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Post by gobber on Aug 29, 2017 2:20:18 GMT
Ashlynn into CID! +1hp; swap twister for heightened reflexes Crosse: Remove Sentry Add Ghost Walk Add Dauntless Resolve (unit gains +3 arm & tough) Feat: everything gets Ghost Walk, Stealth, and Run & Gun Llaelese Changes: Constance & Precursors removed from theme Out of faction unit limit raised to two. Must be chosen from a single faction: Cygnar, Protectorate, Crucible Guard. There is no longer a base size or non-character limitation. Ace actually becomes a mercenary model now when taken in the theme. He is still limited to Caine3. It's time to play around with some quickened Tempest Blazers.
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Tucker
Junior Strategist
Posts: 103
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Post by Tucker on Aug 29, 2017 2:57:58 GMT
I don't like the changes to Crosse. He needed some tweaks but it would be more beneficial to make him better at shooting stuff and not just add a grab bag of spells to his list.
The Ashlynn change is baffling. She should be better at killing stuff and have passive abilities on her card that keep her from getting killed, not a defensive upkeep that competes with her other defensive upkeeps.
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Post by gobber on Aug 29, 2017 3:08:09 GMT
Ugh do I have to buy double stormlances now? If they're staying def13 that's some nasty quicken cycling...
Nah that's not happening. I think it's time to paint all that old Cygnar green though.
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Post by Sarcastastic on Aug 29, 2017 3:27:36 GMT
I like the premise behing the LR change, though it seems a bit on the 'very strong' side. I will applaud the merc themes though for actually doing the most to drastically change style between the themes. No other faction seems to get one that changes things so radically (except the Skorne minion one).
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Lahn
Junior Strategist
Posts: 100
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Post by Lahn on Aug 29, 2017 6:20:13 GMT
Ugh do I have to buy double stormlances now? If they're staying def13 that's some nasty quicken cycling... Nah that's not happening. I think it's time to paint all that old Cygnar green though. Faction nerfs (i.e. Haley2 being made reasonable) usually instigate a good time to peruse the second hand market.
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Post by mikethefish on Aug 29, 2017 21:38:37 GMT
I don't like the changes to Crosse. He needed some tweaks but it would be more beneficial to make him better at shooting stuff and not just add a grab bag of spells to his list. I love the changes to Crosse. Mercs don't need a half-assed version of Caine. At least this version of Cross presents a clear plan of attack that players can follow through with. Like the Devs said in the write-up, Cross can now support his army, while slowly build up his soul collection - finally going all Death Blossom to help finish off the game. It lets him be a shooting caster, while still having a fairly unique design that doesn't step on Caine's toes too much. Dauntless resolve is an amazing spell, especially when considering the wealth of units you have available in the Resistance theme. Ghost Walk is phenomenally useful in the newest tournament environment, and helps out quite a bit, since granting effective Pathfinder isn't something that Mercs can usually do, outside of the occaisional Feat turn or Solo bonus. I get that you have a vision of the guy being the proverbial Super Solo, but outside of a few rare instances, that is just not a great caster template to follow. Being a Support/Super Solo caster hybrid is far more useful. I am not totally convinced that he is 100 percent complete, but his newest incarnation is very compelling.
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Tucker
Junior Strategist
Posts: 103
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Post by Tucker on Aug 30, 2017 2:39:51 GMT
I don't know we need another focus 6 support warcaster with a bunch of upkeep buffs and a decent feat who can occasionally kill things, seeing as that is... pretty much every non-Cephalyx, non-Damiano Mercenary warcaster? Do we really need Ashlynn - with a gun! Or Shae - with a gun! Or Gorten - with an even better gun!
I'd rather have something different.
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Post by Soul Samurai on Aug 30, 2017 7:44:13 GMT
Those sounds like positive changes overall to me.
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Post by mikethefish on Aug 30, 2017 9:52:56 GMT
I don't know we need another focus 6 support warcaster with a bunch of upkeep buffs and a decent feat who can occasionally kill things, seeing as that is... pretty much every non-Cephalyx, non-Damiano Mercenary warcaster? Do we really need Ashlynn - with a gun! Or Shae - with a gun! Or Gorten - with an even better gun! I'd rather have something different. I would argue that Ghost Walk and an objectively awesome unit armor buff qualify as pretty darn "different", since we have absolutely no equivalent to them in Mercs. Additionally, he has precisely one upkeep spell - honestly, did you even read the document entry?
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Post by Azuresun on Aug 30, 2017 10:21:55 GMT
I don't know we need another focus 6 support warcaster with a bunch of upkeep buffs and a decent feat who can occasionally kill things, seeing as that is... pretty much every non-Cephalyx, non-Damiano Mercenary warcaster? Do we really need Ashlynn - with a gun! Or Shae - with a gun! Or Gorten - with an even better gun! I'd rather have something different. Damiano is probably the exemplar of that playstyle. Upkeeps out, coins out, feat, my work here is done.
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Tucker
Junior Strategist
Posts: 103
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Post by Tucker on Aug 30, 2017 14:17:15 GMT
I know this is the internet so providing examples is a fool's errand as people will latch on to them and use them as a reductio ad absurdum, but we all make mistakes.
Allow me to rephrase. I do not think the changes to Crosse make him a bad warcaster. Rather, I think they make him a less interesting warcaster. He is less interesting because we do not have 'super solo' warcaster in mercenaries, with the exception of Caine3, and moving him away from that direction takes on a path well-worn by almost every other Mercenary warcaster. It would be more interesting to have him be really good at shooting and disrupting the enemy lines with his gun, and possibly some debuff spells as well. This would require, first and foremost, improving his soul-gathering mechanic and other gun-related rules. Improving his spell list does not help with what I would like this CID to accomplish: providing us with a good super-solo warcaster.
Now, if Crosse comes out of CID with a better spell list and better combat rules that will be fine and dandy. The two spells he picked up are both excellent and better than Sentry. I will play him in his final form whatever that ends up being because I am a fanboy for all things Llaelese, but I would rather that form be something that enriches the Mercenary faction as a whole and not just more of the same.
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Xintas
Junior Strategist
Posts: 824
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Post by Xintas on Aug 30, 2017 18:39:09 GMT
Not pointing fingers (seriously not), but I'm finding it super hard to complain.
-Ashlynn gets a much better spell (obviously arguable) and more boxes -Theme force allows all size bases and character units...then doubles the amount -Crosse gains the ability to not only play for assassination by getting a bonkers upkeep and a phenomenal spell that we were previously paying 4 points to have on a stick
I think Ashlynn still needs a bit of thought (frankly Crosse's upkeep on her would make me stupidly happy), but it's still a lot to be happy about.
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benkei
Junior Strategist
Posts: 244
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Post by benkei on Aug 30, 2017 20:39:27 GMT
Ashlynn needs much more than that paltry change to be decent, and what she needs is not yet another defensive upkeep with her 6 focus
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Post by gobber on Aug 30, 2017 20:45:10 GMT
Ashlynn needs much more than that paltry change to be decent I don't think it's enough either; her introduction to the CID process is far more important than this first change.
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Post by Azuresun on Aug 30, 2017 22:58:06 GMT
Ashlynn needs much more than that paltry change to be decent, and what she needs is not yet another defensive upkeep with her 6 focus I think what Ashlynn really needs is some sort of hit and run ability. Gates of Death made Thyra much more viable in the same role, since she could go in, do stuff and then be 7" away from whatever she just killed.
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