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Non-PT
Feb 18, 2019 18:02:03 GMT
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Post by davycannonhound on Feb 18, 2019 18:02:03 GMT
Are there ANY warlocks that don’t want to be in PT, or at least play better in other themes? The last couple of threads I’ve made have been “PT this, PT that”. Are there any warlocks (aside from abby in Oracles) that want other themes? Or should I give up and just jump on the PT train?
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gordo
Junior Strategist
My star is green?
Posts: 548
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Post by gordo on Feb 18, 2019 18:33:21 GMT
For that to work, the other themes would have to be functional.
Having said that, I hear some Kallus 2 lists run Children of the Character Nephilim.
Give up. Play PT.
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Post by davycannonhound on Feb 18, 2019 18:45:24 GMT
For that to work, the other themes would have to be functional. Having said that, I hear some Kallus 2 lists run Children of the Character Nephilim. Give up. Play PT. Ah, I love theme forces in my life. I love having to buy another $1000 worth of models just so I can play in theme. I love having an army of mismatched models that don't go into any theme forces together.
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Post by apoc2148 on Feb 18, 2019 18:45:56 GMT
Well, what are the benefits of PT and how do they affect our casters?
+2 in of deployment, solid. Get our models up the field faster.
Free models for units, good. With the way scenario 2018 ended up it is almost imperative to bring at least 1 unit so why not make it a resilient, fairly hard hitting cav unit that oh by the way nets you a free hellmouth for more scenario pressure.
Vengeance for warmongers/spears, decent but can be overlooked. If the reason you are playing PT is cause you like legion's med base infantry than this benefit is amazing. Our ogrun suffer to almost any kind of shooting so why not get a benefit for the front lines soaking some shots.
So really this is our most "universal" theme that brings benefits for almost every caster. Even with your suggestion of eAby liking OoA better (which she does), she can build a decent list with PT and bank on that sweet +2" deployment to help her net an even longer alpha strike threat range. It also is one of the few themes that has no beast restrictions (apart from characters - golab, which sprinting+repo(5) eAby is awesome btw) and access to hellmouths. Granted you ignore a couple of the theme benefits by not taking units/mongers/spears but the argument could be made to bring a unit of chosen+free hellmouth in a beast heavy PT list.
One big downside to PT is the massive lack of magical weapons. So any incorporeal spam lists (looking at you Immortal UA) will be able to do nasty things to it.
The short of the long of it is that PT is a strong theme that can be built in a variety of ways. Is it required, no. Does it help make a more generalist list to be paired with a skew list, probably.
But that's just my opinion, I could be wrong.
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gordo
Junior Strategist
My star is green?
Posts: 548
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Post by gordo on Feb 18, 2019 18:52:23 GMT
For that to work, the other themes would have to be functional. Having said that, I hear some Kallus 2 lists run Children of the Character Nephilim. Give up. Play PT. Ah, I love theme forces in my life. I love having to buy another $1000 worth of models just so I can play in theme. I love having an army of mismatched models that don't go into any theme forces together. And I love my shelf for bearing such a heavy burden.
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Post by fanbloodytastic on Feb 18, 2019 19:46:09 GMT
I think making non primal terrors lists generally takes a greater focus on what drops you intend it to face. This makes it more difficult to give general advice without really diving into the weeds about your plan for a list pairing process.
It also means you usually want a more generalist list you can fall back on. This is often primal terrors, but other options such as abby2 and thags1 in CoTD are popular in my local area.
If you want to see an example of a pairing like this take a look at JVM’s awesome lylyth1 triple huge base list from Captaincon (although I have no idea if he actually played it or if he just dropped kallus1 into everything)
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Post by ForEver_Blight on Feb 18, 2019 19:50:20 GMT
blarg blarg blarg... same stuff different day.
If you want to run a different theme run it. The competitive scene will never change without another CID for us.
I have a 100% loss rate with PT. It's not my style. I hate trying to make it work because it's the "top pick". *I'm* not a good fit for PT
Oracles is still 2nd best. Play some Thags 2. Kallus Overrun builds. Abby 1 or 2. Thags 1 thrones. Vayl 2 anything you want cuz she's still a good swiss army knife.
Top mentions I still have success with are Lylyth 1 and Thags 1 in CotD. Kallus 2 in CotD can give Zuriel that down town assassination chance he wants. Kallus 1 Ravens with raeks and bees really cause chaos in low model count H.infantry and jack/beast lists. Bethayne is still good despite the uproar. play something out of theme. Proteus and Golab can be pretty dumb fun with other casters. Fyanna + Golab and Kallus 2 + Proteus are favorites of mine.
TLDR play what you have fun playing. And stop being passive aggressive towards each other.
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Non-PT
Feb 18, 2019 20:19:37 GMT
Post by davycannonhound on Feb 18, 2019 20:19:37 GMT
I think making non primal terrors lists generally takes a greater focus on what drops you intend it to face. This makes it more difficult to give general advice without really diving into the weeds about your plan for a list pairing process. It also means you usually want a more generalist list you can fall back on. This is often primal terrors, but other options such as abby2 and thags1 in CoTD are popular in my local area. If you want to see an example of a pairing like this take a look at JVM’s awesome lylyth1 triple huge base list from Captaincon (although I have no idea if he actually played it or if he just dropped kallus1 into everything) Link?
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Post by fanbloodytastic on Feb 18, 2019 23:32:34 GMT
conflictchamber.com/?ca101b_-0-bskE28kB2-cokGkGkJkJfTfT___-0taAkOcObfbubb2Qb9fghWhWLegion Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] Primal Terrors [Kallus 1] Kallus, Wrath of Everblight [+30] - Blightbringer [32] - Harrier [3] - Ammok the Truthbearer [0(4)] Gudrun the Wanderer [5] Spell Martyr [1] Blighted Rotwings (max) [12] Blighted Rotwings (max) [12] Chosen of Everblight (max) [20] Chosen of Everblight (max) [20] Hellmouth [0(6)] Hellmouth [0(6)] Legion Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] Oracles of Annihilation [Lylyth 1] Lylyth, Herald of Everblight [+30] - Archangel [35] - Nephilim Bloodseer [8] - Nephilim Bolt Thrower [11] - Succubus [0(4)] Blighted Nyss Shepherd [1] Feralgeist [2] The Forsaken [0(4)] Croak Raiders (max) [16] Throne of Everblight [16] Throne of Everblight [16]
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Non-PT
Feb 19, 2019 0:27:28 GMT
Post by davycannonhound on Feb 19, 2019 0:27:28 GMT
Of course there are minions... What would you recommend in Legion to replace the Minions with?
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Post by fanbloodytastic on Feb 19, 2019 2:36:06 GMT
Oof, hard to give advice because it isn’t my list and the croak raiders are one of the things I really like about it. I will try anyways I guess My first instinct was to swap the feralgeist and croaks for a bolt thrower, ice witches, and an additional free forsaken; but I worry you lose too much scenario presence from that. So instead I think I would try this: conflictchamber.com/?ca201b_-0taAkOcObfaMbubbbehmb9jxhWhWLegion Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] Oracles of Annihilation [Lylyth 1] Lylyth, Herald of Everblight [+30] - Archangel [35] - Nephilim Bloodseer [8] - Nephilim Bolt Thrower [11] - Raek [8] - Succubus [0(4)] Blighted Nyss Shepherd [1] Blighted Nyss Sorceress & Hellion [0(6)] Gremlin Swarm [3] The Forsaken [0(4)] Ice Witches [7] Throne of Everblight [16] Throne of Everblight [16] The Raek can be changed to a naga depending on target match ups and how the list actually plays when you get it on the table.
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Post by fanbloodytastic on Feb 19, 2019 2:37:34 GMT
If you also don’t like the gremlin swarm swap it with the shepherd to get another forsaken and for sure take the raek for scenario.
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Non-PT
Feb 19, 2019 6:08:16 GMT
Post by davycannonhound on Feb 19, 2019 6:08:16 GMT
Oof, hard to give advice because it isn’t my list and the croak raiders are one of the things I really like about it. I will try anyways I guess My first instinct was to swap the feralgeist and croaks for a bolt thrower, ice witches, and an additional free forsaken; but I worry you lose too much scenario presence from that. So instead I think I would try this: conflictchamber.com/?ca201b_-0taAkOcObfaMbubbbehmb9jxhWhWLegion Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] Oracles of Annihilation [Lylyth 1] Lylyth, Herald of Everblight [+30] - Archangel [35] - Nephilim Bloodseer [8] - Nephilim Bolt Thrower [11] - Raek [8] - Succubus [0(4)] Blighted Nyss Shepherd [1] Blighted Nyss Sorceress & Hellion [0(6)] Gremlin Swarm [3] The Forsaken [0(4)] Ice Witches [7] Throne of Everblight [16] Throne of Everblight [16] The Raek can be changed to a naga depending on target match ups and how the list actually plays when you get it on the table. Hm, thanks for the change. I have a personal code against using minions in Legion, so I always try to find ways to replace them when I can. Even if it ends up damaging the list. I just don't like the idea of Legion hiring "Minions".
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Non-PT
Feb 19, 2019 12:12:53 GMT
Post by apoc2148 on Feb 19, 2019 12:12:53 GMT
Hm, thanks for the change. I have a personal code against using minions in Legion, so I always try to find ways to replace them when I can. Even if it ends up damaging the list. I just don't like the idea of Legion hiring "Minions". Side note: That's really too bad. Since croak raiders are probably the easiest way to spread fire around for Kallus2' feat.
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Non-PT
Feb 19, 2019 18:53:37 GMT
Post by davycannonhound on Feb 19, 2019 18:53:37 GMT
Hm, thanks for the change. I have a personal code against using minions in Legion, so I always try to find ways to replace them when I can. Even if it ends up damaging the list. I just don't like the idea of Legion hiring "Minions". Side note: That's really too bad. Since croak raiders are probably the easiest way to spread fire around for Kallus2' feat. Oh I'm aware. Minions just leave a bad taste in my mouth, from a lore perspective.
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