Ganso
Junior Strategist
Posts: 932
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Post by Ganso on Jan 31, 2019 18:26:04 GMT
I still think this cloud wall tech is arriving late to a meta that had to deal with Halley_3 and High Reclaimer. I like it for some on the fly mitigation, but not as a lynchpin to my strategy
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Post by sand20go on Jan 31, 2019 19:54:24 GMT
I still think this cloud wall tech is arriving late to a meta that had to deal with Halley_3 and High Reclaimer. I like it for some on the fly mitigation, but not as a lynchpin to my strategy This is interesting. We are going to have to compare notes after a while. I am not going to argue more against you but it will be interesting to see our different approaches (OW2 vs. Z1) and compare notes at the end.
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Ganso
Junior Strategist
Posts: 932
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Post by Ganso on Jan 31, 2019 19:57:32 GMT
Well, just to be clear, I think Z1 cloud wall is perfectly fine, that's her shtick, plus she has a great Feat to punish does that rush the wall, and she slaps a -2 debuff. So even if the opponent can see pass clouds, he still can't mitigate the penalty, which makes Doomies effective DEF 15 even against melee.
What I don't think has legs is building a Doomie Cloud Wall with the Ternions with Random caster.
That said, I'm building my OW2 to be able to pivot against Huge bases, which is why I'm running 3 Marauders for an explosive Feat Turn.
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Post by sand20go on Jan 31, 2019 20:13:06 GMT
What I don't think has legs is building a Doomie Cloud Wall with the Ternions with Random caster. THis I COMPLETELY agree with. The key with Wolves is layering. Layering Wave after wave of doomies, layering debuffs, and layering anti-shooting tech to deliver. So I am in complete agreeing that, for example, Vlad1 can't pull this off (though god if he could) because it just isn't good enough. Ditto Butcher 1.PROBABLY also OW1. You can't just rely upon clouds.....but clouds on doomies turn someone like Z1 up to an 11 because she can get away with casting fewer of those and more wonderous hex blasts. Hey Phil - take that Bulwark token and your stupid b2B Molik Karn and get it the heck out of here ;-)
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Post by Mr.Human on Jan 31, 2019 20:21:48 GMT
Cool updates, just wish Bad Santa could be played in WG and/or Jaws. Never really cared for for the mindless berserkers
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Post by mcdermott on Jan 31, 2019 20:57:22 GMT
I still think this cloud wall tech is arriving late to a meta that had to deal with Halley_3 and High Reclaimer. I like it for some on the fly mitigation, but not as a lynchpin to my strategy The backbone infantry is so one dimensional having some out of your pocket trickery is better than none.
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Post by mcdermott on Jan 31, 2019 22:17:16 GMT
Incidentally, i would be absolutely STUNNED if anyone here playtested doomie spam/wolves of winter more than jdeckert. I can attest to the fact that he's made doomreaver spam w b2 work in a tournament scene when everyone was well assured it was hot garbage that couldn't stand up to the meta defining lists.
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Post by sand20go on Jan 31, 2019 22:51:22 GMT
Well I am hunting the white whale again tonight. Z1 into Juris piloting Gearheart. Say a prayer for me. Yup....my meta ;-)
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Post by sand20go on Feb 1, 2019 1:25:49 GMT
Hey guys. Go reread the escort's rules. Then go read the wording for GarCols. Guess that that means?
No healing on those GarCols.
Now it seems to be an aura so you could heal it after killing it but that could create some fun order of activation challenges...
Keep your rule book handy ;-)
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Post by tjhairball on Feb 1, 2019 3:38:25 GMT
Really? Clouds on doom reavers is more useful and frostbite to bonds of woe is a lateral move at worst. Yeah, you could catch more targets with the spray, but bonds of woe has better range and could give you a bonus reaver. They're pretty much strictly better and can be taken as a free option. You'll definitely see them more than before. Ternion clouds never made competitive impact before themes, so I'm very sceptical about them making impact now that they are limited to a theme without really good target for them. Meanwhile their sprays were premier infantry clears and they lost it. Their freeze spell solved some meta things like Admonition and they lost it too. It also helped doomies hit, now doomies have actual problem with hitting def 14+ things.
Rfp is a thing, but do we need it anymore? Especially in these low amounts?
I guess 3x free ternion + doomie spam under Irusk2 can be a real thing now, but not because ternions being good, rather because spam of tough+no-knockdown is good and free points of any kind are good.
I got a lot of mileage out of my ternion in Mk 2 - they kept Old Witch and Scrapjack stealth, and often kept my casters just that much safer against being shot to death by all the gunlines. As a second line behind the Kayazy in Hunting Wolves, they did a lot of infantry clearing behind the Kayazy (spraying into melee being amazing). Magical sprays did (and still do) ignore most defensive tech - target in melee, concealment, stealth, incorporeal, et cetera. They weren't front-line troops, but if the enemy got gummed up by my first wave - or crammed their first wave in my face - Magic Ability 7 + POW 12 sprays really were pretty lethal.
This is a much more specialized piece of kit, and it makes them less effective at fighting overall.
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Post by sand20go on Feb 1, 2019 14:19:10 GMT
Well I am hunting the white whale again tonight. Z1 into Juris piloting Gearheart. Say a prayer for me. Yup....my meta ;-) Went "OK". Z1 did get up 3-0 on Scenario play but the doomies couldn't weather out all that shooting. When you can snipe and shoot from 16/18 inches......and quasi-dead eye meant def 15 doomies didn't really matter ;-) and at that risk of confirmation bias there were at LEAST two times I REALLY missed the sprays on the greylords. REALLY missed. Actually....what ARE people playing into that hot mess of OP? AC would be, Juris and I believe, only just OK under Vlad2 because of the 4 point swing (Dragon Breath and Feat) that Gearheart can play.
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Post by Gamingdevil on Feb 1, 2019 14:29:53 GMT
Well I am hunting the white whale again tonight. Z1 into Juris piloting Gearheart. Say a prayer for me. Yup....my meta ;-) Went "OK". Z1 did get up 3-0 on Scenario play but the doomies couldn't weather out all that shooting. When you can snipe and shoot from 16/18 inches......and quasi-dead eye meant def 15 doomies didn't really matter ;-) and at that risk of confirmation bias there were at LEAST two times I REALLY missed the sprays on the greylords. REALLY missed. Actually....what ARE people playing into that hot mess of OP? AC would be, Juris and I believe, only just OK under Vlad2 because of the 4 point swing (Dragon Breath and Feat) that Gearheart can play. Old Witch 2 would probably help and I would actually expect Doom Reavers to do okayish because Tough and decent DEF is annoying (only 1 unit can have Deadeye) for them and you can apparate + run to engage 16" away, on top of AD.
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Post by sand20go on Feb 1, 2019 14:59:11 GMT
Went "OK". Z1 did get up 3-0 on Scenario play but the doomies couldn't weather out all that shooting. When you can snipe and shoot from 16/18 inches......and quasi-dead eye meant def 15 doomies didn't really matter ;-) and at that risk of confirmation bias there were at LEAST two times I REALLY missed the sprays on the greylords. REALLY missed. Actually....what ARE people playing into that hot mess of OP? AC would be, Juris and I believe, only just OK under Vlad2 because of the 4 point swing (Dragon Breath and Feat) that Gearheart can play. Old Witch 2 would probably help and I would actually expect Doom Reavers to do okayish because Tough and decent DEF is annoying (only 1 unit can have Deadeye) for them and you can apparate + run to engage 16" away, on top of AD. That might have worked. He had the vulcan there to do what it needed to do in respect to sprays and the assualt troopers (I always get those mixed up) behind the hammer troopers so engaging would have been challenging. That said, it probably would have been a decent strategy in respect to getting more doomies into the mix.
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Post by welshhoppo on Feb 1, 2019 15:29:51 GMT
I know certain CG players are terrified of OW2 wolves coming along and breaking their faces in.
Try her out. She's proper good.
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Post by sand20go on Feb 1, 2019 17:00:15 GMT
I know certain CG players are terrified of OW2 wolves coming along and breaking their faces in. Try her out. She's proper good. I think I am going to have to (Ganso sniggers). Khador is just too vulnerable to high value shooting. Always has been.
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