draycos
Junior Strategist
Posts: 167
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Post by draycos on Jul 27, 2017 15:46:34 GMT
This forum topic exists to, hopefully, help new Protectorate players, or those who have lost sight of our factions powerful choices.
What lists do you guys think are currently at the top in Protectorate?
I keep hearing that basically all of our casters are playable and I have to agree. But what lists pairings are the best in the over all meta? (Locally I feel like we have a small group that actually does mimic general meta.) What is the core strategy? which list does what? Which models are required for that core strategy and which can be swapped based on personal preference?
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blakeh1
Junior Strategist
Posts: 181
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Post by blakeh1 on Jul 27, 2017 16:54:34 GMT
Considering the placement of Protectorate in big events, I'm, not sure anyone knows High Reclaimer before the feat nerf was definitely one of them
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Post by streetpizza on Jul 27, 2017 17:05:31 GMT
Blakeh1 has the right of it. With out a dominant protectorate player on the larger scene right now its a difficult question to answer. I do think you'll see a lot of Amon (creator's might) / X.
X is the big unknown and in SR2017 Amon may not even have that much play anymore as the scenarios start to demand an infantry presence.
Keep your eyes peeled though as the second half of 2017 should be very very interesting as the metas settle out on the new scenario rules.
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Provengreil
Junior Strategist
Choir Kills: 12
Posts: 850
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Post by Provengreil on Jul 27, 2017 17:38:50 GMT
Blakeh1 has the right of it. With out a dominant protectorate player on the larger scene right now its a difficult question to answer. I do think you'll see a lot of Amon (creator's might) / X. X is the big unknown and in SR2017 Amon may not even have that much play anymore as the scenarios start to demand an infantry presence. Keep your eyes peeled though as the second half of 2017 should be very very interesting as the metas settle out on the new scenario rules. the choir and a random mechanic can score a few points if you clear a zone completely, but I'm not sure scenario was a primary draw of Amon. You know, like, ever.
I think the X is going to be what defines any given Protectorate player. Amon for the power, counter his weaknesses with dealer's choice of Reznik 2, either Severius, Harbinger, Kreoss 1, or Vindictus. I think the rest are a bit too lacking somewhere or other to measure up.
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Post by Swampmist on Jul 27, 2017 17:45:17 GMT
mechanic's can't score zones anymore; they score flags
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doopsie
Junior Strategist
Posts: 341
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Post by doopsie on Jul 27, 2017 17:55:45 GMT
I think part of the problem is the rather lack-luster themes we've gotten, paired with the expectation that everybody plays in theme.
Creator's Might is good, but very much warjack-spam, which will suffer in SR2017. But Guardians lacks hitting power, and Exemplar Interdiction is wrapped up with, well, Exemplars, and they need help (specifically Errants and Bastions desperately need help, but the only ones that are in a really good spot are KE).
So we can run Amon in Creator's Might (or Tristan2, which I prefer because I like suffering), but what do you run for the second list? Any decent balanced list I can come up with is invariably out-of-theme for one reason or another, which means playing 5-15 points under.
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Post by paradox on Jul 27, 2017 18:00:05 GMT
Blakeh1 has the right of it. With out a dominant protectorate player on the larger scene right now its a difficult question to answer. I do think you'll see a lot of Amon (creator's might) / X. X is the big unknown and in SR2017 Amon may not even have that much play anymore as the scenarios start to demand an infantry presence. Keep your eyes peeled though as the second half of 2017 should be very very interesting as the metas settle out on the new scenario rules. This statement speaks volumes of the community's herd mentality, and is a sad indictment of WMH culture. Without some con winner name, its hopelessly adrify, and yet people adhere to the dogma of the last successful state, too afraid to experiment. For me, Feora1 is a strong first choice. Im undecided as a pairing, but Durst has piqued my interet in an unconventional non-theme list relying heavily on paladins. I feel confident any paladin theme helps it, with caveat that I really need the damned hierophant in themes.
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Provengreil
Junior Strategist
Choir Kills: 12
Posts: 850
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Post by Provengreil on Jul 27, 2017 18:26:18 GMT
mechanic's can't score zones anymore; they score flags I know. Flags have a habit of being behind your front lines, and in my games the chances a random mechanic has of being near enough to a damaged warjack that lived with its cortex is rather low, so they're excellent flag cmapers at 1 point apiece.
Also, fun fact: going second in exemplar theme means wracks can score a flag in certain scenarios.
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Post by streetpizza on Jul 27, 2017 18:58:23 GMT
Blakeh1 has the right of it. With out a dominant protectorate player on the larger scene right now its a difficult question to answer. I do think you'll see a lot of Amon (creator's might) / X. X is the big unknown and in SR2017 Amon may not even have that much play anymore as the scenarios start to demand an infantry presence. Keep your eyes peeled though as the second half of 2017 should be very very interesting as the metas settle out on the new scenario rules. This statement speaks volumes of the community's herd mentality, and is a sad indictment of WMH culture. Without some con winner name, its hopelessly adrify, and yet people adhere to the dogma of the last successful state, too afraid to experiment. For me, Feora1 is a strong first choice. Im undecided as a pairing, but Durst has piqued my interet in an unconventional non-theme list relying heavily on paladins. I feel confident any paladin theme helps it, with caveat that I really need the damned hierophant in themes. It might speak to the heard mentality but that was the premise of the OP's question. Asking about popular pairings is already objectively looking for the herd. Currently with this faction that means finding an wide open field of individuals instead ... that's not necessarily a bad thing but ... Having a JVM type that can help unlock the faction through extensive trial and error with an abundance of time to devote to the game isn't the end of the world though. Us lesser humans simply don't have that kind of game time available to repeatedly test out lists against such a wide variety of opponents to prove wider viability of our builds. When you have somebody like that who can provide some direction it helps focus the community and results in even more testing of the list concept. There's still room for the innovators there but you can't deny that having that person is of significant benefit to the faction as a whole. All that being said the big down side is when that personality descends into arrogance and their fan club begins attacking any ideas that don't come from or contradict the approach of the pack alpha. That's when things become degenerate.
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draycos
Junior Strategist
Posts: 167
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Post by draycos on Jul 27, 2017 20:13:59 GMT
Yea, my main reason for this was to find out what the general consensus was. What are our best lists? I am typically not a fan of just playing the top tier list, but as I have not seen any common lists, I was wondering what the "herd" felt were our strongest. As it turns out, we seem to agree that we have options but none of it is outrageous.
So to swap topics a bit... What do you guys think are most commonly played? I am working on an exemplar Vindictus list myself. I've heard this mentioned but not a single list seems to look alike. What is the core of a Vindictus List? Or an Amon list for that matter?
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Post by streetpizza on Jul 27, 2017 20:36:11 GMT
Vinny wants to spam hard hitting exemplar units and use his feat to deliver them. Build a battle group capable of providing Vinny as much protection as possible to move him up field in support of the army while still being able to close out the game. Example list:
Protectorate Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] Exemplar Interdiction
(Vindictus 1) Vice Scrutator Vindictus [+29] - Templar [15] - Templar [15] High Exemplar Gravus [9] Knights Exemplar Seneschal [0(5)] Wrack [1] Wrack [1] Wrack [1] Choir of Menoth (min) [4] Exemplar Vengers (max) [20] Exemplar Vengers (max) [20] Knights Exemplar [9] - Knights Exemplar Officer [0(5)] Knights Exemplar [9] - Knights Exemplar Officer [0(5)]
Amon wants quick and easy synergy builders while maximizing the amount of meat that the opponent has to chew through. Bring dervishes so that they can bait in the trades while enlivening away without free strikes. Mechanics are essential to ensure that the whole machine maintains functionality. Battle group composition and some of the support inclusions will be hotly debated.
Protectorate Army - 75 / 75 points [Theme] The Creator's Might
(Amon 1) High Allegiant Amon Ad-Raza [+29] - Castigator [12] - Castigator [12] - Crusader [10] - Crusader [10] - Crusader [10] - Dervish [7] - Dervish [7] - Dervish [7] - Devout [9] - Hierophant [0(3)] The Covenant of Menoth [0(4)] Vassal Mechanik [1] Vassal Mechanik [1] Vassal of Menoth [0(3)] Vassal of Menoth [3] Wrack [1] Wrack [1] Wrack [1] Choir of Menoth (max) [6] Choir of Menoth (max) [6]
Another popular one is Sevy2. Build him for ranged damage with lots of spell assassination potential. There's probably better builds out there for him but I use the one below. Note that if mercs do end up being allowed in themes then I'll make this into creator's might list immediately.
Protectorate Army - 75 / 75 points
(Severius 2) Hierarch Severius [+26] - Blessing of Vengeance [13] - Reckoner [16] - Reckoner [16] - Templar [15] - Hierophant [3] Vassal of Menoth [3] Wrack [1] Wrack [1] Choir of Menoth (min) [4] Idrian Skirmishers (max) [15] - Idrian Skirmisher Chieftain & Guide [5] Visgoth Juviah Rhoven & Honor Guard [9]
Some other popular archetypes are Sevy1 in interdiction or Creator's Might, High Reclaimer in Vanilla, Thyra in Guardians, Kreoss1 pop and drop in Creator's Might or Vanilla, Kreoss3 in Interdiction and Reznik2 in anything but Creator's might.
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Post by WantonRanger on Jul 27, 2017 21:02:59 GMT
I guess roughly in order of popularity:
Vanilla: High Reclaimer, Kreoss1 > Sev1
Creators Might: Amon, Sev2, > Kreoss1, Sev1
Interdiction: Harbinger (recently), Vindictus > Sev1, Kreoss3
Guardians: not really sure if there is much here...
Again I feel like we havn't yet worked out our best combos but the above seems a reasonable summation of current attempts
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Post by WantonRanger on Jul 27, 2017 21:04:15 GMT
I really would play Amon but I don't wish to own 17000 Jacks....
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Post by gianttourtiere on Jul 27, 2017 21:20:51 GMT
I'm on a Menoth break but my pairing would still be Thyra (Flameguard theme) and ... something. Maybe Amon to deal with wall o' jacks. I feel like Thyra would be solid in the new scenarios.
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Post by chillychinaman on Jul 27, 2017 21:28:37 GMT
I guess roughly in order of popularity: Vanilla: High Reclaimer, Kreoss1 > Sev1 Creators Might: Amon, Sev2, > Kreoss1, Sev1 Interdiction: Harbinger (recently), Vindictus > Sev1, Kreoss3 Guardians: not really sure if there is much here... Again I feel like we havn't yet worked out our best combos but the above seems a reasonable summation of current attempts Just wondering, what is HR fielding that wouldn't fit into Interdiction or Guardians? Exemplars seem good with him as well as Cleansers.
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