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Post by sand20go on Feb 3, 2019 17:41:08 GMT
I am clearly not really thinking about how best to deal with him (or at least how to make it so he doesn't trade up SIGNIFICANTLY). He starts with a corpse and with the ubiquitous pot likely has three when he starts to POW 16 thresher which he then likely generates additional corpse tokens from. Then, after eating a significant number of models, he sits deep in your lines. He isn't THAT hard to kill but he does require resources which can screw up your activations and that is a problem cause we are slow and they are fast and that puts us at a disadvantage in scenario.
And of course if you by some horrible error get in CHARGE range of him he can end the game right then and there with his charge, shoot, place and murderate your caster.
If there is evidence of Michael's observation that Circle players "gamed" the CID it is this guy. But rather than female dog lets try to figure out how to deal with it. (One I have had is to offer him up THREE man pods of Shocks that, properly positioned, would only give him, at best, one model in back arc).
Thoughts? I would especially be interested in Loud Chris on this because I would have to think that forces Stalingrade to play WAY wide and spready out into Circle, reducing the efficiency of Irusk2's bubbles.
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Post by hocestbellum on Feb 3, 2019 18:22:19 GMT
I guess the Stalingrad lists' answer is something along the lines of 'let him do his thing and have the remaining 50 guys kick his head in'.
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mazog
Junior Strategist
Walking and talking
Posts: 748
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Post by mazog on Feb 3, 2019 18:54:23 GMT
Shield guards, preferably several, seem to be the most common technique from my reading across factions, but you don't have access to many as I recall.
Would that pod of shock troopers all be facing inward? That is the only way I can see to avoid giving him back arc on two of three guys, but it does give just about everybody else back arc on all three...
I feel like y'all have enough reliable shooting and a couple of anti-stealth techniques that he would not be so bad as long as they don't body-block your line of sight, but then you can blow up those guys, right?
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Post by sand20go on Feb 3, 2019 19:37:08 GMT
Shield guards, preferably several, seem to be the most common technique from my reading across factions, but you don't have access to many as I recall. Would that pod of shock troopers all be facing inward? That is the only way I can see to avoid giving him back arc on two of three guys, but it does give just about everybody else back arc on all three... I feel like y'all have enough reliable shooting and a couple of anti-stealth techniques that he would not be so bad as long as they don't body-block your line of sight, but then you can blow up those guys, right? It is pretty easy for circle to exploit los blocking forests to keep him safe until he goes. Particularly Particularly ok ne he is ad and our anti stealth is not. |
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Post by steeltitan on Feb 3, 2019 20:29:18 GMT
Play Jaws with all the jacks and laugh as he tries to scratch the paint off of your jacks...and then repeatedly vent steam all over that little turd to avoid his DEF nonsense.
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Post by Armchair Warrior on Feb 3, 2019 20:33:37 GMT
That about sums it up.
No, wait, huh?
It is a total head scratcher to me that Lord of the Feast and Yuri both exist in the same game at 6 points. Anecdotally, I am trying to figure out how LotF is ARM 16, which incidentally is the same base ARM as a MOW Demo Corp. I mean...come on.
How do you deal with him? I dunno, the same way we deal with other annoying stealth solos? Nothing magical here. And, yeah, he can be kind of hard to remove but so are hellmouths so it’s not like he’s the first free, annoying, OP, hard target we’ve been up against...
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Post by redheadtheruthless on Feb 3, 2019 20:41:40 GMT
I'm glad someone else has been frustrated dealing with this thing. There just doesn't feel like there is very much counter play against him if the circle player doesn't mess up other than hoping they roll bad/position the pot poorly (which happened against a newer circle player: they didn't have puppet master and then rolled bad for the bird). It feels like there is a warmachine and hordes where Yuri is balanced but Tharn are playing a totally different game...I do think that shocktroopers in triangles is probably one of the better things to try and bait him in with but that's counting on basically a mistake
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Post by kovnikninehouse on Feb 3, 2019 20:53:30 GMT
Greylord Adjunct and Irusk2 makes for a super sad Lord of OP Dance
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Post by auraco on Feb 3, 2019 22:29:55 GMT
Played into tharn with Old Witch2, windstorm is a good tool to help reduce the potential of the Lord of the Fest, but yeah this model is way too strong, and I think is an example of failed cid, it would need to be balanced and I hope PP won't just say, well it was in CID so it's all good.
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Zaku
Junior Strategist
Posts: 224 
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Post by Zaku on Feb 3, 2019 23:29:15 GMT
Strakhov1 in Jaws with a Spriggan. Charge it at MAT 10 with Superiority, Overrun the Spriggan into a different target to continue smashing face, or drop some Flares on him for Widowmakers to trivially remove him.
I don't know what you are running, but we have options.
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Post by joetortillas on Feb 4, 2019 0:41:31 GMT
Your circle player lets his LOTF get charged by a jack?
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Post by sand20go on Feb 4, 2019 1:10:05 GMT
Your circle player lets his LOTF get charged by a jack? Yeah. That seems like a BAD circle player. Strakov in Jaws wants (must?) be within 6 inches of his jack because you really want to be able to cast overrun BEFORE moving (now the adjunct adds 2 inches and will be a near mandatory autoinclude so it should be noted that this will be 8 inches and a LOT better in the future). So you are pretty vulnerable, depending on terrain, scenario, ect. of getting the charge, pop and drop. It isn't a BAD plan. But strakov in jaws would be, it seems, really vulnerable to get just getting iona to the face and you don't have great overrun target in that match up and if you miss and he dodges....oiy boy. |
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Zaku
Junior Strategist
Posts: 224
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Post by Zaku on Feb 4, 2019 1:22:49 GMT
Your circle player lets his LOTF get charged by a jack? I mean, that was just an example. You can also Trample with the Spriggan and drop a Flare, so much can be done besides just bemoaning that Circle got a model a bit above the power curve in their CID. And if they are keeping their Lord of the Feast back to keep it out of range of your 'jack, that is honestly a winning situation, because while you haven't killed the model, you are controlling where and how it engages. |
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Post by sand20go on Feb 4, 2019 1:46:16 GMT
Your circle player lets his LOTF get charged by a jack? I mean, that was just an example. You can also Trample with the Spriggan and drop a Flare, so much can be done besides just bemoaning that Circle got a model a bit above the power curve in their CID. And if they are keeping their Lord of the Feast back to keep it out of range of your 'jack, that is honestly a winning situation, because while you haven't killed the model, you are controlling where and how it engages. I don't want to be a jerk but honestly this answer suggests.... A) you don't play B) You are part of the problem - circle players that are gaming the CID by underplaying the model. Lets go through this. A) Your plan is immediately defeated by keeping the LoFt 3.1 inches into a forest. B) Since the LofT will be - at a MINIMUM ARM 17 and in many cases ARM 18 or 19 it means that the spriggan's second flare, which will need an 8 to hit and neet to be boosted to do damage. Since Superiority doesn't provide you a free trample so you are spending 3 focus to do likely 1 to 3 points. You now have to shoot with your widows. Flare doesn't reduce. So you need the full unit _AND_ the WMM. Given the way that sniper is written you don't get the autopoint UNLESS you opt not to roll. SO you are going to take the autopoint EXCEPT for the WMM). So yes, if we put in 29 points of models _AND_ 3 focus we MIGHT kill the LOF. However, Should you NOT kill him....cause dice - your spriggan is now within 11 inches. So he is absolutely ready to be charged and then something shot and now the LoFT is likely to go murder strakov UNLESS - not only investing 29 points to do this you ALSO decided to trample the Spriggan out of Strakov's control range. So again - do you not play the game or are you a circle troll? |
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Zaku
Junior Strategist
Posts: 224
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Post by Zaku on Feb 4, 2019 4:15:32 GMT
I mean, that was just an example. You can also Trample with the Spriggan and drop a Flare, so much can be done besides just bemoaning that Circle got a model a bit above the power curve in their CID. And if they are keeping their Lord of the Feast back to keep it out of range of your 'jack, that is honestly a winning situation, because while you haven't killed the model, you are controlling where and how it engages. I don't want to be a jerk but honestly this answer suggests.... A) you don't play B) You are part of the problem - circle players that are gaming the CID by underplaying the model. Lets go through this. A) Your plan is immediately defeated by keeping the LoFt 3.1 inches into a forest. B) Since the LofT will be - at a MINIMUM ARM 17 and in many cases ARM 18 or 19 it means that the spriggan's second flare, which will need an 8 to hit and neet to be boosted to do damage. Since Superiority doesn't provide you a free trample so you are spending 3 focus to do likely 1 to 3 points. You now have to shoot with your widows. Flare doesn't reduce. So you need the full unit _AND_ the WMM. Given the way that sniper is written you don't get the autopoint UNLESS you opt not to roll. SO you are going to take the autopoint EXCEPT for the WMM). So yes, if we put in 29 points of models _AND_ 3 focus we MIGHT kill the LOF. However, Should you NOT kill him....cause dice - your spriggan is now within 11 inches. So he is absolutely ready to be charged and then something shot and now the LoFT is likely to go murder strakov UNLESS - not only investing 29 points to do this you ALSO decided to trample the Spriggan out of Strakov's control range. So again - do you not play the game or are you a circle troll? Holy crap dude, tone down the hostility. All I am trying to do is provide potential solutions, so save the screeching. When did I ever say the Spriggan would blast off a RAT 4 grenade at the LoTF? Please, tell me where. Even a filthy casual like myself knows that is a bad plan, which is why I ONLY suggested using the Flare option against the LoTF. The second granade can go against something, you don't even need to cast Overrun depending on the board positions, as a Spriggan with Superiority is still dropping a Flare within 16" of it's starting point. Okay, so the Widowmakers and WMM now have to shoot at it... Oh no? With how much just a single model seems to tilt you, and blow up your plans, wouldn't killing it help you get your mind back on the game and stop raging over how Circle players gamed the CID system? At this point, not much we can do about it until a dynamic update, so having an adult conversation around how we can deal with it, and the options at our disposal would be of better benefit that attacking each other. Whatever, good luck dude, hopefully you don't rage too hard over your games against Circle. |
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