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Post by Fudly on Jun 16, 2017 15:03:27 GMT
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Post by telmerand on Jun 16, 2017 15:17:17 GMT
Amuck is funny on the Rip Horn for his chain attack throw/headbutt. But hardly worth the investment. Can't use it on chain attacks. Circle has a ton of chain attacks - it would be better if that was the case.
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Post by ispyypsi on Jun 16, 2017 18:11:13 GMT
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Post by macdaddy on Jun 16, 2017 18:58:52 GMT
I use bones of orboros a lot and am mostly successful with it. The new Fulcrum really helps out the theme and You'd be surprised how much damage a wold can do with the right buffs. Honestly my biggest issue is Mat 6 everywhere in bones combined with the mediocre pow. However, the list ends up being fairly well rounded as it is durable, has solid ranged dps, has good when buffed melee dps, and is pretty versatile in terrain navigation since everything has pathfinder. I still think the healing should be D3 in theme but honestly Its pretty solid for what it is. If guardians had better hitting power and wardens were cheaper I think people would be more interested in playing it.
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Post by streetpizza on Jun 16, 2017 19:10:01 GMT
Spiny growth really would've been a buff if he'd also kept unyielding. As is Ghet traded something that was really good in most games for something that's pretty good in some games.
+2 arm is great for some casters but we already had that for cheaper in the old winter's coat and how often did we see the MKII winter argus ...
I think the OP is slightly off in his analysis though. Our beasts do have differentiated roles they just weren't made to be good enough at those to not look like run of the mill beaters with tacked on abilities. The goats are perfect examples of this. The shadowhorn and gnarlhorn aren't strictly heavy beaters. They both are intended to provide power attack utility to enable the rest of your list to do what needs doing. The problem is that you can't win in one turn using this approach so you're throwing 12pts down the toilet trying to knock something down or shifting its position. As such these abilities just become "nice to haves" tacked onto a cheap beat stick.
In warmachine/hordes you can't design lists around nice to haves. It just doesn't work. You need solid predictable outputs, especially from large point investments, or solid utility. A beast of all trades master of none just isn't going to get it done.
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Post by claptrap on Jun 16, 2017 21:28:52 GMT
Arcane supression is a horrible animus. I believe nothing will come out of CID with Arcane Supression on it. It's a dead animus. I could not possibly disagree more as I find AS incredibly useful. It's one less fury for a beast to use, or a real drain on any Warcaster/Warlock. Frequently I'll see Warthings back out of domination distance to cast their spells. It's a great board control tool. Plus if AS comes from a wyrd, then you get to add insult to injury by taking a shot at the model that just paid a premium for the privilege.
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Post by jisidro on Jun 19, 2017 8:49:42 GMT
Arcane supression is a horrible animus. I believe nothing will come out of CID with Arcane Supression on it. It's a dead animus. I could not possibly disagree more as I find AS incredibly useful. It's one less fury for a beast to use, or a real drain on any Warcaster/Warlock. Frequently I'll see Warthings back out of domination distance to cast their spells. It's a great board control tool. Plus if AS comes from a wyrd, then you get to add insult to injury by taking a shot at the model that just paid a premium for the privilege.
You're better than me then, I never cast it. Wyrds are floating around shooting and making their boosts count.
I still maintain my point, not enough people will defend the merits of Arcane Supression to counter the flood of people saying it's a horrible animus. And more, I think the devs will agree.
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Post by ispyypsi on Jun 19, 2017 9:38:34 GMT
I don't think AS needs worked on more than that weak ass bulldoze on a 4 spd heavy. Why clay flesh or whatever it was called was removed is beyond me.
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Post by The Snark Knight on Jun 20, 2017 20:31:44 GMT
Did anybody ever try a bunch of cheap Satyrs with Kaya 3?
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Post by Dev Null on Jun 21, 2017 0:02:21 GMT
Scuttlebutt is, that was how she was meant to be played. The problem I had with that was that I was usually happier using griffons instead. 2 Shadowhorns with 6 initials between them at (after Synergy powers up) P+S 17/16/16 is pretty decent. But the same points buys you 3 Scarsfells with 9 initials between them at 15/14/14, more hit boxes, more Fury, and a higher DEF to help abuse Kaya's feat. It was better still when they still had Long Leash, but even now I think I'd mostly prefer the birds.
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Post by souleater on Jun 21, 2017 7:00:42 GMT
Arcane supression is a horrible animus. I believe nothing will come out of CID with Arcane Supression on it. It's a dead animus. I could not possibly disagree more as I find AS incredibly useful. It's one less fury for a beast to use, or a real drain on any Warcaster/Warlock. Frequently I'll see Warthings back out of domination distance to cast their spells. It's a great board control tool. Plus if AS comes from a wyrd, then you get to add insult to injury by taking a shot at the model that just paid a premium for the privilege. I like it, too. Especially against low FOCUS or FURY enemies.
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Post by Cryptix on Jun 21, 2017 12:29:32 GMT
I could not possibly disagree more as I find AS incredibly useful. It's one less fury for a beast to use, or a real drain on any Warcaster/Warlock. Frequently I'll see Warthings back out of domination distance to cast their spells. It's a great board control tool. Plus if AS comes from a wyrd, then you get to add insult to injury by taking a shot at the model that just paid a premium for the privilege.
You're better than me then, I never cast it. Wyrds are floating around shooting and making their boosts count.
I still maintain my point, not enough people will defend the merits of Arcane Supression to counter the flood of people saying it's a horrible animus. And more, I think the devs will agree.
I don't know what game your playing, Arcane Suppression is incredible. You can combine it with other anti-magic abilities like Lamentation to cripple Animi-based armies. Mordikaar + Despoiler in Skorne basically nukes any caster or lock with 6 focus or less.
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Post by jisidro on Jun 21, 2017 15:53:10 GMT
You're better than me then, I never cast it. Wyrds are floating around shooting and making their boosts count.
I still maintain my point, not enough people will defend the merits of Arcane Supression to counter the flood of people saying it's a horrible animus. And more, I think the devs will agree.
I don't know what game your playing, Arcane Suppression is incredible. You can combine it with other anti-magic abilities like Lamentation to cripple Animi-based armies. Mordikaar + Despoiler in Skorne basically nukes any caster or lock with 6 focus or less.
Well, I was thinking of AS only. Circle doesn't have lamentation...
My questions are:
- Won't Despoiler die if it's within 10" of my caster? Or have I taken a horrible Alpha in which Despiler had 2 Fury to spare and it's just a win-more? - If I have lamentation/Mordikaar thingy up, why am I casting AS as well?
I don't see it.
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Post by ispyypsi on Jun 21, 2017 23:37:20 GMT
I probably wouldn't rely on AS to prevent anything (also does it stack?). I would use it to punish those jr casters out there. While not 100% badass I like the fresh animus and am glad they didn't hand us another bulldoze/beatback.
Although morvs goat has it too which is kinda stupid.
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Post by macdaddy on Jun 22, 2017 11:34:44 GMT
AS really comes into its own when you face a caster that has to play upfield and relies on upkeeps or certain in activation spells to function. Its also worth noting that it affects animi too which has come up for me a couple of times against troll and skorne players.
I think its a useful animus and it can provide a good chunk of resource denial if you position your wyrds correctly. Casters like Mohsar or Wurmwoods can have the wyrds sit behind pillars or a forest wall and pop it to be safe and most of the time your opponent has to commit some resources to finish off a woldwyrd. It doesn't come up every game and it doesn't look that great on paper but it is a nifty tool to have in your belt if you do end up needing it. I don't think it is garbage at all it can really throw a wrench in an opponents plans.
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