shoe
Junior Strategist
Posts: 706
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Post by shoe on Dec 5, 2017 1:26:20 GMT
no but as it involves putting passage and countermeasure on a vanguard and running macbain without infantry in llaelese resistance i am sure that it is baffling
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Post by postindirty on Dec 5, 2017 5:27:55 GMT
yeah, you're missing vital points if you're even thinking that counter measures is the crux of this
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Post by postindirty on Dec 5, 2017 5:40:14 GMT
For the sake of circumnavigating further snark, I'll lay out what I was proposing with MacBain; I'm of the opinion that there's little infantry he wants to use in LR, particularly on the cav side of things which incidentally is what the OP is about. Even if you were to take stealth units like trencher commandos or daughters of the flame, may buy you one turn of no shooting, but rarely more against a savvy opponent.
But there may be a jack-heavy build that's half decent with the access to choir. Because of passage, counter-measures becomes a largely irrelevant spell. If there's magical shooting to worry about, you may then consider putting counter measures on something like a vanguard - that was all that I was proposing
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shoe
Junior Strategist
Posts: 706
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Post by shoe on Dec 5, 2017 6:14:32 GMT
but snark is not all i have to offer!
i cannot help but point out that protectorate has been using passage on their warjacks in every single list for years. but they also do other things
your plan is to play jack heavy in an infantry theme with a caster who wants some infantry. you're going to toss out failsafe and fortune and rely on 4 focus and passage to take on the world while down 10-15 points and eschewing his best trick
pray reconsider. why would this be anything other than a very bad protectorate list?
also u are incorrect on a number of points. attractive infantry options for macbain are zealots that all come back, stromblades that cant be knocked down, rangers that run real far and spot for galleon, trencher commandos for the same, trenchers for a fortuned cloud wall
CM also buys u more than one turn free of shooting. after that one feat turn, the rest of ur army should be down their throat leaving them to deal with the cm unit as well as everything else
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Post by postindirty on Dec 5, 2017 9:18:50 GMT
but snark is not all i have to offer! i cannot help but point out that protectorate has been using passage on their warjacks in every single list for years. but they also do other things your plan is to play jack heavy in an infantry theme with a caster who wants some infantry. you're going to toss out failsafe and fortune and rely on 4 focus and passage to take on the world while down 10-15 points and eschewing his best trick pray reconsider. why would this be anything other than a very bad protectorate list? also u are incorrect on a number of points. attractive infantry options for macbain are zealots that all come back, stromblades that cant be knocked down, rangers that run real far and spot for galleon, trencher commandos for the same, trenchers for a fortuned cloud wall CM also buys u more than one turn free of shooting. after that one feat turn, the rest of ur army should be down their throat leaving them to deal with the cm unit as well as everything else Yossss, finally some nitty gritty. But also many more bold claims; for one LR is far from being an "infantry theme" (try combined arms maybe), claiming the free points from the theme is perhaps one of the weaker aspects of the theme anyway and I argue there's good reasons to not always push for that 2nd solo and certainly not for the third. And MacBain's "best trick" is also his most telegraphed one. And I'm writing from the perspective of seeing that once people have faced it, the feat drastically loses its impact. As for the infantry options you list, its interesting to hear that the zealot trick doesn't quite work the way people initially thought, but that was one unit i was thinking could fit in this hypothetical jack build. But apart from being annoying, the unit isn't doing squat. Stormblades do seem attractive. Their speed and defensive stats prior to mini feat leaves me doubting them, but they may get there with your trenchers. If you're running Commandos I'd be wondering why you wouldn't just switch to Irregulars and just go with Croes and call it a day. If you're running Rangers as an enabler for the Galleon, I'd wonder why you didn't just run Choir. And that the feat and CM buys you a turn to be down people's throat... I really don't know what sort of MacBain list you're running that has the meat to be able to do that. I know what you mean in theory, but there's just not the numbers to allow for it. But that may be the inherent problem of MacBain himself not actually being all that good any way, whether you play to his strengths or try some kookie theorised jack list as I'm proposing.
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shoe
Junior Strategist
Posts: 706
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Post by shoe on Dec 5, 2017 22:53:29 GMT
u can't argue that the are good reasons to not get free solos without giving reasons! teh theme givs u free points for taking mans and gives bonuses to those mans. it gives no bonuses to warjacks except the vanguard. it is an infantry theme.
i run macbain in irregulars where i can jam with CM, stand everything up with boomhowler and show the other army the back of my hand! works a trick
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Post by postindirty on Dec 6, 2017 0:11:46 GMT
the hypothetical benefit to jacks would be the access to the choir though - if taking them sufficiently boosts the jacks, alongside with the spells MacBain has, that would be the argument to consider leaving the free solos at home.
This doesn't make it a jack theme, which is why its more combined arms! Especially because the access you have to infantry is limited to two max units at best, or three if you seriously consider the Devil Dogs. At best you're looking at around 30 infantry which hardly screams "infantry theme".
Your irregulars list still leaves questions; what unit is taking CM, and what work are the Boomhowlers even doing? What's following up as a counter punch? It all seems very middling and for-funsies, which is fine, But hardly the pinnacle of efficiency or effectiveness!
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Xintas
Junior Strategist
Posts: 824
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Post by Xintas on Dec 6, 2017 14:13:19 GMT
Not to be that guy...but didn't this start off as a thread about cavalry?
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shoe
Junior Strategist
Posts: 706
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Post by shoe on Dec 6, 2017 14:15:43 GMT
Not to be that guy...but didn't this start off as a thread about cavalry? yah. nobody has tried it.
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Post by postindirty on Dec 6, 2017 20:06:31 GMT
Double what? Cav who
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Post by sgregorbmmd on Dec 6, 2017 21:46:56 GMT
Yeah, this went super well.
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shoe
Junior Strategist
Posts: 706
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Post by shoe on Dec 7, 2017 4:24:25 GMT
i am pleasd that we could help
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Post by Blargaliscious on Dec 7, 2017 12:15:00 GMT
If you're going to do Double Cav then I suggest forgetting LR and go with Damiano and all Steelhead in Kingmaker.
Mercenary - Damiano and 2x Cav
Theme: The Kingmaker's Army 3 / 3 Free Cards 75 / 75 Army
Captain Damiano - WJ: +28 - Rocinante - PC: 18 (Battlegroup Points Used: 18) - Vanguard - PC: 10 (Battlegroup Points Used: 10)
Stannis Brocker - PC: 0 Sergeant Nicolas Verendrye - PC: 0 Orin Midwinter, Rogue Inquisitor - PC: 0
Steelhead Heavy Cavalry - Leader & 4 Grunts: 18 Steelhead Heavy Cavalry - Leader & 4 Grunts: 18 Steelhead Halberdiers - Leader & 9 Grunts: 11 Steelhead Halberdiers - Leader & 5 Grunts: 7 Steelhead Halberdiers - Leader & 5 Grunts: 7 Steelhead Riflemen - Leader & 9 Grunts: 14
THEME: The Kingmaker's Army ---
GENERATED : 12/07/2017 07:13:12 BUILD ID : 2055.17-11-21
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crow
Junior Strategist
Posts: 310
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Post by crow on Dec 7, 2017 12:19:57 GMT
War Room Army Mercenary - Damiano and 2x Cav Theme: The Kingmaker's Army 3 / 3 Free Cards 75 / 75 Army Captain Damiano - WJ: +28 - Rocinante - PC: 18 (Battlegroup Points Used: 18) - Vanguard - PC: 10 (Battlegroup Points Used: 10) Stannis Brocker - PC: 0 Sergeant Nicolas Verendrye - PC: 0 Orin Midwinter, Rogue Inquisitor - PC: 0 Steelhead Heavy Cavalry - Leader & 4 Grunts: 18 Steelhead Heavy Cavalry - Leader & 4 Grunts: 18 Steelhead Halberdiers - Leader & 9 Grunts: 11 Steelhead Halberdiers - Leader & 5 Grunts: 7 Steelhead Halberdiers - Leader & 5 Grunts: 7 Steelhead Riflemen - Leader & 9 Grunts: 14 THEME: The Kingmaker's Army --- GENERATED : 12/07/2017 07:13:12 BUILD ID : 2055.17-11-21 Couldn't you make that an irregulars theme and then snatch another solo, which could be rhupert, thus giving you access to two tough units of halbs (or tough Cav I guess) and or Pathfinder when needed?
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shoe
Junior Strategist
Posts: 706
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Post by shoe on Dec 7, 2017 14:22:50 GMT
i would suggest not doing that!!!¡
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