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Post by vasquez21 on Oct 17, 2018 7:34:21 GMT
So we can all read great Trollock threat where he rate casters. But I was wandering what are your guys opinion for currently our most powerful and most useless casters.
It's easier in my opinion to choose casters which lacks something, than to choose few which are overpowered comparing to others.
So my suggestion is pick one caster which you think could be currently too powerful and could be possibly changed because of that, and for bottom 3 pick three casters which you think currently need some changes to be playable.
I will start:
TOP caster:
Madrak 1
Bottom 3:
Madrak 3 Borka 1 Grim 2
TOTALING VOTES FOR BETTER VIEW:
TOP 12x Kolgrima 1 7x Madrak 1
BOTTOM 19x Madrak 3 9x Doomy 1 11x Grissel 1
6x Borka 1 4x Grim 2 4x Horgle 2 1x Jarl 1 1x Doomy 2 1x Grissel 2
voters (14): Arcaux, Big Fat Troll, cuberic, dabomma, deathbymelancholy, dickovdk, emb, gdnerd, ghoulio, grimgor, joedj, jonwill, mhean, moridamn, rad10hazard, robobengt, skurkious, trollock, Vasquez
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Arcaux
Junior Strategist
Posts: 724
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Post by Arcaux on Oct 17, 2018 7:56:25 GMT
I don't think any of our casters are too powerful, however Kolgrima is, in my mind, clearly our strongest caster right now. As for bottom 3 - Grissel 1: The fix is as simple as adding that Enemy models can't charge in her feat like in Mk2 - Doomy 1: I used to love this guy, but he feels outclassed by Doomy3 in every way nowadays. Again the feat feels underwhelming. - Madrak 3:
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Post by grimgor on Oct 17, 2018 9:30:58 GMT
Top : Kolgrimma
Bottom 3 : Doomy 1, Madrak 3, Borka 1.
Atleast, i think Grissel has more interesting things to do than borka 1. Madrak's 3 design is very interesting too, but his spell list is too weak, and his feat too much random, atleast we should have parry on the 3" move... The stone aura isn't enough too
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Post by jonwill on Oct 17, 2018 9:38:39 GMT
As a player who recently started (the faction) take all my opinions with a lack of experience, however I think Kolgrimma is probably the top 1 through almost versatility alone, but also thanks to some really strong spells and a great feat. The bottom three is slightly more difficult, I haven't really had much chance to explore the faction outside Madrak1, Borka2 and Ragnor, who all seem quite strong. Looking at the rules and with some experience I feel like Madrak3, Borka1, and quite possibly Horgle2,
Madrak3's spells look a little underwhelming, and he doesn't seem to do much for warbeasts save for fury management.
Borka1 seems like fun to play, but all-together too straightforward to do much exciting.
Horgle2 just doesn't look very good, relying on fire effects to use his feat seems rough.
I mean, I'll still play most of these for the fun factor, but overall these are the three I'm least excited about rules wise. I do however really want to put Madrak3 on a table because that model is awesome in my eyes.
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Post by moridamn on Oct 17, 2018 10:28:23 GMT
Top: Madrak1
Bottom: Madrak3, Doomie1, Grissel1
I actually don't mind Horgle as much. I've run him in SotN with a GK and it's pretty devastating what you can do at a range with him on feat turn. Remember that continuous fire applies on hit, so HHH effectively gets boosted damage on all its ranges attacks. Solid Ground is also pretty good since we don't have a lot of anti blast.
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Post by Trollock on Oct 17, 2018 12:29:08 GMT
Best: Madrak 1
Worst: Madrak 3, Grim 2, Grissel 1.
HOWEVER, i think all of them are playable still. There are other casters that might be unplayed cause they do not fit in the current meta, but these casters are weaker than the rest imo.
Steamroller makes some weak casters playable (like Jarl) and sone strong casters unplayable (like Doomy 2). It is kind of hard to decide how much to factor in curre t SR and current meta...
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Post by ghoulio on Oct 17, 2018 13:58:34 GMT
Best: Madrak 1
Worst: Madrak 3, Jarl and Doomshaper 1
Madrak 3: Just a pure lack of focus on this caster. He has a bunch of unique and really cool abilities (shield guard, righteous vengeance, stone arura, etc), but his spell list and feat are a complete mess across the board. Also HOW his stone aura works drains literally any fun out of this caster. If this guy ever gets sorted he will probably be the only caster I play as I think he is the best caster model in the game. Just love how he looks
Jarl: It's not that Jarl is bad per-say, I just think he really needs...something. Like a native way to pay for his upkeeps (like resourceful) and maybe switching out weald secrets for dead-eye. Something to boost either hitting or damage would definitely go a long way to improving him, specifically a buff because debuffs on Fury 6 casters is negative fun (Grissel 1 and Grim 2...I am looking at you).
Doomshaper 1: Another caster that isnt bad per-say. He does actually have a fairly solid spell list and still has goad. I just find whenever I am looking for a caster to play, he literally never enters my thought process for picking a caster. You could also throw Borka 1 or Ragnor in this slot for the same reason. I just find them so boring.
Regardless of my list I have to agree with Trollock though, they are all still playable. Honestly the only caster I think needs a legit re-write is Madrak 3 as at least every other caster has a legit direction, even if I dont like it (Jarl/Doomshaper 1/Borka 1, etc)
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skurkious
Junior Strategist
For Kith and Kriel!
Posts: 206
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Post by skurkious on Oct 17, 2018 15:12:43 GMT
Best: Kolgrimma - Not broken but is the strongest denial caster which isn't super fun to play into.
Worst:
Madrak 3: close but not quite to being super viable and interesting Borka 1: They just made him incredibly boring in this edition Grissel 1: Making one model really good a turn doesn't do it for me and her feat is horrendous.
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Post by dickovdk on Oct 17, 2018 16:03:27 GMT
Well top1 : Kolgrimma Reason being she fits everywhere, any theme. She can mix up the game like no other. She has all the tools and covers a majority of the current hotness out there
Follow-ups all other cid boosted casters since CID basically made TB playable again. Look at who are going anywhere in tournaments: Grim1, Madrak1, Bearka and of course Kolgrimma
What's down there in the bottom Madrak3, Grim2 and toss up between grissel1 and horgle2. Coin flipped at Gris1 I think but it's close
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cuberic
Junior Strategist
Posts: 129
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Post by cuberic on Oct 17, 2018 16:07:35 GMT
Best: Kolgrimma, because I find madrak1 super boring and every CID that is coming out has a similar medium base style of play so counters are bound to prop up.
Worst: Grissel1. She doesn't do enough to help protect her army nor enough to help it attrition, and has pretty terrible personal threat. Madrak3. A mix bag of stuff. I haven't played him, but he doesn't really provide an answer or a question in the current meta. Doomy2: Without refuge he is a feat, and then what? His best synergy is with another warlocks character beast, and does nothing for anything else in the theme that he can take it.
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gdnerd
Junior Strategist
Posts: 656
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Post by gdnerd on Oct 17, 2018 16:58:02 GMT
Best: Madrak1
Worst: Grim2, Madrak3, Doom1
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Post by deathbymelancholy on Oct 17, 2018 17:41:03 GMT
Best: Madrak1, which I DO NOT think at all makes him nerf-able. His kit together makes him excellent. Remove any of it and he will fall into the middling tier in a heartbeat.
Worst:Doomy1- I forget he exists sometimes Horgle- Again, his name in Warroom pops up and I'm like, "oh yea, forgot about that guy" and then I keep scrolling Madrak3- One of my personal favourites to play, but I would never bring him to a competition I wanted to win
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Post by grimgor on Oct 17, 2018 18:17:25 GMT
I'm interested in the fact that most of people here think that madrak 1 is better than kolgrimma. Could you say why you think that ? For me kolgrimma's feat that prevent shooting and her sprays/clouds are her best arguments. Even ground is certainly the best argument for madrak 1 and his feat but can be countered by a lot of thing (stalkers, anamag, blessed (Menoth), wraithbane, arcana accursed, Mortality, ...)
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Post by deathbymelancholy on Oct 17, 2018 18:21:17 GMT
I'm interested in the fact that most of people here think that madrak 1 is better than kolgrimma. Could you say why you think that ? For me kolgrimma's feat that prevent shooting and her sprays/clouds are her best arguments. Even ground is certainly the best argument for madrak 1 and his feat but can be countered by a lot of thing (stalkers, anamag, blessed (Menoth), wraithbane, arcana accursed, Mortality, ...) I've never played one game with Kolgrimma, don't own the model, am not particularly drawn to her, and have no opinion on which to base my argument if one was needed.
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Post by Big Fat Troll on Oct 17, 2018 19:34:38 GMT
If you're asking only about power level, the best is Kolgrima. The weakest would have to be:
Grissel 1, but only because not having a feat is such a huge deficit to overcome. She is otherwise playable and could easily be quite good even without her feat being as badly overpowered as it was in Mk2.
Madrak 3's design has a lot of potential, but it is just not quite cohesive.
Doomy 1 is not even weak so much as way too corner-case. I just don't know when I would need him for anything that other warlocks can't do better and I keep forgetting about him. The one thing that he does better than anyone else is upkeep removal, and even that is debatable, and even for much of that, it's better to just play Madrak 3 for Spellpiercer.
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