cuberic
Junior Strategist
Posts: 129
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Post by cuberic on Oct 19, 2018 15:26:41 GMT
What about dropping raiders and running a Hooch Hauler instead? Costs as much as 2 min raiders. When using raiders with kolgrimma I tend to curse fate to get the most out of their ability to clear a unit. A hooch hauler under the same circumstances can do the same amount of work. It also comes with the added bonus of not needing clouds to protect it from range attacks turn 1 letting you fully fill the stone turn 1. If it survives long enough for that assassination run the hooch hauler can definitely add a few more shots into the mix.
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Post by deathbymelancholy on Oct 19, 2018 15:29:52 GMT
It's like 3 or 4 times the price of a unit of Raiders?
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gdnerd
Junior Strategist
Posts: 656
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Post by gdnerd on Oct 19, 2018 19:30:03 GMT
In general Kolgrima wins attrition. Her spray will kill pretty much everything depending on how you boost it. Just have to make sure she doesn't die. Honestly I've been seriously considering dropping the raiders for a second set of champs but haven't dojoed it enough yet. The main problem with raiders here being that they take up a massive footprint and will either jam in your "good" units or fail to hide behind clouds and will die to anti-skirmish tools pretty easily (often out of stone and no even ground makes 13/14 tough w/o steady a sad statline). That said they are exceedingly good at clearing chaff and keeping your opponent at arms length until you can plant the champs somewhere where they will win you scenario or attrition based on how your opponent handles it. I'd hard pressed to see double Raiders in a list in the current metagame though - they have a hard time cracking all but the lightest units. I'd be more wont to try something like that with Madrak1 - 20 15/14 tough steady medium bases that can move through each other sounds like a nightmare. I know you'd need to play around with the points etc, but have you considered Min Raiders?
I almost always run them min nowadays as they achieve much of the same effect while being less in the way.
I've been trying to figure it out for Madrak1, but points is the main problem. It costs 3 points more to have double min raiders which requires me to either min the stone or turn Lanyssa + Swamp Gobbers into a Gremlin Swarm, neither of which I want to do for various reasons. Kolgrima is somehow even fussier on her points loadout. Maybe single min with Kolgrima could be a thing but IDK what I'd do with the 6 points of savings.
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bundeez
Junior Strategist
Posts: 325
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Post by bundeez on Oct 19, 2018 20:17:41 GMT
Upgrade her battlegroup? Losing the light and adding a mauler or EBDT. Or lose both and upgrade to a Glacier king even. Interesting points on the raiders btw. I agree that they don't do much with Kolgrima besides being speed bumps etc. Considered BoH with Fennblades instead since they do more on their own, but I guess the ambushing bears and lookouts are just better? I'm intrigued by the double Champs though. Since you have a cloud wall you can deliver them and they don't need the raider screen. With 2 attacks they can attrition vs warrior models too. But is def14 enough is the question
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Post by Big Fat Troll on Oct 19, 2018 20:30:12 GMT
Upgrade her battlegroup? Losing the light and adding a mauler or EBDT. Or lose both and upgrade to a Glacier king even. Interesting points on the raiders btw. I agree that they don't do much with Kolgrima besides being speed bumps etc. Considered BoH with Fennblades instead since they do more on their own, but I guess the ambushing bears and lookouts are just better? I'm intrigued by the double Champs though. Since you have a cloud wall you can deliver them and they don't need the raider screen. With 2 attacks they can attrition vs warrior models too. But is def14 enough is the question :) 16 effectively if the clouds are helping.
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Post by Big Fat Troll on Oct 19, 2018 20:35:40 GMT
It's like 3 or 4 times the price of a unit of Raiders? :) Twice, but who's counting?
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Post by datboi on Oct 19, 2018 21:05:45 GMT
Upgrade her battlegroup? Losing the light and adding a mauler or EBDT. Or lose both and upgrade to a Glacier king even. Interesting points on the raiders btw. I agree that they don't do much with Kolgrima besides being speed bumps etc. Considered BoH with Fennblades instead since they do more on their own, but I guess the ambushing bears and lookouts are just better? I'm intrigued by the double Champs though. Since you have a cloud wall you can deliver them and they don't need the raider screen. With 2 attacks they can attrition vs warrior models too. But is def14 enough is the question Making the light turn into a mauler sounds like a massive upgrade imo. Pretty enticing.
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Post by datboi on Oct 19, 2018 21:08:17 GMT
I've been trying to figure it out for Madrak1, but points is the main problem. It costs 3 points more to have double min raiders which requires me to either min the stone or turn Lanyssa + Swamp Gobbers into a Gremlin Swarm, neither of which I want to do for various reasons. Kolgrima is somehow even fussier on her points loadout. Maybe single min with Kolgrima could be a thing but IDK what I'd do with the 6 points of savings. Could do [Max + Lanyssa] = [2 x min + gobber chef]
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gdnerd
Junior Strategist
Posts: 656
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Post by gdnerd on Oct 21, 2018 3:08:08 GMT
I've been trying to figure it out for Madrak1, but points is the main problem. It costs 3 points more to have double min raiders which requires me to either min the stone or turn Lanyssa + Swamp Gobbers into a Gremlin Swarm, neither of which I want to do for various reasons. Kolgrima is somehow even fussier on her points loadout. Maybe single min with Kolgrima could be a thing but IDK what I'd do with the 6 points of savings. Could do [Max + Lanyssa] = [2 x min + gobber chef] Yes but again I want lanyssa.
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