Xintas
Junior Strategist
Posts: 824
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Post by Xintas on May 3, 2018 14:19:41 GMT
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Post by GrumpyBear on May 3, 2018 21:11:48 GMT
We're not speaking in a vacuum. We're also speaking about a 40 box arm 20 weapons platform that can remove stealth and has 3 initial guns all for the cost of a character jack. Making it literally spawn new guys and remove the downside of some of our most potent spells (in theme no less) would seriously call into question that point cost. don't tell me where i can't speak! I dunno. I would argue the battle engine absolutely could be considered weak. Only Ossrum uses it well, and he buffs it completely in every possible way. He buffs its movement, which synergizes with Bulldoze. He buffs its damage and accuracy, which synergizes with Critical Stagger and unboostable guns. He buffs its survivability, which synergizes with 40 boxes. He buffs and gives tactician to the incredible garbage troops that it repleneshes, which synergize with the incredible garbage troops hiding behind it for LOS. Literally everything he does buffs it. If you put the BE with Durgan or literally any other Merc caster, ALL OF WHOM CAN TAKE IT, no one does. Like ever. No one takes Hammerdwarves or any dwarves. Its the BE's use in other lists that says more about it then the niche spot it has with one caster, in one theme force. I'd argue that is a fair point that it is definitely not overpowered. Parents. Talk to your kids about Rhul. Or TLDR, only play Ossrum. Ironically just about everything the Earthbreaker could want or need is also covered by Ossrum. I'd bet mathematically he comes close to boosting it as much in any one category as either other dwarf caster.
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Xintas
Junior Strategist
Posts: 824
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Post by Xintas on May 4, 2018 13:21:10 GMT
I would argue that makes it specialized, not weak. Prior to Llaelese being a thing, I played around with an Ashlynn list that took forge guard and the battle engine, and it was quite solid. Quicken on the dwarves, tough from the piper, recursion, stealth removal, and AoEs from the BE. It made them pretty easy to deliver and you could crit fish with Ashlynn's feat.
Then Llaelese came out and she had better options. Just because other casters prefer other things doesn't mean a model is weak; it just isn't an auto-include.
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Post by onijet01 on May 5, 2018 1:50:53 GMT
We're not speaking in a vacuum. We're also speaking about a 40 box arm 20 weapons platform that can remove stealth and has 3 initial guns all for the cost of a character jack. Making it literally spawn new guys and remove the downside of some of our most potent spells (in theme no less) would seriously call into question that point cost. don't tell me where i can't speak! Correct no one can say you can not speak, but try to listen from other ppl or else you lose all credibility like you have in this forum. On the adding vs reviving aspect of the battle engine i think the choice was souly made because of primed. The option to throw weaponmaster charg3s into opponents to tie up options only to have them explode if killed is a frightening option when you can just add more grunts to a unit. What if tje battle enjine is less a holder for units and more a moble medical bay?
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Post by GrumpyBear on May 5, 2018 2:43:23 GMT
don't tell me where i can't speak! Correct no one can say you can not speak, but try to listen from other ppl or else you lose all credibility like you have in this forum. On the adding vs reviving aspect of the battle engine i think the choice was souly made because of primed. The option to throw weaponmaster charg3s into opponents to tie up options only to have them explode if killed is a frightening option when you can just add more grunts to a unit. What if tje battle enjine is less a holder for units and more a moble medical bay? People should make a team of dwarf medics following the BE who are collecting the bodies. That would be an easy and cool conversion.
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Post by fallenexile on May 5, 2018 12:28:40 GMT
People should make a team of dwarf medics following the BE who are collecting the bodies. That would be an easy and cool conversion. My second Siege Crawler was going to be converted to be an APC with the back end opened up, dropping off reinforcements.
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shoe
Junior Strategist
Posts: 706
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Post by shoe on May 5, 2018 14:02:07 GMT
don't tell me where i can't speak! Correct no one can say you can not speak, but try to listen from other ppl or else you lose all credibility like you have in this forum. On the adding vs reviving aspect of the battle engine i think the choice was souly made because of primed. The option to throw weaponmaster charg3s into opponents to tie up options only to have them explode if killed is a frightening option when you can just add more grunts to a unit. What if tje battle enjine is less a holder for units and more a moble medical bay? oh noes my credibility!!!×>
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Zeykk
Junior Strategist
Posts: 135
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Post by Zeykk on May 5, 2018 14:57:00 GMT
don't tell me where i can't speak! Correct no one can say you can not speak, but try to listen from other ppl or else you lose all credibility like you have in this forum. On the adding vs reviving aspect of the battle engine i think the choice was souly made because of primed. The option to throw weaponmaster charg3s into opponents to tie up options only to have them explode if killed is a frightening option when you can just add more grunts to a unit. What if tje battle enjine is less a holder for units and more a moble medical bay? It’s a bit presumptuous that Primed is the “sole” reason. Perhaps it could have been to keep the model’s recursion ability in line with other recursion abilities found elsewhere in the game? I’m far more convinced by continuity and consistency.
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eathotlead
Junior Strategist
PP forumite since 2004
Posts: 259
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Post by eathotlead on May 5, 2018 19:32:01 GMT
People should make a team of dwarf medics following the BE who are collecting the bodies. That would be an easy and cool conversion. My second Siege Crawler was going to be converted to be an APC with the back end opened up, dropping off reinforcements. I actually did that. Sorta...
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Post by fallenexile on May 6, 2018 0:06:59 GMT
I actually did that. Sorta... I'll be doing something similar, but more in line with my first Crawler and the door will be fixed open.
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shoe
Junior Strategist
Posts: 706
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Post by shoe on May 6, 2018 3:09:16 GMT
u kept the door open!!!? omgoat u guys are masters of model conversion!!!
(looks prety good tho)
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Post by Soul Samurai on May 6, 2018 3:21:26 GMT
omgoat u guys are masters of model conversion!!! Are you being sarcastic? Because if so that's pretty rude.
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shoe
Junior Strategist
Posts: 706
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Post by shoe on May 6, 2018 7:08:56 GMT
eh mebbe but assembling it with the tailgate open is about as much a conversion as rotating the turret to one side and going LOOK I DID A CONVERSION!!. now that other one in teh picture actually is quite a conversion
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Post by Soul Samurai on May 6, 2018 7:29:14 GMT
eh mebbe but assembling it with the tailgate open is about as much a conversion as rotating the turret to one side and going LOOK I DID A CONVERSION!!. now that other one in teh picture actually is quite a conversion Eathotlead did not say "LOOK I DID A CONVERSION"; FallenExile said he WAS GOING to convert it, and that one element he was going to do was leave the tailgate open, and Eathotlead said he "sorta did that", as in: he left the tailgate open. He never claimed it "counted as a conversion", and dumping on someone for something they never said is a pretty silly thing to do.
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shoe
Junior Strategist
Posts: 706
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Post by shoe on May 6, 2018 7:38:17 GMT
pretty silly things are mostly what i post here sir!
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