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Denny2...
Jan 24, 2018 8:41:56 GMT
via mobile
Post by grotsnik on Jan 24, 2018 8:41:56 GMT
Actually I believe the changes to their focus ruling makes it much more risky and easier to punish wiches that spread out. I dont know if it punishes spreading out, but it certainly makes it much more risky goig up the field with egregore, combined with a weaker feat I dont know how the coven stands now, time will tell, but on paper it seems much worse than its mkII version, and it wasnt popular back then...
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Denny2...
Jan 24, 2018 11:35:12 GMT
via mobile
Post by gedditoffme on Jan 24, 2018 11:35:12 GMT
Actually I believe the changes to their focus ruling makes it much more risky and easier to punish wiches that spread out. I dont know if it punishes spreading out, but it certainly makes it much more risky goig up the field with egregore, combined with a weaker feat I dont know how the coven stands now, time will tell, but on paper it seems much worse than its mkII version, and it wasnt popular back then... In fairness it’s been weaker than mk2 the whole time. I think only real plus was the broken interaction with power field (which I think everyone agrees is kind of dumb)
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Post by Gamingdevil on Jan 24, 2018 12:19:41 GMT
I dont know if it punishes spreading out, but it certainly makes it much more risky goig up the field with egregore, combined with a weaker feat I dont know how the coven stands now, time will tell, but on paper it seems much worse than its mkII version, and it wasnt popular back then... In fairness it’s been weaker than mk2 the whole time. I think only real plus was the broken interaction with power field (which I think everyone agrees is kind of dumb) Certainly, but I think the devs are underestimating the impact of the feat nerf. Now it's only useful as an alpha enabler, but against another melee army going first, you will give up too much board space actually trying to use it. Against a range army you have to push the ball forward very hard to catch everything and then it's in danger of just dying with an effective DEF nerf as well as the fix to overboosting. I'm sad that they didn't test at least this part in the CID.
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Post by far2casual on Jan 24, 2018 12:57:34 GMT
Deneghra 1, I will miss Scourge. Aside from that, the changes don't really do much for or against my opinion of her. For me it was always a straight numbers game with the debuffs and the debuffs are pretty much the same. Influence got cheaper, but I am still not casting it. Preventing charges and Tramples was a huge part of what allowed Denny1 to apply her feat early to a large portion of your opponent's army while being safe from most threats, even by standing in the middle of the table. Many lists actually have a way to fight back during her feat now, or to threaten her directly, and she's usually not camping much. She also was applying a huge scenario pressure by preventing the opponent to react to scenario plays accordingly. Her feat nerf is much bigger than it looks.
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Post by tiberius on Jan 24, 2018 13:13:43 GMT
I understand that, but as someone who does not play scenario...ever...that part of the feat was never that important to me. I understand for tournament players or people that play that way regularly, its important, but it doesn't change my opinion or use of her.
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Post by 36cygnar24guy36 on Jan 24, 2018 13:17:18 GMT
I understand that, but as someone who does not play scenario...ever...that part of the feat was never that important to me. I understand for tournament players or people that play that way regularly, its important, but it doesn't change my opinion or use of her. I don't want to get side tracked here, but you don't play Scenario at all? even in casual play? Surely you just take the best gun line you can and just pew pew all day?
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Post by tiberius on Jan 24, 2018 13:22:37 GMT
My opponents find it boring and distracting, so we don't play scenario unless one of us comes up with some sort of story driven theme or narrative. They want to play assassination only. My argument is that not all casters are balanced around assassination only, as some are great control/scenario but suck at assassination or enabling that sort of play. Doesn't matter. They will play if I insist, and we do if I am practicing for a tournament or something, but aside from those rare circumstances, we don't play scenario.
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Deller
Junior Strategist
I’m on a Boat
Posts: 605
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Post by Deller on Jan 24, 2018 14:09:31 GMT
I dont know if it punishes spreading out, but it certainly makes it much more risky goig up the field with egregore, combined with a weaker feat I dont know how the coven stands now, time will tell, but on paper it seems much worse than its mkII version, and it wasnt popular back then... In fairness it’s been weaker than mk2 the whole time. I think only real plus was the broken interaction with power field (which I think everyone agrees is kind of dumb) The other plus is the removal of the * in the Steamroller packet that said only one Witch could score each turn. As long as that’s still gone they’re still fundamentally broken on a rules level.
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Post by darkshroud on Jan 24, 2018 17:04:09 GMT
Denny1 on the other hand can die in a fire for all I care. I blame her for the "cryx can't have nice things" state of toys, so relegating her to a shelf-sitter is fine by me (not to mention her model is hideous). Its funny because we have a lot of nice things.
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Post by darkshroud on Jan 24, 2018 17:10:59 GMT
Like Deller I'm very amused by the fact that Tim Banky successfully completed his personal crusade though to be honest, I'm disappointed they gave into it. He was basically playing one point up just because he wanted to have his way; it was a bit childish and yet they still gave him what he wanted. i mean, isnt that how CID works? hey guys heres a thing i tested and here are the battle reports showing you how it impacted the game. - thing gets changed - i guess one could argue, like you are, that catering to a top tier player and changing pt values just to make the *one* list is a little odd. but if it means termy getting more play and diversifying our roster, isnt that also a good thing??
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Post by darkshroud on Jan 24, 2018 17:18:11 GMT
random thought.
what if pp is trying to mix up the meta. which is easy by just removing ghost fleet. now people dont "need" to make sure they tech for incorp and rfp. letting them play with a little bit more.
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Post by tiberius on Jan 24, 2018 17:22:13 GMT
It wouldn't surprise me that that is at least part of what is going on, a meta mix up with every CID. Though once one thing gets nerfed, then the next best thing rises to the top and that is what people have to tech for, so it doesn't really solve anything in the long run unless I guess if that thing doesn't require any special tools to deal with.
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Post by gedditoffme on Jan 24, 2018 20:21:34 GMT
random thought. what if pp is trying to mix up the meta. which is easy by just removing ghost fleet. now people dont "need" to make sure they tech for incorp and rfp. letting them play with a little bit more. Thing is, incorporeal is stronger than ever- lots of speculation that Cryx & Grymkin did well at ATC entirely on the back of cheap incorporeal contesting models or Wraith engines controlling zones. It doesn't take much incorporeal without a counter to hand a scenario win.
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Denny2...
Jan 24, 2018 20:48:59 GMT
via mobile
Post by grotsnik on Jan 24, 2018 20:48:59 GMT
Any thoughts on solos getting dodge as SotBC bonus? Its pretty lame imo... seems like they looked for the weakest thing they could came up with just so they dont completly erase the benefit... I mean... how many solos can we have? 5? 2 captains, the priestess, axiara and severa At least they could've gave them rfp given that they left the whole theme without it
And regarding the blood witches I dont know if they are that bad, without the hag they are 13pt, which is pretty cheap for a 2 attack gang unit with stealth, just the hag seems not that useful anymore
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boozy
Junior Strategist
Posts: 429
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Denny2...
Jan 24, 2018 23:23:01 GMT
via mobile
Post by boozy on Jan 24, 2018 23:23:01 GMT
[quote source="/post/78450/thread"Thing is, incorporeal is stronger than ever- lots of speculation that Cryx & Grymkin did well at ATC entirely on the back of cheap incorporeal contesting models or Wraith engines controlling zones. It doesn't take much incorporeal without a counter to hand a scenario win. If that was true, then shouldn't then Minions and Skorne performed well on the backs of Void Spirits, Feralgeists and Gremlin Swarms? Voids aren't popular atm because they are only in a theme they skornergize with (funny that), but Gremlin Swarms are certainly powerful and easily available in WWFF, which is a strong theme.
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