. Reavers really like the feat and Rise from Fenris is important for it. I found the kommando clouds to be really good at keeping Markov safe, so apply the same theory here to protect Fenris. There's a rager to provide some additional ranged protection and Ruin is a pain with Inviolable Resolve. The list has some decent recursion between Nick and the greylords.
I might consider dropping a koldun lord for the adjunct, but not sure on that yet. Would need to try this first.
I played a very similar list during CiD and it seemed to have potential.
Thoughts?
Cheers, Dave
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Post by hocestbellum on Feb 25, 2019 10:51:38 GMT
You played this list a bit before, didn't you? Have there been any major changes?
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Post by smoothcriminal on Feb 25, 2019 11:21:12 GMT
Using upkeep-heavy caster in wolves theme is both tempting and awkward at the same time. What I would do is: - take victor, give him the +arm - take ponies, give them quicken - take Nyss hunters, give them last stand - fill the rest with doomies - probably want free ternion here for option of def 18 Nyss/ponies screening rest of your army Not sure if this will be good enough, but at least it uses all the Stakhov's options.
And that puts us to: Khador Army - 72 / 75 points [Theme] Wolves of Winter
[Strakhov 2] Assault Kommander Strakhov [+22] - Victor [34] Cylena Raefyll & Nyss Hunters (max) [19] - Koldun Kapitan Valachev [4] Doom Reaver Swordsmen [10] Doom Reaver Swordsmen [10] Greylord Outriders (max) [17] Greylord Ternion [0(7)] Greylord Ternion [0(7)]
I think I don't need Koldun lord, this should punch hard enough and Victor+Ternion have the hitting covered. 3pt probably should be mechs. Feels like if Strakhov had just 1 more point to fit an adjunct the list would be solid.
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Post by thebuoyancyofwater on Feb 25, 2019 11:21:38 GMT
It could be the same list, you're right The spells moved around on the ternion and koldun lord and I think that's about it actually. It actually helps the list I think because it gives greater access to Bonds of Woe. Oh and the escort spells changed. Though again that lets the koldun lord provide no healing if needed, so not bad. Didn't realize the list is identical though! Maybe should have checked that... Cheers, Dave
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Post by Soul Samurai on Feb 25, 2019 11:49:13 GMT
take Nyss hunters, give them last stand Don't you think they are a bit expensive for something like that? I believe that with Last Stand they still only hit about as hard as Doomreavers do natively. That's not to say that they're not worth taking just to bring a decent ranged element to a list of course.
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Post by sand20go on Feb 25, 2019 21:44:38 GMT
Well we also came up with this.....which seems really fun.....;-)
Kommander Sorscha - WJ: +29 - Greylord Adjunct - PC: 4 - Beast 09 - PC: 18 (Battlegroup Points Used: 18) - Ruin- PC: 17
Koldun Lord - PC: 4 Koldun Lord - PC: 0 Greylord Forge Seer - PC: 4
Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 - Greylord Escort - PC: 3 Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 - Greylord Escort - PC: 3 Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10 Greylord Ternion - Leader & 2 Grunts: 0 Greylord Ternion - Leader & 2 Grunts: 0 Doom Reaver Swordsmen - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10
THEME: Wolves of Winter ---
GENERATED : 02/25/2019 11:33:47 BUILD ID : 2069.18-10-06
Somethinking here....
A) You just are not going to see them drop their infantry pair or their "squishy enough to pop and drop" caster if they can at all help it. Instead you may well get the beast brick.
B) Any list that includes both Beast and Ruin has GOT to win style points.
C) You have a single forge seer so you can, in theory, cast boundless charge twice, wind rush and STILL have a fully loaded Beast and an almost loaded Ruin to go do work.
D) And you also get Freezer on Beast for more "fun".
We are giving up (sad face) some bonds of woe here but again, you may not have much more need for the ternions than simply to hand out clouds and hit pow 12s. Indeed, a solid argument could be made is to take more escorts just so you continue to maximize pathfinding.
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Ganso
Junior Strategist
Posts: 932
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Post by Ganso on Feb 25, 2019 22:16:51 GMT
This is the list I want to "main" as my S1/OW2 Double Wolves lists
https://conflictchamber.com/?c3201b_-0K47f8nj8h8h6inf89nf89nfnfnfnn
Khador Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] Wolves of Winter
[Sorscha 1] Kommander Sorscha [+29] - Victor [34] - Greylord Adjunct [0(4)] Koldun Lord [0(4)] Koldun Lord [4] Alexia Ciannor & the Risen [10] Doom Reaver Swordsmen [10] - Greylord Escort [3] Doom Reaver Swordsmen [10] - Greylord Escort [3] Doom Reaver Swordsmen [10] Doom Reaver Swordsmen [10] Doom Reaver Swordsmen [10] Greylord Ternion [0(7)]
Basically I want to Freeze fools to maintain an attrition advantage. Pop Thralls for near infinite contesters, and even Viktor could play in the sprinklers with his double RNG 12 D3 guns.
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Post by thebuoyancyofwater on Feb 26, 2019 4:55:00 GMT
Hi Sand, Much prefer your Sorscha1 list to your Strakhov2 list Here was my first idea with Sorscha1: Wolves of WinterSorscha1 +29 -Greylord Adjunct -0(4) -Beast-09 -18 -Destroyer -14 Fenris -8 Koldun Lord -4 Koldun Lord -4 Doom Reaver Swordsmen -10 -Greylord Escort -3 Doom Reaver Swordsmen -10 -Greylord Escort -3 Doom Reaver Swordsmen -10 Doom Reaver Swordsmen -10 Greylord Outriders (Min) -10 Greylord Ternion -0(7) Greylord Ternion -0(7) So I decided to switch one reaver unit for a min outrider unit. Basically while the list will likely face heavy-based lists those lists will often have a single unit with them, and if not they'll have support staff behind. The outrider unit is there to either control the chaff unit or to rush round the back to threaten support. Beast to do Beast things, then a destroyer for some sniping as required. Though I'm currently debating between this and Zerkova2 for my Wolves list. Basically taking a list that scares off infantry and is able to deal with armour. So probably Sorscha1. Cheers, Dave
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Post by sand20go on Feb 26, 2019 18:04:43 GMT
the Z2 vs. S1 question is a really good one with a really important distinction being that Z2 SHOULD be able to play into shooting infantry lists that might not be THAT scared of S1 (consider Jalaam who figures he is going to shoot S1's army off the board and deliver a few bugs as well with Warpath)....or Syvestro who figures that he will simply roll with a bunch of sprays. Yes. You CAN freeze the shooters - but that is a bit riskier than just killing them outright. So I figured as good of time as any was to ask the question - how many resources does Z2 need to put into killing off a critical target if playing her feat for long range attrition. If you land JUST either the kiss or the Brittlefrost you will need 17 attacks to get over a 50% kill on a Railess (ARM 19; 36 boxes) If you land BOTH a Kiss and a Brittlefrost your odds go up a LOT - 10 POW 12s get you to 68% of killing it - Figuring Holt and the brittlefrost that means a unit of Ponies and a unit of Ternions will get it for you. Now then Assuming that you can deliver the doomies, for them 4 unbuffed doomies get you to 68.2% on the charge. I THINK what this suggests is whether you think your pair just shuts down shooting so hard that you don't get it....for example a shooting oriented Jaws list with OW2. If so, then I think that the S1/X pair works great. If not, then I think there is a strong case to be made for Z2 - perhaps up to an including adding in Rags - so that you can play, if game state demands, attrition based upon a devastating alpha. Something like..... conflictchamber.com/?c3201b_-0KeWkWkT8h8h9unfnfnhnhnnnn8M8IKhador Army - 74 / 75 points [Theme] Wolves of Winter [Zerkova 2] Obavnik Kommander Zerkova [+24] - Juggernaut [13] - Marauder [11] Koldun Lord [0(4)] Koldun Lord [4] Ragman [4] Doom Reaver Swordsmen [10] Doom Reaver Swordsmen [10] Greylord Outriders (max) [17] Greylord Outriders (max) [17] Greylord Ternion [0(7)] Greylord Ternion [0(7)] Lady Aiyana & Master Holt [8] - Koldun Kapitan Valachev [4] I THINK what this means is
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Post by hocestbellum on Feb 26, 2019 19:02:27 GMT
I THINK what this means is Well don't leave us hanging...
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Post by welshhoppo on Feb 26, 2019 19:18:38 GMT
I THINK what this means is Well don't leave us hanging... It's been built up into something greater than us.
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Post by sand20go on Feb 26, 2019 21:43:29 GMT
I THINK what this means is Well don't leave us hanging... Meant to type
"...I need to build that second unit of ponies I bought"
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