Post by Arcaux on Aug 29, 2018 11:27:27 GMT
Hoarluk Doomshaper, Dire Prophet
(AKA Doomy3, Doom3y)
Fluff
The Trolls version of the old wizard trope. Hoarluk Doomshaper represents many interesting facets of what it means to be a troll. He bears a grudge against all of humanity and this causes him to come to blows with many of the other warlocks in our faction, despite this he is one of Madrak’s most trusted advisors and he always does what he thinks is right for the Trollblood people. He is our loremaster and more attuned with beasts than any other caster in our faction. His third incarnation goes off in search of the Glacier kings and could very well of been a Northkin caster if that theme had existed when he came out.
Meta
All three Doomys are definitively beast casters and how well that fits in the current meta is your call. The 2017 and 2018 scenario packs emphasize scoring units, but jack spam is currently a very real thing. Grymkin have the ability to shut down your feat with access to a battle engine that stops all healing nearby and an arcana that stops healing for a turn. These kind of things should all be taken into consideration if you want to play him.
Stats
As already stated Hoarluk Doomshaper is an old man and his stats certainly reinforce that. Speed 5 is average for Trolls. His Mat, Defence, Armour and Hit Points are all below average meaning he doesn’t want or need to play far up the board and he’s much squishier than most Troll Casters.
His fury 7 stat however is excellent and especially with Arcane repeater on the Runebearer and access to an arc node he can often sit back in safety.
Weapons
Doomy has his 2 inch reach staff that this time has Critical smite. It’s fine in a pinch, especially if you desperately need to fish for that crit smite, but still isn’t really something you want to rely on. It’s more something to remember in case you ever need to desperately move a model out of a zone to win on scenario.
Spells
Doomy3 has a great feat, but this spell list might be even better. He asks questions and solves problems and with a fury 7 stat can actually get them off.
Admonition: Excellent spell. Whether you’re using it early on to play more aggressively with a key piece or using it late game to stop yourself from being assassinated Admonition is almost always useful. Most of our heavies take a heavy to kill them and the idea of just moving away with no free strike is tilting to the extreme. This is one of those abilities like counter charge that shouldn’t ever come off if everyone played perfectly, but Warmachine makes you remember way too much stuff and suddenly you’re moving away from a key charge and you’ve won the game. Even if your opponent plays around it they will be giving up ideal positioning or attrition pieces to jam you in. The generally accepted best ways around it involve knocking down the model, but due to Implacability that just isn’t an option here.
On top of that you can use ability offensively to counter your opponents Admonition, they move away and you follow. This makes the spell very useful in matchups like Issyria, Vayle1, Rask and Skarre2. A similar trick works against Enliven (Menoth, Gators) and Counter Charge. You can see that it doesn’t just cause enemies problems, but can be used to solve them yourself.
The more you use it the more creative you can get with it. A favourite trick is to put it on an Earthborn that needs to go in to initiate a piece trade. He leaves the water or obstacle that is granting him defensive stats. Admonition means he can maybe hop back and get back to armour 22 or def 14 when your opponent goes in on him and suddenly he might have piece traded for free. The real beauty is that things that happen in your opponents turn often change what an opponent needs to do and especially against Warmachine suddenly a well planned turn can go completely wrong as a fully loaded Warjack watches a beast admonition out of reach. Sure they have other jacks, but do any of them have fury on them?
Implacability: Implacability is in the argument for the best spell in the game. It shuts down entire lists and what they want to do. It counters some of the other most powerful spells in the game and it takes away your opponents options. It isn’t even an upkeep so they can’t get rid of it that way. Simply put your army can’t be moved or knocked down.
This combos great with admonition, but it also shuts down feats that move you (Kruegar2, Gorten, Thexus) as well as placement spells like Telekenesis, Gallows and Abyssal Gate. Hell it even shuts down drags, not that we needed help with that, but now we don’t even need to drop a whelp. This takes away your opponents game plan and suddenly they are fighting against a troll beast brick and they don’t have their tricks.
Repudiate: A great toolbox spell. Every form of Doomy has some kind of dispel and while this certainly isn’t as good as Dissolution it always doesn’t cost 4 fury to cast. You won’t cast it every game, but when you do it’ll be money. Hell some opponents won’t bother to caster certain upkeep spells, because they know you can get rid of it and don’t want to take the extra damage, which is even better.
Finally don’t underestimate the damage. On rare occasions it can be the difference between winning and losing. I’ve had a few assassinations succeed, because of the extra damage done by a few repudiates getting rid of otherwise meaningless upkeeps. Hell if you’re going all in and you can’t get a line to hit a strangehold or they are too high armor and they have the upkeeps out why not throw two repudiates out and get an extra bit of damage out.
Stranglehold: Supremely underrated Stranglehold is a fantastic spell and should be part of your late game plan in most games and is situationally excellent early on. The main downside with Stranglehold is that you need to do damage so in most cases it’s going to use 3 fury and has a not insignificant chance to do literally nothing. The reward though can be game winning. You can shut down a heavy jack or even a colossal for a turn.
The biggest issue with this spell before was that you had to be 10 inches away with Doomy to cast it, but the emergence of Mulg as an arcnode means that problem is gone. Send Mulg in and kill a heavy before using your animus (He can kill most things with 4 fury) and then fire a stranglehold onto the only jack that can get to him. If it does fail to do damage you still have admonition on Mulg to get him back to safety.
Unminding: Unminding used to be a joke. I remember a car ride where we tried to set up a situation where it was the right spell to use. The problem was that there is no animus in the game that is worth sending your caster within 10 inches of one of their beasts just to steal it. Just like Stranglehold however the emergence of Mulg has made this a nice little option. You definitely won’t use it every game as it only works on beasts and you won’t even use it every hordes game, but the right use of it and remembering it’s there can be absolutely crushing. Steal Rush from the only Gladiator meaning the entire elephant heard lose access to pathfinder and 2 inches of threat. Take Primal off the only Feral in the list and suddenly they have no chance at cracking your armour. Take Rage off the only Wrastler in the Gators list and watch the same thing happen. Take Rage off an unsuspecting Troll player’s Mauler of Mountain king.
A situational spell? absolutely, but one which is absolutely crippling to an opponent who doesn’t see it coming. Even better the beast that you took that off is 2 fury down. I know how upset I’d be to have my Mountain king be Fury3 with no access to Rage. Now that you don’t have to be 10 inches away from said Mountain king it’s a lot better.
Feat: Blood of Dhunia is an amazing feat, one with both offensive and defensive applications. Many people underestimate the strength of boosted melee attack rolls, but remember that it lasts into your opponents turn and so applies on free strikes and on Mulg’s Primal Rage meaning you have a much higher chance of rolling that crit smite and devastating your opponent’s already bad turn.
The second part of the feat is a strong healing effect that will straight up win games if an opponent underestimates it. Often times I’ve seen an opponent go in on a Warbeast and realise halfway through that it’s definitely not going to die. Good opponents will back off and wait out the feat. Your job is to make sure that they can’t sit back and wait our your feat or that they give up way too much on scenario by doing so.
What this all means in effect is that you shouldn’t feat turn one as an opponent will sit back without a need to contest scenario. Secondly it’s almost always better to feat a turn too late than a turn too early. I’d rather my opponent kill 2 of my heavies on the alpha before I feat than back off and alpha me the turn after. In the situation where you lose 2 heavies you then go in and kill what killed them with a boosted attack rolls and then feat ensuring you lose nothing else.
The two things that can cause real problems for the feat are other defensive feats and Anti Healing tech. Both can be played around to an extent, but not in all cases. In the case of two defensive feats you want to feat second if at all possible and so again holding it, while not giving away too much attrition or scenario is the game. There are no real shortcuts it’s a skill and one that playing low model count armies revolves around.
Anti Healing tech depends on the source and how easy it is to apply and how hard or impossible it is to get rid of. There are certain piece which make dropping Doomy3 a very bad idea. In small amounts however all it really does is mean you lose 1 beast on a feat turn, which is fine. Example would be that you can play around the Gallows Grove in Circle as it has a predictable threat and can be sniped out if you have practice. Anamag’s feat giving an entire army grievous wounds is a death sentence as you feat, they counter feat and then your feat disappears.
Counters to the feat are the main reason you would not take Doomy3 who is an amazing beast caster, but a prevalence of anti healing tech such as exists at the moment I write this, means you have to consider whether it’s good to keep Doomy in your pairing or if your other lists can handles the bits he can’t
Scroll Bearers
If Doomy3 had all the stuff above he’d be a good casters, but on top of that you have access to three mini feats that make him even stronger. Remembering you have these and using them at the right times can swing matchups and leave people complaining that Doomy has four feats, though in reality they are more like Arcana with the added bonus that you don’t need your opponent to trigger them. You can use each one once and only one a turn.
Call of Troqal: Warbeasts in the battlegroup can cast his animus for free. Really strong and highly adaptable, this is absolute money. Simple uses would be allowing you to get another Rage out on a high fury turn as the Mauler or Mountain king can cast one on another beast or himself. It especially helps when you can’t get within six inches to cast the animus on a beast. Simply cast rage onto your mauler and let him cast rage on the other beast that is too far away.
Or why not use it as a threat extender. Put rush on a Mauler and he threats 11 inches with pathfinder and when he gets there he gets to cast Rage for free and absolutely wrecks almost any heavy in the game. The real power play comes with a Mountain king who can run a very strong power play where he tramples with rush, casts his animus for free and then buys 4 attacks at Pow 23. Combine this is boosted attack rolls from a feat and you just got a free heavy your opponent never expected to lose and your MK is deep in their lines and protected by your feat.
Another way of using it is to pop a good defensive animus after making all your attacks. Give an earthborn or Brawler rage and then send it in. It kills a heavy and then casts Earth’s Blessing or Retaliatory Strike.
It even helps with weird corner case situations. I used to run a Storm Troll in my Doomy3 list to help against certain matchups and because it had a decent boostable gun that helped snipe key pieces. While his gun is good, you rarely every used the animus because it costs 1 and your mat is so bad, but when combined with your feat suddenly his attack rolls are boosted and his animus is free and he can kill 8-10 low arm infantry with little issue, which isn’t bad considering how Doomy3 lists can sometimes struggle against that sort of thing.
Hand of Yolandi: Here have Lamentation for a turn. Against warmachine casters relying on upkeeps it’s ok. You can get them in 16 inches and ensure they are going to have a tricky turn, though beware that many casters can upkeep for free and it will still be free. A lot of casters will move back out of your command and can get stuff done, but depending on how far you are up the board that isn’t always an option. Against Hordes it can be absolutely crippling, much like Lamentation. Try breaking down a Troll beast brick when Primal or Rage cost 4 fury each. It used to combined nicely with Arcane Supression on Mulg, but alas he lost it when he got better. Still maybe stealing it with Unminding off an exsuspecting Wold Wyrd gets you an even more horrific turn.
Strength of the Molgur: Signs and portents on attack rolls made by warrior models for a turn. Often times in a beast brick you’ll use it when you don’t want to boost spells. I need a 6 for this Strangehold to hit and don’t want to boost, it works really well in this role and is essentially free so don’t feel you have to build for it. Hell I sometimes use it so my Stone can charge something late game and it fixes their awful mat5. Suddenly they go in and hit and kill a light that your opponent didn’t think a support piece could deal with it.
It’s also really good with Northkin Shamans which are available in PoD. They are often let down by their Magical Ability of 6, but with this mini feat they suddenly get a good chance to charge a model, kill it and then battlewizard a spray to kill 2 or 3 more. All this on a utility solo that in other matchups can be part of a mini cloudwall for your caster or as a hit buff for your beasts with chiller.
Below we will talk about themes. Maybe more so than any other casters in our faction all three Doomys are tied to a theme. If you are experimenting out of Power of Dhunia with him this mini feat is the reason why, because it’s a really good hit buff, but I would warn against it personally.
Themes
Power of Dhunia: This is the main theme that Doomy3 and in fact all of the Doomy casters want to run it. His spell list is almost all beast related and so he wants to be rewarded for taking beasts with free points. This should be your first consideration when looking at Doomy and you can get huge variation in your list designs inside this one theme. Hell you can even get decent value out of Runehsapers when you can give them signs and portents for a turn and their ability to dig in means they are less likely to die on feat turn when they are a juicy target. The theme benefits are decently helpful. Essentially it saves you 2 fury a game as you can start with Admonition out. I rarely use the Dhunian Knot as they are better in shooty armies where they can sit back, but they are a scoring unit and extra fury management.
With the other three themes you would still be running mostly beasts, but you are taking units, probably adding up to 40 points (2 free solos). You use them as a screen and preferably something that benefits from the scroll bearers mini feat.
Storm of the North: If you’re building in Storm of the North then I assume you’re running predominantly Northkin beasts to go with your northkin infantry. The stone increases speed, which is useful as Doomy3 lacks a threat extender other than the rush, mini feat rage trick you can use on the Mountain king and Mauler. Theme benefits also mean you can upkeep admonition on a Northkin beast for free and have snow drifts. While not hugely useful, I could see an argument for Lanyssa on a flag in a snow drift having prowl and being a useful threat extender for the beasts. You also get access to Rok and he’s pretty good, though without the Stumbling Drunk that makes him so frustrating. Unit wise, bears are amazing and must be a main consideration for why you’re taking this theme, as are Northkin raiders who act as a fast screen and benefit hugely from the mini feat to get more crit damage off and allow your beasts behind to get an alpha without having to burn your feat.
Kriel Company: Down the jank tank we go. I assume if you’re taking him in this theme you are trying to increase the rat of a unit where their low Rat is the main negative. With that in mind, I’d maybe be looking at Bushwackers, Burrowers or Scattergunners. None of it seems great though.
Band of Heroes: Take a beast brick and screen with 20 fennblades, not sure it’s very good, but there you go. They are excellent fast screen and maybe that’s what you want to deliver your beast package.
What to Take:
Warbeasts:
Mulg: Few beasts or jacks strike as much fear into your enemies as Mulg. If you need a beatstick to one round a colossal or maybe just kill two heavies in a single turn, Mulg is a great choice, the fact that on top of this he brings excellent utility in the form of Arcane Vortex and his ability to Arc spells is even better. On top of this you have his scary defensive tech. When he can’t be knocked down then your opponent is forced to take the hit from Primal Rage and risk losing a system or being crit smited away after one attack. The arc node is great with a caster who is pretty squishy, but wants to cast Repudiate, Stranglehold and Unminding. On top of this you will probably not find a better Admonition target in all of trolls.
Mountain King: Some Troll players don’t like the Mountain Kings. They wonder why you wouldn’t spend 6 points less and get more boxes and Rage redundancy with two Maulers. What he brings to the table is control. Both in the form of his amazing spray which gives your Doomy3 beast bricks unlikely game into infantry you otherwise would have no chance against, but also with his massive threat ranges. Activate your caster feat, put rush on the Mountain king and mini feat to let beasts cast their animus for free. Suddenly he charges 2 jacks or beasts 12 inches away and kills them both while killing additional support with a spray. Oh and he’s under feat and so essentially unkillable. The next turn he kills another one of two and suddenly your opponent doesn’t have the things in their list to deal with him. If you are willing to play him aggressively then he is phenomenal even without the ability to benefit from Implacability or Admonition.
They are absolutely amazing and there are only two reasons, why I argue against their inclusion at the moment. The prevalence of Grymkin than can punish an aggressive Mountain King with the use of a Death Knell and it can be difficult to build a list that includes both Mulg and a Mountain king since he went up in points. 58 points on two models is a lot.
Earthborn: Earthborns are just solid warbeasts, ranging from good if there is little terrain to support them to amazing on the right tables. They allow you to hold your feat a turn and still contest zones as your opponent considers what they need to send in to kill an arm 22 Earthborn and they threaten further so they buy you board space with their extended threat ranges.
Mauler: Despite my earlier gushing about the Mountain King as a superior choice the Mauler he by no means is bad with Doomshaper3. He can do the same Rush, charge cast rage for free trick and threatens a respectable 11 inches when doing it. He can also benefit from admonition and two maulers is both cheaper and less “All eggs in one basket” than taking a mountain king. Boosted power attacks resulting for their Chain Attacks procs make them surprisingly destructive as well.
Brawler: While other options might be better, there is some good synergy with Doomy3 here. The ability to go in with rage and kill a heavy before casting Retaliatory strike for free is nice. The hard hitting ability, the extra threat range is all good.
Axer: You want a threat extender, you want access to pathfinder and on top of that you get a light than can get damage done, is hard enough to survive a heavy when under feat and can help with infantry clear, especially when under feat. Don’t build a Troll beast brick without one.
Storm Troll: While this beast is less good after the electroleap nerfs as the lightning immunity he brings is a less relevant than before the Cygnar nerf. That said the rest of the abilities are excellent. You can pick off key solos with his gun or the lightning generator that comes from it or you. You can also feat and send it on a heavy jack fishing for those crits which mean they are disrupted for a turn. Opponents also forget the Repulsor field and often send in a heavy only to slide out of melee reach and knowing they got nothing for it.
Basher: This list lacks hit buffs outside of the feat turn and so the animus here is excellent. That it comes on a beast with Crit stagger is even better. Same as for the storm troll, feat and send him in to stagger your opponents jack or beast and make their next turn that much harder.
Units:
Runeshapers: Available in the theme that you really want to take and able to stay safe on your feat turn by digging in. There are worse choices than Runeshapers. There is good synergy with Janissa meaning they can charge infantry with the mini feat kill and then battle wizard a rockhammer. Decent if you have all the pieces in there anyway.
Dhunian Knot: Their main issue is being picked off on feat turn when there are no better targets. Keep them safe early and use the 10 inch range on their Puppet Masters. Later on they will be a decent score unit that can also help out with fury management.
Solos
Runebearer: This guy is great due to his ability to increase your control area, make you more fury efficient, which is great when you have so many good spells and finally even throw out some spells and with the signs and portents mini feat you fix his sometimes problematic Magic Ability 6 so he can land a Repudiate or a Strangehold, though be ware he can’t boost damage on the stranglehold so anything more than Arm 17 is risky.
Janissa: Even without Runeshapers to grant Battle Wizard to, she is really useful. Tectonic Shift is one of the most underrated abilities in Trolls. Its ability to move models out of zones or unjam a key piece can be game changing and your opponents will rarely every expect it. On top of that she is a good flag scorer and at a pinch you can send her Armor piercing weapon in to deal with a hardy target
Whelps: If your regular opponents don’t hate whelps you aren’t using them right. Whether it’s contesting a key scenario piece to scupper your opponents plan mid-turn, blocking a charge lane, contesting a zone turn two when you don’t want to commit a more expensive piece or scoring a flag late game. Whelps are a huge number of uses and their ability to deploy in your opponents turn makes them even more frustrating. That’s not even mentioning their healing and fury management properties.
Northkin Shaman: With the signs and portents mini feat these guys are actually good at clearing infantry. On top of that they provide a cloud wall to keep your squishy caster safe and a solo for scoring flags. Finally they bring a hit buff in the form of Chiller. They’re just all round great and definitely worth some consideration
Sample Lists:
Doomy3 (PoD)
- Runebearer
- Mulg
- Mauler
- Mauler
- Earthborn
- Axer
- Basher
Max Stone + Stonescribe Eldar
Dhunian Knot
Whelps
Janissa
It’s an awful shame that you can’t run the five heavy list with a max stone as you end up 1 point short. This version brings a Basher and a Dhunian Knot. Lots of hit buffs to help in the current meta and 4 heavies combined with 2 pow 14 lights makes this list pretty good.
Doomy3 (PoD)
- Mountain King
- Mulg
- Earthborn
- Axer
- Basher
Max Stone + Stonescribe Elder
Whelps
Shaman
Shaman
If I didn’t have to worry about Grynkim, this would be my beast list of choice right now. Pre Mulg’s points increase that basher used to be a Storm Troll. The mountain king is incredibly scary and combined with Mulg and the often hard to kill earthborn this list is super fun and very strong. You’ll note a lack of Runebearer, which is strange because he’s amazing with 16 inch control and a free fury or spell each turn. Whelps and shamans are just better for what this list needs and that’s saying something considering how good the Runebearer is.
Doomy3 (PoD)
- Runebearer
- Mulg
- Mauler
- Axer
- Basher
- Basher
- Basher
- Basher
- Basher
- Basher
Max Stone + Stonescribe Elder
Whelps
Whelps
Bashers are absolutely amazing. Maybe this is the next skew list of note. This is particularly nasty on feat turn when all the bashers have an additional die on attack rolls. You can even boost if you want and crit stagger your entire opponents army. Beatback, is also great as is their Pow 18 attacks with rage and stone. I don’t own six Bashers, but if I did…
Doomy3 (SotN)
- Runesbearer
- Rok
- Brawler
- Brawler
- Axer
Max stone + Northkin Elder
Max Northkin Raiders + Sorcerer
Bear Handler + Battle Bears
Fell Caller Hero
If you want to play outside of Power of Dhunia, this seems as good as any other option. It got a solid three heavy and Axer beast package combined with Raiders as a screen and Bears to either ambush or help take down other large targets. The sorcerer on the Raiders is purely to make the points work out, but it does give you more access to magic weapons, which is nice. The Fell caller is there to buff the Raiders so they can get more work if they go in, plus he’s a good solo, but I could see arguments for Valka or a northkin Shaman in this spot that are equally valid. This list has one issue though. No whelps and that is kinda sad. It’s a shame than SotN won’t allow whelps for free, but then I guess it’s already a damn good theme.
Key Minions:
Lanyssa: You want extra threat range and she isn’t bad. Prowl also keeps her safe when the rest of your army is under feat. Hard to justify for four points as Northkin Shamans and Whelps are just better, but some people really like her so she’s included on this list.
Gobber Chef: If you’re a point down this guy is your only option. He’s fine at sitting on a flag or contesting an opponents zone. The best one point option because he’s the only one point option.
Gobber Bellow Crew: Same as above really. If you’re 2 points short these are fine and are a super cheap scoring unit for lists where you might only have the stone to score with.
Gremlin Swarm: Same as the two above options. It’s the best 3 point option and sometimes that’s all you need. Less good, because people tech for Grymkin and catch you in the crossfire, still incorporeal, stealthed solos with a host of jack annoyance isn’t bad.
