ace
BattleBox Champ
Posts: 52
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Post by ace on Feb 17, 2019 17:58:36 GMT
I was dreaming up random lists as usual and liked the looks of this one enough that I might buy Malakov2 and give it a go. Not looking to win tournaments with the list but hope to have fun and win some casual games.
Khador Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] Jaws of the Wolf
!!! This army contains pre-release entries.
[Malakov 2] Kommander Andrei Malakov [+28] - Behemoth [25] - Spriggan [17] - Greylord Adjunct [0(4)] Greylord Forge Seer [4] Kell Bailoch [5] Kovnik Apprentice Kratikoff [4] - Beast 09 [18] Manhunter [4] Manhunter [4] Widowmaker Marksman [4] Yuri the Axe [0(6)] Kayazy Eliminators [5] Kayazy Eliminators [5] Widowmaker Scouts [8]
I figure Malakov will be pretty safe in Sorscha’s fog of war and sucker. He can hand out sneak to the Widowmakers or Sorscha and under the fog they would be stealth. Can give throat cutter and/or battle lust to kayazy so they can make their way into back arch’s and tear up key models. Or fighting dirty on a manhunter can knock down a key model and then pile on the shooting.
Tactical Supremacy will be good on Widowmaker to keep them safer. Veil of mists will be useful every turn. Escort is nice.
As for warjacks, Behemoth is powerful as always, albeit expensive, spriggan has the targeting flares to help the snipers, and I really like Beast 09.
The adjunct provides guidance and an upkeep which is great. Sorscha provides Fog of War and boundless. Can’t go wrong there. Behemoth can threat 12” on the charge with escort and boundless. Forge seer hands a focus to behemoth every turn. Kell and the Marksman scalp damage off of whatever is valuable. Yuri and the manhunters hide behind forests and then charge in when appropriate.
So am I onto something here or just dreaming? One issue I can see is volume of attacks. Or lack there of.
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Post by jonnyboy on Feb 18, 2019 20:58:27 GMT
If im reading this right, beast 09 can make a 4" move due to malakovs feat and if he also shield guarded for someone, move another 4". That's 8" of out of activation movement! Keep things you love within 3" to really deter shooting.
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Post by anderfreak on Feb 18, 2019 21:48:13 GMT
Looks fun. I'm pretty convinced that Malakov2's gameplan needs to leverage his army's flexible positioning and this seems to do that.
I'd consider working another cheap heavy into the list, as well as doubling down on the kayazy with the Assassin+Underboss instead of the mahunters/yuri and snipers. Just to get that volume of high defense models clogging charge lanes forcing tramples instead of charges. Assassins also love tactical supremacy.
That's just me though, The manhunter/sniper combo can clear lots of dudes, both single and multi-box, which may be important in your meta.
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Post by Soul Samurai on Feb 19, 2019 7:18:20 GMT
If im reading this right, beast 09 can make a 4" move due to malakovs feat and if he also shield guarded for someone, move another 4". That's 8" of out of activation movement! Keep things you love within 3" to really deter shooting. Isn't there a rule somewhere that you can only trigger one movement ability from the same trigger or in the same phase or something like that?
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Post by Soul Samurai on Feb 19, 2019 7:21:17 GMT
Can give throat cutter and/or battle lust to kayazy I'm not sure what you meant by Battle Lust? Isn't that Irusk's spell? I feel like your list is light on bodies; Sucker! is not so useful when you don't have some cheap chaff OR really tough warrior models to pawn hits off to you know? At the same time Malakov's feat is best on tough multi-wound models that won't go down in a single hit. So I feel like you either want to include some cheap infantry (Risen are cheap - Sucker! is not limited to faction models), or some MOW. Or both; a MOW Drakhun or Tanker (or maaaaaybe Shocktroopers), along with a min unit of Mechanics means you can pass light hits off to high-ARM MOW and repair them if needed, OR pass high power hits off to cheap mechanics. In this case you probably want Repo on the MOW so they can keep up (unless you bring the Drakhun, but he's expensive). I'm thinking a Supression Tanker to make up for that lack of attacks you mentioned.
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Post by borderprince on Feb 19, 2019 8:52:58 GMT
...Can give throat cutter and/or battle lust to kayazy so they can make their way into back arch’s and tear up key models... Afraid to be the bearer of bad tidings, but Malakov2 does not have Battle Lust (unfortunately).
More generally, what type of lists are you thinking about dropping this into ? I know you say casual, but than vary widely in terms of types of lists.
As it stands you don't have the hitting power to deal with lots of high ARM/boxes lists (no damage buffs), with the two heaviest hitters being fairly linch-pin pieces you probably don't want to use in piece trading too early. If you're thinking about this into more warrior-heavy lists, do you have enough attacks? If the latter, I would seriously consider a Victor, as two large fire pie plates a turn can make a mess of lots of warrior lists (especially those that are normally protected from blast damage), or you have the flare functionality to assist in other shooting. You could actually manage your list less some of the solos and replace the Spriggan with Victor, although I would tend to think of Behemoth and Victor as alternatives and build from there.
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Post by hocestbellum on Feb 19, 2019 8:59:09 GMT
If im reading this right, beast 09 can make a 4" move due to malakovs feat and if he also shield guarded for someone, move another 4". That's 8" of out of activation movement! Keep things you love within 3" to really deter shooting. Isn't there a rule somewhere that you can only trigger one movement ability from the same trigger or in the same phase or something like that? I'll double check, but I think the limitations in this regard are that you can only trigger one 'end of activation' ability because your activation ends when resolved. I can't think of anything else.
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Post by Soul Samurai on Feb 19, 2019 10:15:14 GMT
Isn't there a rule somewhere that you can only trigger one movement ability from the same trigger or in the same phase or something like that? I'll double check, but I think the limitations in this regard are that you can only trigger one 'end of activation' ability because your activation ends when resolved. I can't think of anything else. Ah, that's probably the one I'm thinking about. An 8 inch walk of a guarded shot would be pretty sweet!
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Post by jonnyboy on Feb 19, 2019 13:19:46 GMT
I'll double check, but I think the limitations in this regard are that you can only trigger one 'end of activation' ability because your activation ends when resolved. I can't think of anything else. Ah, that's probably the one I'm thinking about. An 8 inch walk of a guarded shot would be pretty sweet! Bit of a bummer, but it makes sense. Malakov still makes for an interesting mix arms (favoring) jacks caster. He does well with behemoth eapecially with tactical supremacy. I think he wants more cheap Jacks to take advantage of escort and his feet.
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Post by jonnyboy on Feb 19, 2019 13:32:31 GMT
Aiyana and Holt combo well too. They bring hitting power malakov needs and they love repo 3 for a total 6" reposition!
War Room Army
Khador - New Army
Theme: Jaws of the Wolf 3 / 3 Free Cards 75 / 75 Army
Kommander Andrei Malakov - WJ: +28 - Greylord Adjunct - PC: 4 - Juggernaut - PC: 13 (Battlegroup Points Used: 13) - Juggernaut - PC: 13 (Battlegroup Points Used: 13) - Marauder - PC: 11 (Battlegroup Points Used: 2) - Marauder - PC: 11 - Marauder - PC: 11
Kovnik Apprentice Kratikoff - PC: 0 - Beast 09 - PC: 18 Greylord Forge Seer - PC: 0 Greylord Forge Seer - PC: 4 Gobber Tinker - PC: 2
Widowmaker Scouts - Leader & 3 Grunts: 8 Lady Aiyana & Master Holt - Lady Aiyana & Master Holt: 8 - Koldun Kapitan Valachev - PC: 0
THEME: Jaws of the Wolf ---
GENERATED : 02/19/2019 08:31:27 BUILD ID : 2071.19-02-05
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Post by hocestbellum on Feb 19, 2019 13:53:59 GMT
I'll double check, but I think the limitations in this regard are that you can only trigger one 'end of activation' ability because your activation ends when resolved. I can't think of anything else. Ah, that's probably the one I'm thinking about. An 8 inch walk of a guarded shot would be pretty sweet! Just to clarify here; I'm not aware of any reason that this would not work as neither Hyper Aggressive or Poison Pill are 'End of Activation' resolutions. As far as I can figure Beast-09 under Malakov2's feat would get two separate 4" moves from the triggering of Hyper Aggressive and Poison Pill. One of these moves would have to be directly towards the damaging model as per the wording of Hyper Aggressive, but you would choose the order in which they triggered.
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mazog
Junior Strategist
Walking and talking
Posts: 748
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Post by mazog on Feb 19, 2019 21:54:34 GMT
Ah, that's probably the one I'm thinking about. An 8 inch walk of a guarded shot would be pretty sweet! Just to clarify here; I'm not aware of any reason that this would not work as neither Hyper Aggressive or Poison Pill are 'End of Activation' resolutions. As far as I can figure Beast-09 under Malakov2's feat would get two separate 4" moves from the triggering of Hyper Aggressive and Poison Pill. One of these moves would have to be directly towards the damaging model as per the wording of Hyper Aggressive, but you would choose the order in which they triggered. I don't think you can trigger two rules of the same type with the same trigger. For example, Fennblades with officer get Cleave and Madrak2's feat gives berserk and overtake. After each kill you have to choose whether to trigger Cleave or berserk. You can't bank the extra attack for when you miss our fail to make a kill. Both of your rules appear to have identical triggers and also grant movement "after the attack", which is at the same time. TLDR: I recommend a trip to the pp forums before trying this tactic out.
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Post by hocestbellum on Feb 19, 2019 23:24:15 GMT
Just to clarify here; I'm not aware of any reason that this would not work as neither Hyper Aggressive or Poison Pill are 'End of Activation' resolutions. As far as I can figure Beast-09 under Malakov2's feat would get two separate 4" moves from the triggering of Hyper Aggressive and Poison Pill. One of these moves would have to be directly towards the damaging model as per the wording of Hyper Aggressive, but you would choose the order in which they triggered. I don't think you can trigger two rules of the same type with the same trigger. For example, Fennblades with officer get Cleave and Madrak2's feat gives berserk and overtake. After each kill you have to choose whether to trigger Cleave or berserk. You can't bank the extra attack for when you miss our fail to make a kill. Both of your rules appear to have identical triggers and also grant movement "after the attack", which is at the same time. TLDR: I recommend a trip to the pp forums before trying this tactic out. There's a specific separate rule that says you cannot gain more than one attack from an attack, but the movements are not attacks. I need to find time to go through the rulebook to check, but I'm 99% certain it's fine. It feels similar to the Admonition Counter Charge things
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ace
BattleBox Champ
Posts: 52
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Post by ace on Feb 20, 2019 0:50:53 GMT
Can Strakhov or Torch perform both overrun and sprint? That would be good to know as I use both models.
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ace
BattleBox Champ
Posts: 52
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Post by ace on Feb 20, 2019 0:54:12 GMT
And as for the list that started the thread. I just kind of put it together with all the jaws of the Wolf allowable models I had. Wasn’t sure what list I would play it into. I see that there are a lot of limitations with it. I’ll probably play a similar list with Sorscha1 to see how it goes and then I’ll have a better idea whether Malakov is the answer or if the list is just not going to work. Thanks for the feedback.
This thread has gotten me curious about the double rule trigger question.
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