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Post by maplewhisky on Mar 2, 2018 23:32:15 GMT
macdaddy, you're wrong sir. Stalkers do pretty much ignore Wurmwood's feat - they do not charge, they just jump Think he's talking about Baldur1 and Mohsar. I mean I don't recommend either of those casters here but.... that's what he's talking about.
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Post by macdaddy on Mar 3, 2018 0:57:28 GMT
macdaddy, you're wrong sir. Stalkers do pretty much ignore Wurmwood's feat - they do not charge, they just jump Think he's talking about Baldur1 and Mohsar. I mean I don't recommend either of those casters here but.... that's what he's talking about. Yeah talking about baldur1 Don’t you bash Mohsar! He is the going to be all the rage when people realize how awesome he is! Also he for sure has game here
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Post by oncomingstorm on Mar 3, 2018 1:42:38 GMT
Krueger2 seems...fine...here. A fulcrum with eyeless sight can reach out and touch a stalker a turn, more or less, and stalkers don't kill much that's in the list without feat.
You have to play scared, for sure, but in my experience so does Skarre - you have nearly as many angles to assassinate her as she does you, and your threat is less static.
I need to play it more, but every game into this for me has ended with Skarre1 dying by assassination. Maybe I just had bad Cryx players, though?
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Post by macdaddy on Mar 3, 2018 2:58:30 GMT
Krueger2 seems...fine...here. A fulcrum with eyeless sight can reach out and touch a stalker a turn, more or less, and stalkers don't kill much that's in the list without feat. You have to play scared, for sure, but in my experience so does Skarre - you have nearly as many angles to assassinate her as she does you, and your threat is less static. I need to play it more, but every game into this for me has ended with Skarre1 dying by assassination. Maybe I just had bad Cryx players, though? Well if anyone can get to skarre after a Feat Turn it’s Krueger 2. IME the skarre player typically keeps her well hidden. But Krueger likes to Kill well hidden casters.
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Post by jisidro on Mar 3, 2018 10:52:40 GMT
He gets creamed by Ghostly/Incorporeal that tottaly ignores his feat... Baldur1 was never good against cryx because of that. When the army is essentially 5-6 Stalkers his Feat becomes war more relevant. Sorry, I was lazy typing. Baldur1 will answer some of cryx just not enough to ever be a decent answer. Sometimes there is ghostly, sometimes there is incorporeal sometimes it's jumping stalkers... He'll be a list chicken every time.
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Post by maplewhisky on Mar 3, 2018 13:06:39 GMT
I've been thinking about this more. Maybe the reason it felt so bad for you guys was the Fulcrum? The Fulcrum does seem like a large liability in this matchup.
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Post by maplewhisky on Mar 4, 2018 1:44:14 GMT
So I badgered a Cryx playing friend into playing the above list. You can read the report here: lormahordes.freeforums.net/post/85936/threadThis is how this matchup has gone basically every time I've played it. Coven and Lich3 have given me a lot more problems in the past. Is there something vastly different that happens in your games? Do you have any reports or videos? musza you're usually good for vids.
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Post by Lord_Randall on Mar 4, 2018 5:37:37 GMT
When the army is essentially 5-6 Stalkers his Feat becomes war more relevant. Sorry, I was lazy typing. Baldur1 will answer some of cryx just not enough to ever be a decent answer. Sometimes there is ghostly, sometimes there is incorporeal sometimes it's jumping stalkers... He'll be a list chicken every time. Sometime randomly die...
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Post by musza on Mar 4, 2018 16:09:28 GMT
Yeah, I never get a Wraight Engine in my threat ranges before the FEAT and I never played a game Skarre FEAT other than turn2. I guess rolling 1 on ritual screwed him a bit, when I played the finals the guy rolled 6 twice turn 1 and 2 fml xD Usually the more experience Skarre players use Stalkers to harras you until Banes arrive and I think the list w/o cavallary is just more difficult to deal with. Skarre should never receive the first strike except for maybe a Stalker which is usually a trade-piece-pawn to bait your heavies... and if you don't deal with them they will just kill you, you can't ignore 'em. Gosh... I hate this list
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Post by maplewhisky on Mar 4, 2018 23:44:46 GMT
Yeah, I never get a Wraight Engine in my threat ranges before the FEAT and I never played a game Skarre FEAT other than turn2. I guess rolling 1 on ritual screwed him a bit, when I played the finals the guy rolled 6 twice turn 1 and 2 fml xD Usually the more experience Skarre players use Stalkers to harras you until Banes arrive and I think the list w/o cavallary is just more difficult to deal with. Skarre should never receive the first strike except for maybe a Stalker which is usually a trade-piece-pawn to bait your heavies... and if you don't deal with them they will just kill you, you can't ignore 'em. Gosh... I hate this list That's fair. Can you play Una in the matchup? You know I'm not the biggest fan of Una, but I've decided this week I'm going to try to play at least 5 games of her and see how I feel afterwards.
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Post by babadook on Mar 5, 2018 6:57:01 GMT
You are as good as in love after 5 straight games... She does that to competitive players... I would suggest to use WE & SJ with her...
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hmk17
Baby's First Wargame
Posts: 2
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Post by hmk17 on Mar 5, 2018 7:45:33 GMT
I've played Una2 into the 3 Stalker And Bane Riders version of this. I did not go first, which is something that I think can make a huge difference in whether the feat is popped in counter attack, Alpha, or defense. That army is deceptively fast and can leave you on a hard back foot, potentially trying to shut you out of scenario zones very quickly. Add to it things like Death Ride and Leap to increase threat, you are looking at solid charge ranges
Dark Guidanced, Feated Stalkers were able to kill any Griffon or Pureblood they got to and the Engine is nearly indestructible under feat turn. We do threat a mile and a half with Griffons on feat turn if we can first turn aggressively get up the board and get A Wayfarer in range to hunter's mark Skarre.
I do think that a 6 Stalker list would just be worse in most every way for UNA2.
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unded
Junior Strategist
Posts: 760
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Post by unded on Mar 5, 2018 8:47:38 GMT
I would think an Una2 variant with a fulcrum (no theme, you need to swallow that bitter pill) would be great into this matchup.
electroleaps are not ranged attacks, so the electrical bouncy goodness helps delete banes (warriors, not knights). The spray is solid and against stalkers it's really solid. The pair of Wyrds adds to the carnage, and everything is magical (good chance to force out a defensive feat, else you can shoot out the wraith engine). You're gonna have to sacrifice some stones to hold a zone or two after his defensive feat, but you should have game.
-und_ed
P.S. I know it doesn't work, but I had a giggle about stalkers being affected by their own extended control range for Sunhammer with big daddy Moh. A druid can dream, right?
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Post by musza on Mar 5, 2018 11:51:53 GMT
Yeah, I never get a Wraight Engine in my threat ranges before the FEAT and I never played a game Skarre FEAT other than turn2. I guess rolling 1 on ritual screwed him a bit, when I played the finals the guy rolled 6 twice turn 1 and 2 fml xD Usually the more experience Skarre players use Stalkers to harras you until Banes arrive and I think the list w/o cavallary is just more difficult to deal with. Skarre should never receive the first strike except for maybe a Stalker which is usually a trade-piece-pawn to bait your heavies... and if you don't deal with them they will just kill you, you can't ignore 'em. Gosh... I hate this list That's fair. Can you play Una in the matchup? You know I'm not the biggest fan of Una, but I've decided this week I'm going to try to play at least 5 games of her and see how I feel afterwards. Una2 into this matchup is too much gamble to go for it. If you loose the starting roll you have no game (tried it twice in a row). Skarre1 will just take over the scenario with her threat ranges and if you want to enter it you need to sacrifice the attrition. The assasination is not really on the table as Skarre is the furthest away she can be until Banes arrive to give them Dark Guidence - and that's usually the moment you're lest with almost nothing on the table. She has every tool to go against Una2 and has longer threat ranges than you even under the FEAT (not counting Hunters Mark because you can't rely on it against DEF15 stealth). If you go first you have a game there because you're not pushed out of scenario but it's still very hard. Skarre can use her FEAT defensively turn 1 and jam you because she doesn't need a STR buff agains Griffons. When she does that your alpha is not that effective (no way of getting rid of Wraith Engine because you cannot have Wraightbane and Primal at the same time) and Stalkers are so wide on the table you cannot go for them all. It's just not the correct answer nor a fair matchup. I guess Una2 Devourers Host might work tho.
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Post by maplewhisky on Mar 5, 2018 12:09:17 GMT
That's fair. Can you play Una in the matchup? You know I'm not the biggest fan of Una, but I've decided this week I'm going to try to play at least 5 games of her and see how I feel afterwards. Una2 into this matchup is too much gamble to go for it. If you loose the starting roll you have no game (tried it twice in a row). Skarre1 will just take over the scenario with her threat ranges and if you want to enter it you need to sacrifice the attrition. The assasination is not really on the table as Skarre is the furthest away she can be until Banes arrive to give them Dark Guidence - and that's usually the moment you're lest with almost nothing on the table. She has every tool to go against Una2 and has longer threat ranges than you even under the FEAT (not counting Hunters Mark because you can't rely on it against DEF15 stealth). If you go first you have a game there because you're not pushed out of scenario but it's still very hard. Skarre can use her FEAT defensively turn 1 and jam you because she doesn't need a STR buff agains Griffons. When she does that your alpha is not that effective (no way of getting rid of Wraith Engine because you cannot have Wraightbane and Primal at the same time) and Stalkers are so wide on the table you cannot go for them all. It's just not the correct answer nor a fair matchup. I guess Una2 Devourers Host might work tho. Alright noted. At present seeing as I cant come up with a better answer for Slayer spam than K2 or Wurmwood I think I would play one of those here for sure. I don’t think my wurmwood list would be great vs the slayers, too many points in guns (although oil and fire seem good vs slayers). Dunno. I definitely think I would rather play the tree vs 6 stalkers though. Testing needed. I’m still of the opinion the Fulcrum makes these matchups worse, pretty happy I don’t have it.
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