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Post by Swampmist on Jun 18, 2017 23:48:21 GMT
That doesn't exactly help the Avatar much, since most juniors don't see much play in mk3 either. For many of the same reasons. Locally, it's definitely the opposite around here. To my knowledge, it's largely the Cygnar Juniors (Arcane shield and the "shoot dz turn one,) plus the efficiency of the charger,) the Ret Junior (not sure why, I think she has a good FM or something?) and the odd Tristan1 (mostly to fuel redeemers or Reckoners, and\or for bricking.)
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Post by paradox on Jun 19, 2017 0:26:53 GMT
Tristan1 + reckoner is still amazing in MKIII.
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Post by WolfsSOL on Jun 19, 2017 4:18:00 GMT
Locally, it's definitely the opposite around here. To my knowledge, it's largely the Cygnar Juniors (Arcane shield and the "shoot dz turn one,) plus the efficiency of the charger,) the Ret Junior (not sure why, I think she has a good FM or something?) and the odd Tristan1 (mostly to fuel redeemers or Reckoners, and\or for bricking.) I've run Tristan 1 with 2 redeemers before in a Kreoss 3 list, force hammering a heavy and then having fully loaded redeemers open up on it is gold.
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Post by Swampmist on Jun 19, 2017 7:06:12 GMT
I said those are what Tristan1 is for yes. 2 Redeemers, A Reckoner or the odd Vigilant.
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Post by WolfsSOL on Jun 19, 2017 8:30:58 GMT
I said those are what Tristan1 is for yes. 2 Redeemers, A Reckoner or the odd Vigilant. I was adding some personal experience to your comment man, chill.
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moquan
Junior Strategist
Posts: 193
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Post by moquan on Jun 19, 2017 10:15:29 GMT
I've seen Tristan with Eye of Truth as well. Furthermore I really like the Avatar with Thyra. Don't forget it also has magic weapons which really help into ghostfleet. Something has to kill the Wraith Engine.
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Provengreil
Junior Strategist
Choir Kills: 12
Posts: 850
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Post by Provengreil on Jun 19, 2017 13:49:27 GMT
That doesn't exactly help the Avatar much, since most juniors don't see much play in mk3 either. For many of the same reasons. Locally, it's definitely the opposite around here. In all factions, or Menoth specifically? it matters because most juniors bring along a signature spell that, in many cases, is the justification. Sure, Cygnar can fuel up to three extra hunters/chargers on junior, but time and again he's truly taken for access to an arcane shield. Meanwhile, I'm pretty sure most Khador players will either just put the warjack on the caster, or drop the points into shocktroopers/rifle corps. Tristan carries fortify, which is pretty awesome on the right warjacks, most notably Vigilants, Indictors, and Templars (I also suspect the devout, but I've only owned one for a very short time and have yet to test it). I've found room in lists for him on plenty of casters and would use him and an indictor over the avatar in almost every instance.
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Post by paradox on Jun 19, 2017 14:19:10 GMT
Locally, it's definitely the opposite around here. In all factions, or Menoth specifically? it matters because most juniors bring along a signature spell that, in many cases, is the justification. Sure, Cygnar can fuel up to three extra hunters/chargers on junior, but time and again he's truly taken for access to an arcane shield. Meanwhile, I'm pretty sure most Khador players will either just put the warjack on the caster, or drop the points into shocktroopers/rifle corps. Tristan carries fortify, which is pretty awesome on the right warjacks, most notably Vigilants, Indictors, and Templars (I also suspect the devout, but I've only owned one for a very short time and have yet to test it). I've found room in lists for him on plenty of casters and would use him and an indictor over the avatar in almost every instance. In most factions.
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Post by paradox on Jun 19, 2017 14:22:40 GMT
Cygnar, Menoth, Khador, Cryx. I've seen alot of these factions, and commonly seen jrs in lists. Not so much in Trolls, Circle or Legion. A bit more in Skorne, but I don't see very much Skorne, so hard to judge. Don't really see Mercs or Ret either, so again, hard to say.
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doopsie
Junior Strategist
Posts: 341
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Post by doopsie on Jun 19, 2017 19:31:37 GMT
Honestly, if they just let battlegroup points be spent on it, I'd be happy. Anything more, imo, is just extra gravy that isn't needed, but I certainly wouldn't turn down.
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demonic
Junior Strategist
Posts: 649
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Post by demonic on Jun 19, 2017 20:53:08 GMT
Skorne uses its Lesser in almost every list, now. A new strategy to help with our support bloat issue is putting the gladiator under Zaadesh1; this allows the use of rush 3x per turn without siphoning fury off the main caster.
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Post by greytemplar on Jun 20, 2017 1:20:46 GMT
All I really see is the Cygnar junior and Elara. At least if you're talking competitively. Jank lists get played sometimes of course.
The Cygnar junior is still arcane shield on a stick, plus Chargers are really really good for their points. So you don't really lose anything by taking him.
Elara is the same. I see a lot of Colossal+1 heavy lists(usually Disco). Making one of theme independent from the caster is again worth it in that situation.
In a vacuum, Tristan is good. But he's definitely not as useful as he was in mk2. Especially since the VoJ got redesigned, I've swapped him out for a Vessel in many of those lists where I did have him.
For Khador lists I don't really see any lists where a junior would be used. Its either Karchev or Harkavich with all the jacks, or Strakov2. And the occasional Butcher list. None of which really want Malakov.
Not much Hordes in my meta right now outside of some circle and legion, so not much comment on that side of the aisle.
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Post by Cryptix on Jun 20, 2017 2:18:01 GMT
For Khador lists I don't really see any lists where a junior would be used. Its either Karchev or Harkavich with all the jacks, or Strakov2. And the occasional Butcher list. None of which really want Malakov. Both Sorscha's really, really, really disagree with you.
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demonic
Junior Strategist
Posts: 649
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Post by demonic on Jun 20, 2017 2:24:32 GMT
Skorne is still Menoth's little brother, Trolls are dependent on their colossal based beasts, gremkin is still in the works. Skilled Skorne players use their lesser warlock quite a bit now as it solves the fury management issues with casters like Xerxis (especially 2) who only have 5, yet thrive on heavy beasts. He, himself, does not do much but enabling the use of rush on 3 beasts a turn is magnificent (Rush gives +2 movement and pathfinder. xerxis2 gives his battlegroup +2 spd. Our beasts spd averages at 4 inches)
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Provengreil
Junior Strategist
Choir Kills: 12
Posts: 850
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Post by Provengreil on Jun 20, 2017 11:40:36 GMT
Skorne is still Menoth's little brother, Trolls are dependent on their colossal based beasts, gremkin is still in the works. Skilled Skorne players use their lesser warlock quite a bit now as it solves the fury management issues with casters like Xerxis (especially 2) who only have 5, yet thrive on heavy beasts. He, himself, does not do much but enabling the use of rush on 3 beasts a turn is magnificent (Rush gives +2 movement and pathfinder. xerxis2 gives his battlegroup +2 spd. Our beasts spd averages at 4 inches) Which feeds into exactly what I said about the junior being taken for spells, not focus (or in this case, more animi use). Looping it back to the Avatar, he brings none of that kind of thing. Gaze is decent, but too conditional to be the only deciding factor in a chunk of points this big: otherwise, he's just a high-stat warjack.
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