flogger
Junior Strategist
Posts: 296
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Post by flogger on Mar 31, 2018 16:59:29 GMT
; Azahul ; Gaston ; flogger : What do you bring against Madrak1 Champions? I really start to dislike that build more than Nemo3... I usually trample up a Blindwalker, cast mortality on a unit of Champions. Shoot that unit to death with a single unit of croaks (usually kills about 3-4 champs, enough) then I stay out of threat range (gators threat longer than champs) and usually win on scenario/attrition. I find Madrak1 with dual champs a really favorable matchup for Maelok.
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Post by chocobsessed on Mar 31, 2018 23:35:43 GMT
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Post by danfromchicago on Apr 1, 2018 1:48:54 GMT
I'm very interested in pBarney tech. I know you've moved on from that and all, but ...
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Post by chocobsessed on Apr 1, 2018 3:42:22 GMT
I'm very interested in pBarney tech. I know you've moved on from that and all, but ... I think the "tech" is to have played pKromac for like 3 years, and love having warpath again. The idea behind the list is to have 5 heavies that are more or less immune to guns - 2 iron back spitters with carapace, 2 wrastlers in the swamp pit and Snapjaw. Then you take all of the tech solos - especially kwaak (enliven plus carapace) and Longchops (putting a trap in front of the swamp pit makes you immune to infantry too). Your threat ranges are in the 12" range for melee, which is longer than average, and yours is partially nonlinear. If they stay out of threat, you have some decent guns, if they come into threat you can feat and obliterate most things. You can also use the feat + warpath + overtake to kill an unreasonable amount of infantry if you need to, or to bounce off an infantry dude into their caster. I built pBarnabas for cygnar (success not guaranteed against Nemo3, but I haven't actually tried it), but it's kind of shocking how well he does into all of cryx, winter guard Kommand and mercs. I eventually dropped him because he's only a 50/50 into grymkin and really bad into TEPs
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Post by skillenit on Apr 3, 2018 13:06:20 GMT
Could you talk more about what makes Arkadius good into Grymkin? I get that he makes his beasts fast and hit relatively hard but I feel like there's something that I'm missing.
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Post by chocobsessed on Apr 3, 2018 15:38:52 GMT
Could you talk more about what makes Arkadius good into Grymkin? I get that he makes his beasts fast and hit relatively hard but I feel like there's something that I'm missing. Sure. There are two broad categories of Grymkin lists: Dark Menagerie Beast Bricks and Bump in the Night Infantry Swarms. Their Beast bricks have very short threat ranges (12" max since enliven and orin can cancel abyssal gate) so they rely on their decent defense and armor stats as well as lots of positioning tricks with gremlin swarms. Arkadius can use primal shock to trivially kill gremlin swarms while remaining completely safe, and def 13 arm 19 is not a good statline against mat 8 pow 20, and you have more heavies than they do. Worse yet for the grymkin player, none of the arcana really affect Arkadius - all of your damage comes from melee warbeasts so you can easily avoid sacrifice by focusing on one heavy target at a time, one warbeast can ignore desolation with spirit walk, you still outthreat their warbeasts even if they do pull off labyrinth, you can make it so that shadow only catches primaled warbeasts who were going to die anyways (or just enliven away). Their infantry swarms are VERY weak to sprays - their primary means of protecting infantry involve stealth, concealment and windstorm, none of which affect your 3 boosted to hit sprays. If you'll excuse the metaphors - you're essentially playing an abby2 list against their beast brick (high threat, mat 8, high pow) and their infantry swarm isn't nearly as scary as the cryx versions for Arkadius, and I play Arkadius into cryx all day.
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Post by chocobsessed on Apr 17, 2018 21:15:53 GMT
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Post by kombat46 on Apr 18, 2018 8:50:00 GMT
Enjoyed the podcast very much and thanks for pointing me in the right direction on playing Arkadius. You mentioned using Brun & Lug instead of Dalia and Skarrath. Could you expand your thoughts about that abit more?
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Post by chocobsessed on Apr 18, 2018 15:34:58 GMT
Enjoyed the podcast very much and thanks for pointing me in the right direction on playing Arkadius. You mentioned using Brun & Lug instead of Dalia and Skarrath. Could you expand your thoughts about that abit more? Sure. I think there are tradeoffs between Skarath and Lug. I personally chose skarath because I like mat 6 + additional die (with paralysis) better than mat 7 + knockdown when it comes to high def targets (which is probably more due to a mk2 fear of legion than anything rational), and I like having the ability to stop orders more than preventing knockdown. Skarath also brings a fully-boosted-to-hit spray and a great defense for forced evolution, but those come up only rarely However, the big thing that Lug brings is yet another non-linear long threat range through clever use of return - which would probably contribute more to the list's plan of having a big alpha, and gives you a second pre-feat forced evo/primal target. Honestly, comparing them point to point like I am here makes me question why I'm even bringing Skarath over Lug myself.
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Post by dessert hydra on Apr 19, 2018 12:40:24 GMT
I tried Skarath with Dr A and loved the high def no KD makes him hard to remove. Was thinking with Kwaak the snake becomes really difficult to remove, other than getting to Dahlia
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vomath
BattleBox Champ
Posts: 53
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Post by vomath on Apr 20, 2018 3:03:21 GMT
I liked the episode; thanks for sharing. I had a couple little questions come up whole listening to the episode that I wonder if I could pick your brain over: 1) While taking about max threat ranges you mentioned Counter Charge a couple of times, but unless I'm missing something nothing in your list has it. Were you referring to versions on the list that include Lug, or am I just missing something? 2) You mentioned that there's an easy way to get 1 damage point on Brine, but I didn't catch what that was. Care to share your secret tech?
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Post by ForEver_Blight on Apr 20, 2018 12:52:27 GMT
Double Thrullgs are quite strong in Maelok. Just feat disruption alone on warjacks can save the day. All this time I thought Thrullg was a character >.< (yeah I know I'm late to the party in every sense)
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Post by chocobsessed on Apr 20, 2018 15:07:25 GMT
1) While taking about max threat ranges you mentioned Counter Charge a couple of times, but unless I'm missing something nothing in your list has it. Were you referring to versions on the list that include Lug, or am I just missing something? 2) You mentioned that there's an easy way to get 1 damage point on Brine, but I didn't catch what that was. Care to share your secret tech? 1. Ok, don't expect anything huge from this, it's mostly an example to illustrate how the "threat range" question is flawed. Enliven doesn't specify enemy turn, so if you get counter-charged or defensive struck after you successfully charge, you would then be able to make another full advance forward (and maybe hyper-aggressive too) 2. Needle him with Arkadius. It hits on 5 from behind (as long as you try before giving him forced Evo) and always does one damage. You can also do it on turn one without slowing anyone down by using diversionary tactics to move him forward and face his back arc where Arkadius will be, then Arkadius can needle him and give him forced Evo, and repo forward, then Brine can run forward.
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vomath
BattleBox Champ
Posts: 53
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Post by vomath on Apr 20, 2018 16:36:53 GMT
Thanks for the response! Of course I should have put together needling Brine turn 1; super easy.
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Post by thepimbler on Apr 21, 2018 1:28:36 GMT
You mentioned a few posts back that you usually play Arkadius into Cryx; would you say that this would include the Gaspy3 slayer list? That's becoming pretty popular in my meta and I haven't played into it yet but in my head it seems like Maelok and Arkadius both would have a hard time playing into that list.
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