isotope
Junior Strategist
Posts: 634
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Post by isotope on Jul 12, 2018 5:10:31 GMT
After making some posts and reading others on the CID forums they basically just want us to give them a pat on the back, say thank you for the changes and to shut the Firetruck up. They don't want us to point out all the models that still suck ass, they don't want to make more changes, they don't want to acknowledge that halbs ( and now infiltrators) basically outshine every other unit in their respective theme force. They just want to shove this thing down our throats and move on to selling more power creep models.
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Post by mcdermott on Jul 12, 2018 5:27:14 GMT
After making some posts and reading others on the CID forums they basically just want us to give them a pat on the back, say thank you for the changes and to shut the Firetruck up. They don't want us to point out all the models that still suck ass, they don't want to make more changes, they don't want to acknowledge that halbs ( and now infiltrators) basically outshine every other unit in their respective theme force. They just want to shove this thing down our throats and move on to selling more power creep models. I must have missed the time period when there weren't "best units" that nearly every list took while shunning those with even the tiniest bit of statistical inferiority.
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Post by falkman on Jul 12, 2018 5:27:26 GMT
After making some posts and reading others on the CID forums they basically just want us to give them a pat on the back, say thank you for the changes and to shut the Firetruck up. They don't want us to point out all the models that still suck ass, they don't want to make more changes, they don't want to acknowledge that halbs ( and now infiltrators) basically outshine every other unit in their respective theme force. They just want to shove this thing down our throats and move on to selling more power creep models. Have you never been on the CID forums before? You are supposed to test the things they put forward to test, not wishlist a bunch of other stuff or complain about things that was not included in this CID. Your kind of attitude and entitlement is a big part of why so many people in this game consider Ret players to be whiny babies. This CID does a lot more than they initially hinted at, and could easily never have been done at all, so complaining when they do a pretty big retouch for a lot of our models seems incredibly counter-productive.
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Post by onijet01 on Jul 12, 2018 5:30:36 GMT
Yah its stormfall not strike force shows what i get for typing fast.
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isotope
Junior Strategist
Posts: 634
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Post by isotope on Jul 12, 2018 5:38:17 GMT
After making some posts and reading others on the CID forums they basically just want us to give them a pat on the back, say thank you for the changes and to shut the Firetruck up. They don't want us to point out all the models that still suck ass, they don't want to make more changes, they don't want to acknowledge that halbs ( and now infiltrators) basically outshine every other unit in their respective theme force. They just want to shove this thing down our throats and move on to selling more power creep models. Have you never been on the CID forums before? You are supposed to test the things they put forward to test, not wishlist a bunch of other stuff or complain about things that was not included in this CID. Your kind of attitude and entitlement is a big part of why so many people in this game consider Ret players to be whiny babies. This CID does a lot more than they initially hinted at, and could easily never have been done at all, so complaining when they do a pretty big retouch for a lot of our models seems incredibly counter-productive.
Well, 3 people in my meta just started playing this new anamag list "fresh out of CID" where you get DEF 12 ARM 23 MAT 11 POW 21 Cav that heal d3 when you hit them backed by 3 units of MAT 11 POW 20 vengeance, tough, berserking 12/18 warmongers and then we get "well we lowered your point costs by 1 hur dur" of course I'm gonna Firetrucking complain.
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Post by mcdermott on Jul 12, 2018 10:17:30 GMT
Have you never been on the CID forums before? You are supposed to test the things they put forward to test, not wishlist a bunch of other stuff or complain about things that was not included in this CID. Your kind of attitude and entitlement is a big part of why so many people in this game consider Ret players to be whiny babies. This CID does a lot more than they initially hinted at, and could easily never have been done at all, so complaining when they do a pretty big retouch for a lot of our models seems incredibly counter-productive.
Well, 3 people in my meta just started playing this new anamag list "fresh out of CID" where you get DEF 12 ARM 23 MAT 11 POW 21 Cav that heal d3 when you hit them backed by 3 units of MAT 11 POW 20 vengeance, tough, berserking 12/18 warmongers and then we get "well we lowered your point costs by 1 hur dur" of course I'm gonna Firetrucking complain.
www.sadviolin.com
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Post by onijet01 on Jul 12, 2018 12:51:20 GMT
Well, 3 people in my meta just started playing this new anamag list "fresh out of CID" where you get DEF 12 ARM 23 MAT 11 POW 21 Cav that heal d3 when you hit them backed by 3 units of MAT 11 POW 20 vengeance, tough, berserking 12/18 warmongers and then we get "well we lowered your point costs by 1 hur dur" of course I'm gonna Firetrucking complain.
www.sadviolin.com First back off. Second the list you are speaking requires the player to chose between arm 21 not 23 calvary. Second a few points you have completly screwed up (not suprised as you dont play the list) Animag 1 brings. Ctrl 14. 1. A plus 2 armor buff single unit (upkeep) 2. A plus 2 str buff single unit (upkeep) 3. Carnage- +2 mat buff vs enemy models in his ctrl range only. 4. Darkshroud feat. Blight bringer brings. Cmd 6 A passive ability that can. 1. Grant friendly worrior models in cmd +2 str and arm. 2. Can not cast spells or channel spells. 3. Non fire immune enemy models suffer -2 def. Units in question for complaint. Champions at base stats (relivent pre options above) Spd 7 mat 7 def 12 arm 17 hp 10. Melee 2 inch at p+s 13 (brutal charge) Mount at pow 14 (can not benifite from str buffs) Heals 1d3 health on damage. Warmongers base stats. Spd 5 mat6 def12 arm 18 hp5. Melee 2inch p+s14 (powerfull charge) Unyealding Beserk Warspears (not mentioned) Spd5 mat6 rat5 def12 arm16 hp5 Weapons Throwspear range8 pow14 (thrown) Spear 2inch p+s14 Assult and set defence. Now solos Warmonger chief cmd Two buffs to ogrum +1 to attack rolls Blood drinker (killing enemy model heals d3 damage. Unit attachments Gorag1 (warmongers character attach) Aura at -2 enemy def Minifeat granting +2 spd and pathfinder. Warspear chief (non character) Prey +2 attavk and dmg vs prey target Relentless charge. So first rule of advice vs them build a mixed arms list. Animag is weaker at running ogrum than thagrosh 1. But had a large feat damage swing pitential for only two units. (And cant prove me wrong here if they want the +6 maximum damage buff) So yah its a brick but its only good if selective models remain in play. So whats your complaint? As the super soldier crap you wrote is wrong
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isotope
Junior Strategist
Posts: 634
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Post by isotope on Jul 12, 2018 13:13:38 GMT
It was already clarified in my BR thread that my opponent must have played them wrong because he told me the cav had unyielding. Not so much as a complaint as an observation. I mean if those are the standard kind of ARM/MAT/POW swings they want in the game it's fine as long as everyone gets access to them and answers to them. What's the biggest MAT/POW swing we can get our top tier models to? MAT 9 POW 14 weaponmasters with one turn of armor 20?
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Post by onijet01 on Jul 12, 2018 13:26:33 GMT
It was already clarified in my BR thread that my opponent must have played them wrong because he told me the cav had unyielding. Not so much as a complaint as an observation. I mean if those are the standard kind of ARM/MAT/POW swings they want in the game it's fine as long as everyone gets access to them and answers to them. What's the biggest MAT/POW swing we can get our top tier models to? MAT 9 POW 14 weaponmasters with one turn of armor 20? Well that depends on what you are asking. As a example we can take a single 8 point light warjack and with proper play and list builds it becomes capable of taking on all but the heaviest armored warnouns in the game turn after turn. We have ranged units who ignore los that can scalp out the best well pritected supports an army has to offer. We have one of the best stated and survivable mixed armed units in the game to date. Our weaponmaster(s) can charge and threat 12 inches as a unit or up to 16inches as a solo. We dont have multiwound non cav units, bit our cav can be arm 19 vs everything or single unit arm 19vs range and arm 21 vs melee. We have a volossal that can trivialy remove from play 30mm base models with a single shot. A colossal that can fuel other warjacks and pull apart the battlefeild. Warcasters that hand out massive stratigic buffs or control effects and debuffs. Solos that can stop fury and focus cold. Its more about as a whole. Example issyria in legions can grant all your army +2 inches of spd when charging, reduce enemy defenses while increasing probability for more damage spikes in your favor. Gryphons can take advantage and strike at p+s 17 melee all day long and charge at possible mat 12 (best) from a distance of 15 inches away at p+s17 weaponmaster. We do broken stuff to but in a difrent way.
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isotope
Junior Strategist
Posts: 634
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Post by isotope on Jul 12, 2018 13:50:42 GMT
Sentinels threat 10", not 12".
I understand our shtick but when the enemy just presents " ive got 20 multiwound dudes all armor 20+ who hit like trucks screened by tenticles that respawn every turn come at me bro" or "ive got a whole army of dug in tough +2 def from my caster gunline behind a cloudwall with 14" grievous" etc it's not a "can you play your list well" it's "did you bring the specific thing that can play into this or am i gonna run right through you". We've gotten to a point where the game is beginning to feel like rock, paper, scissors. If you don't bring the right lists to a steamroller and you don't dodge the certain lists you just lose. Ret has always been more of a "answer questions" faction than a "ask questions" faction and right now there's some crazy questions that 2 ret lists in a pair have trouble dealing with.
I had ossyan in my pair for a few months with Vyros1 as my pair. I could never drop ossyan. Every opponent had a list with mass stealth, cloud walls, army wide no knockdown and cover( making hit fixing for RAT 5 SFA impossible) which is why I've shifted the list to issyria to get her feat, blinding light, hemera mark target to make for better chance to hit stuff when i need to. Next weekend will be my first SR with Issy since im picking her up from the paint shop this week, hoping it goes well.
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Post by onijet01 on Jul 12, 2018 15:02:25 GMT
What list are you planning to make for Issyria. (Personal note: i dispise her as a caster, i preferred casters with end game, but she is a okay support for an army)
And really did you try going against those lists out of theme? Or using non-maxed free models in theme? Yah stupid question but some super powerd combos can only be made that way
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isotope
Junior Strategist
Posts: 634
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Post by isotope on Jul 12, 2018 15:13:33 GMT
What list are you planning to make for Issyria. (Personal note: i dispise her as a caster, i preferred casters with end game, but she is a okay support for an army) And really did you try going against those lists out of theme? Or using non-maxed free models in theme? Yah stupid question but some super powerd combos can only be made that way Both lists were in theme. Issy in DoI( 20 free points) is a list currently in my pairing and only change will be advance move on swordsmen. Other list is Vyros1 shadows ( will be 6 free points with E3 allowed as free model). Here is the Issy list. Gameplan is to use feat and BL+Mark target to either get strong alpha or assassinate.
Retribution Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] Defenders of Ios [Issyria 1] Issyria, Sibyl of Dawn [+29] - Banshee [18] - Hemera [16] - Sylys Wyshnalyrr, the Seeker [4] Arcanist Mechanik [2] Arcanist Mechanik [2] Arcanist Mechanik [2] Eiryss, Mage Hunter of Ios [0(7)] Fane Knight Skeryth Issyen [0(8)] Heavy Rifle Team [4] Heavy Rifle Team [4] House Ellowuyr Swordsmen (max) [16] - House Ellowuyr Swordsman Officer & Standard [0(5)] - Soulless Escort (1) [1] Stormfall Archers [9] Stormfall Archers [9] Arcantrik Force Generator [17]
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Post by necrovoker on Jul 12, 2018 15:46:19 GMT
I find it unfortunate as well, as I would like to point out how the changes to Stormfall Archers make Riflemen even more irrelevant than they were before, or how it would make sense to push the Banshee to mat7 or rat 6 to match the fact that both jacks are basically the best of what each House can produce.
But I don't say it because I don't want to get banned.
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Post by jagius021 on Jul 12, 2018 16:58:35 GMT
I used to work in a game store and the old addage rings true here: you could put a hundred dollar bill in each package, and the customer would complain about how it was folded.
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Post by necrovoker on Jul 12, 2018 17:13:41 GMT
I used to work in a game store and the old addage rings true here: you could put a hundred dollar bill in each package, and the customer would complain about how it was folded.
I think you're missing the point of CID. It's not a "gift" given to us, we're testing proposed changes to see how they impact the faction's balance for better or worse. If things are illogical or unbalanced, we should be allowed to say as much. It is the purpose of this whole process.
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