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Post by dragash on Mar 7, 2017 17:15:00 GMT
It's hard for me not to make the connection between the behavior I see at PP and some moves in general towards free speech i see in other platforms such as facebook, youtube, and reddit. The underlying reasoning seems entirely politically motivated, you know that thing no one is allowed to talk about but motivates everything you do. If I could be forgiven a moment of tinfoil-hatness i would say PP has been invaded by a SJW who was embarrassed by the community and is 'correcting' the problem. Pure conjecture on my part though. I thought the exact same thing when I saw their new list of terms and conditions. And when they started replying to threads with a generic spiel, and then immediately closing them so that no one could reply to their answer.
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Post by phantasmagorium on Mar 7, 2017 17:15:43 GMT
If I could be forgiven a moment of tinfoil-hatness i would say PP has been invaded by a SJW who was embarrassed by the community and is 'correcting' the problem. Pure conjecture on my part though. Not going to lie, this has gone through my head as well. I would have mocked the idea if someone had brought it up regarding, for example, page 5 being removed, but these days.. Especially with all the damned corporate doublespeak and evasiveness coming from certain members of staff in the days leading up to the forum nuke (who I don't name because I don't want to imply it was their decision, as it's quite possible they were just the mouthpiece / scapegoat).
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faelin
Junior Strategist
Posts: 121
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Post by faelin on Mar 7, 2017 17:30:43 GMT
SJW?
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Post by Jabberwokk on Mar 7, 2017 17:34:44 GMT
SJW=Social Justice Warrior
A very short crude description would be one who executes the following worldview:
There is a 'correct' way of thinking, being, and doing. Submit. Obey.
I could expand on this but It would be better for the real word forum or whatever it's called.
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Lanz
Junior Strategist
Posts: 685
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Post by Lanz on Mar 7, 2017 17:34:48 GMT
If I could be forgiven a moment of tinfoil-hatness i would say PP has been invaded by a SJW who was embarrassed by the community and is 'correcting' the problem. Pure conjecture on my part though. Honestly, that was my take on it too. It happens to coincide with the rise of a certain social media coordinator on PP's payroll, too, but she could just be a symptom rather than a cause.
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Post by Jabberwokk on Mar 7, 2017 17:55:17 GMT
Agreed. Furthermore they're located in Washington which is political central. PP don't insult my intelligence by trying to convince me the day to day political discussion it does not influence the thinking of the PP big hats.
Outside of the miniature sphere I follow world events quite closely. When Page 5 got removed (instead of revised) I raised an eyebrow and everything that happened after was just another point of data of the trend. I bet the idea was pitched off as good for business even though the trend in the upcoming generation is increasingly more conservative and pro free speech then those who came before it, you know, the generation there ditching us for. Again Conjecture.
I strongly suspect there is some in PP who would be 'our side' but simply do not have the power or influence to counter this obvious authoritative slant. That said the parallels with GW are growing more stark by the hour as more testimony from people who have been the new forums comes in.
My suggestion: There is a saying "Living well is best revenge".
We can do this by:
Freedom: It allows innovation and real acceptance even with those who you disagree with. Fighting: Let the best strategies, ideas, discussions rise to the top. Iron sharpening Iron. Forgiveness: Getting hurt or insulted is inevitable. Learn to see past the hurt and keep you focus on the things and goals that matter.
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kaos
Junior Strategist
Posts: 268
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Post by kaos on Mar 7, 2017 18:00:22 GMT
I didn't want to say it but yes looks like all the cause of this was a certain social media coordinator successfully forcing her vision on the forum.
I would think also this is a management idea since you cannot do something so big and not having the agreement of the exco team.
I'm still asking myself the hell they're thinking. The new forum moderation and behavior make me feel so unwelcomed I didn't even made a single post (and probably will never do).
I suppose this is exactly what they wanted to achieve, made us feel unwelcomed and make us move somewhere else.
But this also lead me to spend my money on other stuff rather than wmh. Actually the AOS community is making me incredibly excited about some projects.
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Post by Aegis on Mar 7, 2017 18:16:33 GMT
I would suggest to not start a witchhunt on assumptions.
Sure, someone big in PP decided that the forums had to go, that is clear, but trying to guess who he/she is and try to put the blame on someone seems not only unfair, but also useless.
It's clear that most of the recent changes into PP behaviour and decisions are due to changes into the staff, first of all the diaspora of some important game developers that now work for Guild Balls, followed by the farewell of Simon as Community Manager.
That said, we don't know who pressed for this solution, and blaming Valerie (because it is clear who the assumptions were pointing at) just because she happens to have got in charge in the recent months is unfair and unrespectful. She could very well be directed by someone in higher position than her, or it could have been a condivided decision in PP.
I wholehearthly agree that the forum killing was a terrible mistake by PP, but let's stop personal accusations right away (expecially unsupported ones).
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Post by Jabberwokk on Mar 7, 2017 18:25:24 GMT
I've shied away from naming anyone.
But as the information comes in, If the boot fits......
But you are correct it is at this point useless.
In any case I am familiar with the ideology that drives such decisions and am confident that it is systemically self defeating.
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Lanz
Junior Strategist
Posts: 685
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Post by Lanz on Mar 7, 2017 18:27:24 GMT
Yes, like I said, she could just be a symptom, not a cause. For all we know she was brought in because PP had already decided on this course and she was a good person for the role.
I have my own reason for being biased against Valarie, so the accusations don't surprise me, though they could easily be false too.
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kaos
Junior Strategist
Posts: 268
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Post by kaos on Mar 7, 2017 18:35:51 GMT
Well whatever was it, we should make the most of it. We have a place to talk about the game without their influence that recently was intrusive.
That's right playing the blame game at this point is unnecessary.
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Post by phantasmagorium on Mar 7, 2017 18:37:12 GMT
I would suggest to not start a witchhunt on assumptions. Sure, someone big in PP decided that the forums had to go, that is clear, but trying to guess who he/she is and try to put the blame on someone seems not only unfair, but also useless. It's clear that most of the recent changes into PP behaviour and decision are due to changes into the staff, first of all the diaspora of some important game developers that now work for Guild Balls, followed by the farewell of Simon as Community Manager. That said, we don't know who pressed for this solution, and blaming Valerie just because she happens to have got in charge in the recent months is unfair and unrespectful. She could very well be directed by someone in higher position than her, or it could have been a condivided decision in PP. I wholehearthly agree that the forum killing was a terrible mistake by PP, but let's stop personal accusations right away (expecially unsupported ones). Seriously. Just because she was the messenger doesn't mean she was the decider. Witch hunts are bad, for lots of reasons.
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Post by Swampmist on Mar 7, 2017 18:43:31 GMT
So, yeah I'm gonna curb the witchhunt here. Pretty sure that falls under don't be a buttmunch. Let's try to keep the working relationship we have with PP in tact, shall we?
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Post by Jabberwokk on Mar 7, 2017 18:52:04 GMT
So, yeah I'm gonna curb the witchhunt here. Pretty sure that falls under don't be a buttmunch. Let's try to keep the working relationship we have with PP in tact, shall we? They started it My only interest is if it's true, and if it is, Then whoever it is needs to wear it. If I punch you in the face it isn't being a buttmunch to say I punched you in the face. When Robin Cruddace ruined the Tyranid codex two years running it isn't a buttmunch thing to do to say he's garbage at writing codexi. When Tom Kirby finally ended his war on his customers by his removal, GW has been measurably and objectively better because of it. It isn't a buttmunch thing to say he's at fault for GW decline. The only thing I will concede is that we only have a theory that happens to fit the facts and nothing more.
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Post by Swampmist on Mar 7, 2017 18:53:50 GMT
Yes, but I mean the implication that it is solely on the person in question. Innocent until proven guilty guys, don't jump to conclusions when we know so little.
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