Choco
Junior Strategist
Gorten, best feet in the game.
Posts: 571
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Post by Choco on Jun 15, 2018 17:30:09 GMT
First off, here's the list I know I will be playing (this is the Sevvy list I keep reporting in the win rate thread):
Protectorate Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] The Faithful Masses
[Severius 1] Grand Scrutator Severius [+28] - Blessing of Vengeance [13] - Sanctifier [14] - Hierophant [3] Champion of the Order of the Wall [8] Champion of the Order of the Wall [8] High Paladin Dartan Vilmon [0(6)] Paladin of the Order of the Wall [4] Paladin of the Order of the Wall [4] Paladin of the Order of the Wall [4] Vassal Mechanik [1] Vassal of Menoth [3] Vassal of Menoth [3] Wrack [1] Choir of Menoth (max) [6] Idrian Skirmishers (max) [15] - Idrian Skirmisher Chieftain & Guide [0(5)] Idrian Skirmishers (max) [15] - Idrian Skirmisher Chieftain & Guide [0(5)]
The biggest issue I am having is finding a good pairing for this list. Money is a bit tight right now, so I'm going to go purchase some Reckoners right now (my purchasing priorities have been based on conversions, not how good the models are). With this in mind, I will take all suggestions, but I have been having issues not finding something comfortable to run as a pairing to this Sevvy1 list. I feel like Kreoss1 is probably the cast I am most interested in playing with (no, I don't own Fire of Salvation yet) so I want to try to keep with this caster (but I'm open to other suggestions). I was thinking of going Exemplar, but with my not having a large stable of Exemplar stuff (that is not waiting for the CID to drop), this is what I'm looking at currently:
Protectorate Army - 74 / 75 points [Theme] Exemplar Interdiction
[Kreoss 1] High Exemplar Kreoss [+29] - Redeemer [11] - Redeemer [11] - Templar [15] Knights Exemplar Seneschal [5] Knights Exemplar Seneschal [5] Choir of Menoth (min) [4] Idrian Skirmishers (max) [15] - Idrian Skirmisher Chieftain & Guide [0(5)] Knights Exemplar [9] - Knights Exemplar Officer [5] Knights Exemplar [9] - Knights Exemplar Officer [5] Visgoth Juviah Rhoven & Honor Guard [9]
I have also tried putting him in Faithful Masses, but again, something doesn't feel right about it:
Protectorate Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] The Faithful Masses
[Kreoss 1] High Exemplar Kreoss [+29] - Crusader [10] - Repenter [8] - Sanctifier [14] - Hierophant [3] Eiryss, Mage Hunter of Ios [7] Initiate Tristan Durant [4] - Redeemer [11] - Redeemer [11] Vassal Mechanik [1] Wrack [1] Choir of Menoth (max) [6] Deliverer Skyhammers (max) [13] Idrian Skirmishers (max) [15] - Idrian Skirmisher Chieftain & Guide [0(5)]
I am at a loss here. Does anyone have some good experience with Kreoss to help steer me in an interesting direction?
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Hashmal
Junior Strategist
Posts: 557
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Post by Hashmal on Jun 15, 2018 17:37:44 GMT
My question is what you typically expect to face in your pairing. Your Sevy list is very vulnerable to Cygnar, given your investment in Idrians. If you don't see much of them, this isn't a problem. But if you do...
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Choco
Junior Strategist
Gorten, best feet in the game.
Posts: 571
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Post by Choco on Jun 15, 2018 17:46:13 GMT
We don't have many Cygnar players in my Meta (I'm in the Seattle/Mox Boarding House Meta), but they show up to our bigger events and I will be playing this most likely at Lock and Load.
Talking with some others last night we even were toying with the idea of Kreoss in Creator's Might with:
1. Idrians 2. Double Vessel with Idrians 3. Double Vessel with Hammer Dwarves.
With the latest dynamic update, I'm not nearly as worried about Nemo3 anymore. I've also toyed with the idea of Tristan2 for the cloud wall match ups.
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Post by gargs454 on Jun 15, 2018 18:30:49 GMT
Hard to say for sure without knowing what other models you have available to play with, but an Amon CM list always seems like at least a decent counter play to a good FM list. Durst can also at times be good into Cygnar with his feat turn helping get your stuff there and a Vinnie EI list can likewise play some games with Cygnar (or even HR/Testament).
On a side note, and not really related to the posed question, but in your Sevvy 1 list above is there a reason you want with two Vassals of Menoth and no Monk? I'm guessing because you don't own a monk at the moment, but the two Vassals seem like a bit of an overkill and the monk is just so handy and annoying.
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Choco
Junior Strategist
Gorten, best feet in the game.
Posts: 571
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Post by Choco on Jun 15, 2018 19:33:29 GMT
You pretty much hit it on the head. Don't own Monks currently (slowly buying stuff as I need it, next big purchase will either be Gravus or a Judicator/Revelator kit). I'm pretty limited on the Menoth front. All that is listed above I own. It might be easier for me to say what I don't own.
Errants, Sunburst Crew, Vengers, Zealots, Monks, Deliverer Arms Master, Errant Seneschal, Gravus, Colossals. I apparently have more of the faction than I thought. Also, expect me to have one ofs for most of the faction, Choir, Idrians, Knights Exemplar and the medium bases are all I have 2 of. Apparently I have all the casters, but some are still in the box or haven't been used yet (Vindictus and Thyra for example).
EDIT: When it comes to the jacks, I have a good assortment, but the ones that stand out the most as me not having are the Vigilant, Indictor and Fire of Salvation. I only have multiples of the Dervish, Devout, Guardian and Repenter (need to dig around to see if I have a second Redeemer hiding somewhere).
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Choco
Junior Strategist
Gorten, best feet in the game.
Posts: 571
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Post by Choco on Jun 15, 2018 20:55:24 GMT
The more I am thinking about it, the more I'm thinking I might need to go to a different caster, specifically one that I have played a lot to moderate success. Reznik1. I played him in a journeyman league and he was lots of fun. Oddly enough, I would even consider him out of theme to get him some more interesting battlegroup action.
Any interesting thoughts on this idea?
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Post by gargs454 on Jun 15, 2018 21:13:58 GMT
Sadly, I don't own Reznik1 so can't really help a whole lot on that front, but it does sound as though you have a pretty good assortment of Exemplars which can crack armor pretty well if you can deliver them. To that end casters like Vinnie, Testament, and HR can all help in the delivering front as well as our usual assortment of defensive-based casters (Both Sevvies, Kreoss, etc.) But, the most important thing is: you had fun with Reznick 1, that is always the best reason to play something. The only thing I can really say about Rez1 is that if you are going to play him regularly, you need more wracks just to make sure you have one to place on the board when he assassinates the opposing caster. ETA: Oh, and I totally get the tight funds aspect. I will say though, that if you are able, the monks are pretty cheap and likely would not add much to an order you might already be placing -- this assumes of course you are not going the e-bay/FB-group route, etc.
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moquan
Junior Strategist
Posts: 193
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Post by moquan on Jun 16, 2018 9:42:48 GMT
Something with more jacks would be a good list-pair. Kreoss1 has been mentioned before. conflictchamber.com/#c2201b_-0d0y221G1Gg97_3C3z3z2_3G3HProtectorate Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] The Creator's Might [Kreoss 1] High Exemplar Kreoss [+29] - Reckoner [16] - Redeemer [11] - Redeemer [11] - Revelator [37] Taryn di la Rovissi, Llaelese Gun Mage [5] The Covenant of Menoth [0(4)] Vassal of Menoth [0(3)] Vassal of Menoth [0(3)] Choir of Menoth (min) [4] Idrian Skirmishers (max) [15] - Idrian Skirmisher Chieftain & Guide [5] Taryn to ignore huge base models (immune to knockdown)
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Choco
Junior Strategist
Gorten, best feet in the game.
Posts: 571
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Post by Choco on Jun 17, 2018 17:50:47 GMT
Something with more jacks would be a good list-pair. Kreoss1 has been mentioned before. conflictchamber.com/#c2201b_-0d0y221G1Gg97_3C3z3z2_3G3HProtectorate Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] The Creator's Might [Kreoss 1] High Exemplar Kreoss [+29] - Reckoner [16] - Redeemer [11] - Redeemer [11] - Revelator [37] Taryn di la Rovissi, Llaelese Gun Mage [5] The Covenant of Menoth [0(4)] Vassal of Menoth [0(3)] Vassal of Menoth [0(3)] Choir of Menoth (min) [4] Idrian Skirmishers (max) [15] - Idrian Skirmisher Chieftain & Guide [5] Taryn to ignore huge base models (immune to knockdown) The biggest problem right now is I don’t own a Menoth Colossal yet. I plan on it, especially if the Judicator CID stuff goes through. Also, bad news, I only own one Redeemer and I don’t think I can get a second one in time for L&L. Not a big loss as I was going to put a second Sanctifier together for a conversion project, but opted for a Reckoner. I’ve been doing a lot of list dojoing and it has resulted in either Kreoss1, Reznik1 or Amon as my second caster. All of them do favor a more battlegroup heavy list, so I like that. If I owned 5 Crusaders, I would be very tempted to play the Amon FM list, but I don’t. During a journeyman league, I fell in love with all the movement shenanigans you can pull with Reznik. I ran him in FM, but have been looking at EI and CM. Finally, Kreoss. I haven’t played him in an extremely long time and have this want to go old school with my pairing and bring Sevvy1/Kreoss1, but I’m not landing on a good list or one that feels right for me for Kreoss. This is so hard when I have been a Merc for so long and only dabbled in Menoth for such a long time. I’m finally to a point where I want to play my Menoth competitively and it feels super comfortable anymore (with certain casters like Sevvy1). A dilemma this is and any other suggestions is greatly appreciated.
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Post by correlion on Jun 18, 2018 6:02:58 GMT
get durst with something like: conflictchamber.com/#c2201b_-0OeU1S3U24243qjCjC3E3r3C3t3t3z3B3B2_jH2iProtectorate Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] The Faithful Masses [Durst 1] Anson Durst, Rock of the Faith [+28] - Castigator [12] - Sanctifier [14] - Templar [15] - Templar [15] - Hierophant [0(3)] Champion of the Order of the Wall [8] Champion of the Order of the Wall [8] High Paladin Dartan Vilmon [6] Paladin of the Order of the Wall [4] The Covenant of Menoth [0(4)] Vassal Mechanik [1] Vassal Mechanik [1] Vassal of Menoth [3] Wrack [1] Wrack [1] Choir of Menoth (min) [4] Holy Zealots (min) [7] - Monolith Bearer [3]
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Choco
Junior Strategist
Gorten, best feet in the game.
Posts: 571
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Post by Choco on Jun 18, 2018 18:43:28 GMT
Funnily enough I am waiting for the CID to drop to run Durst in EI with 2 Bastions, 2 Cinerators and other stuff. It is going to be a brick of a list into shooting armies, I can't wait.
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Post by correlion on Jun 19, 2018 6:17:50 GMT
how about Durst with the new Purifiers? It can have def 17 vs shootin-and-livin =)
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Choco
Junior Strategist
Gorten, best feet in the game.
Posts: 571
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Post by Choco on Jun 19, 2018 15:34:37 GMT
how about Durst with the new Purifiers? It can have def 17 vs shootin-and-livin =) That CID hasn't dropped and I don't expect it to drop right before Lock and Load.
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Choco
Junior Strategist
Gorten, best feet in the game.
Posts: 571
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Post by Choco on Jun 19, 2018 16:03:26 GMT
So things have changed slightly with my original list. After rejiggering a few things, I now have the book and the option to go with an Indictor instead of the Sanctifier. I like the Sanctifier since it is pretty self sufficient. I like the Indictor because it is more durable and hits harder (but has a shorter threat range. I have enough magic weapons (and Sevvy's spells) that I'm hugely concerned about Incorporeal models. Here's the list with an Indictor: conflictchamber.com/#c2201b_-0O0T1OdY3qjCjC3E3r3r3r3C3t3z3B3B2_3G3H3G3HProtectorate Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] The Faithful Masses [Severius 1] Grand Scrutator Severius [+28] - Blessing of Vengeance [13] - Indictor [15] - Hierophant [3] Champion of the Order of the Wall [8] Champion of the Order of the Wall [8] High Paladin Dartan Vilmon [0(6)] Paladin of the Order of the Wall [4] Paladin of the Order of the Wall [4] Paladin of the Order of the Wall [4] The Covenant of Menoth [4] Vassal Mechanik [1] Vassal of Menoth [3] Wrack [1] Wrack [1] Choir of Menoth (min) [4] Idrian Skirmishers (max) [15] - Idrian Skirmisher Chieftain & Guide [0(5)] Idrian Skirmishers (max) [15] - Idrian Skirmisher Chieftain & Guide [0(5)] I also think that, at least on paper, I may have come up with my second list. It looks right for me and provides some other options that the Sevvy list doesn't. It has a bit more of a ranged presence beyond Idrians, which I like: conflictchamber.com/#c2201b_-0E0ydY221Gk93p3t3z3B2_3G3H2jfV2jfVProtectorate Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] Exemplar Interdiction [Kreoss 1] High Exemplar Kreoss [+29] - Indictor [15] - Reckoner [16] - Redeemer [11] Exemplar Warder Elias Gade [5] Knights Exemplar Seneschal [5] Vassal Mechanik [1] Vassal of Menoth [3] Wrack [1] Choir of Menoth (min) [4] Idrian Skirmishers (max) [15] - Idrian Skirmisher Chieftain & Guide [0(5)] Knights Exemplar [9] - Knights Exemplar Officer [5] Knights Exemplar [9] - Knights Exemplar Officer [5] It's a little bit more of a Knights delivery service list with Kreoss support. Between the Reckoner, Gade and the Redeemer I feel my ranged presence is more of a thing too.
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Choco
Junior Strategist
Gorten, best feet in the game.
Posts: 571
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Post by Choco on Jun 19, 2018 22:44:18 GMT
Well, with what appears to be the Cinerator CA at Lock and Load, I might be able to grab some of the CAs and get them together to play. That would be fantastic if I can pull it off. Play a modified version of the Kreoss list above for it then?
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