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Post by Manathern on May 23, 2017 20:15:52 GMT
What are you guys takes on the Purifier? Has anyone proxied/played it?
I heard mostly that It's an expensive Dervish and a bit underwhelming. But I do think 2 chains weapons can make for a good unjammer against shield wall and flame trail can be useful to finish infantry you didn't kill on the first go. If only it could trample...
I could see it with Malekus or Amon. Maybe it's the jack Feora 2 as been looking for.
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Provengreil
Junior Strategist
Choir Kills: 12
Posts: 850
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Post by Provengreil on May 23, 2017 21:10:40 GMT
The issue is that shield walls are heavily out of favor in many places because wall of steel is active on a run, and splash damage/eleaps are in vogue. Amon might want one for any shield wearing warjacks, but without native parry and higher speed I don't see many other casters using it much.
Testament might get super sneaky with it though, feat turn could mimic feora's.
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Post by dicebedamned on May 24, 2017 11:59:16 GMT
I want to like it, the model is bad-ass and the image of twin flaming flails slamming over a shield wall is a cool one, but in actual gameplay it is a poor man's Dervish and there is no reason to take it. If it had something to allow it to drive deep into enemy lines then I could see a use for it, but at the moment it is a bit pointless - certainly not helped by the fact that infantry with shields that do survive the Purifier attacks are unlikely to be fussed about a pow 12 that goes out 1/3 of the time.
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Provengreil
Junior Strategist
Choir Kills: 12
Posts: 850
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Post by Provengreil on May 24, 2017 12:05:22 GMT
I want to like it, the model is bad-ass and the image of twin flaming flails slamming over a shield wall is a cool one, but in actual gameplay it is a poor man's Dervish and there is no reason to take it. If it had something to allow it to drive deep into enemy lines then I could see a use for it, but at the moment it is a bit pointless - certainly not helped by the fact that infantry with shields that do survive the Purifier attacks are unlikely to be fussed about a pow 12 that goes out 1/3 of the time. it's not even a poor man's dervish: it's more expensive and now they're the same kit!
The purifier is actually representative of much of our faction right now: soft countering something not seen too much with a vague theory about burning things without being all that interesting about it.
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Post by marijnh on May 26, 2017 20:58:33 GMT
It's a toy for the sake of having it, not because it does anything for our faction. It's a cool model, it has some niche-nice rules, but it's not particularly useful.
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spideredd
Junior Strategist
Summer Gamer
Posts: 588
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Post by spideredd on May 26, 2017 22:02:30 GMT
I'm going to try it, but frankly, I doubt that I'll find it appealing because I don't think that it brings anything unique to the faction beyond being a light that's immune to fire. It sits in a sad space where everything it does is done better by something else for either the same price or cheaper.
Want a light that can set stuff on fire? Try a Repenter instead. At least it has the decency to bring a flamethrower and more ARM.
Want a light with a chain weapon? well, the Repenter has you covered there too. In fact, it was the first chain weapon.
Want a pure combat light? The Dervish is is more flexible there. As a combat light, it has combo strike, giving it a single P&S17 hit before the choir buff is added. It's not going to be used every game, but it's going to get used.
How about a light with movement shenanigans? Well, the Dervish has you there too. It has parry so it can move more freely and it has side step instead of overtake. Side step triggers once a model is hit, overtake triggers on destroyed.
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Purifier
May 27, 2017 22:51:06 GMT
via mobile
Post by W0lfBane on May 27, 2017 22:51:06 GMT
Dervish is usually preferrable to the purifier. Like so much so that i think the purifier needs a new rule. Something to do with spinning up its chains. Like maybe hold them above is head and spin them real hard until it can helicopter away using them or something.
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Purifier
May 28, 2017 3:42:26 GMT
via mobile
Post by WolfsSOL on May 28, 2017 3:42:26 GMT
Dervish is usually preferrable to the purifier. Like so much so that i think the purifier needs a new rule. Something to do with spinning up its chains. Like maybe hold them above is head and spin them real hard until it can helicopter away using them or something. possibly give it thresher, a 8 point light with chain weapons am thresher doesn't seem to bad.
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Post by greytemplar on May 28, 2017 4:33:35 GMT
I want to like it, the model is bad-ass and the image of twin flaming flails slamming over a shield wall is a cool one, but in actual gameplay it is a poor man's Dervish and there is no reason to take it. If it had something to allow it to drive deep into enemy lines then I could see a use for it, but at the moment it is a bit pointless - certainly not helped by the fact that infantry with shields that do survive the Purifier attacks are unlikely to be fussed about a pow 12 that goes out 1/3 of the time. it's not even a poor man's dervish: it's more expensive and now they're the same kit!
The purifier is actually representative of much of our faction right now: soft countering something not seen too much with a vague theory about burning things without being all that interesting about it.
100% this^ The Purifier is basically a fix for a problem that doesn't exist. Chain weapon is cute, but when you hit for P+S15 most warrior models are dying anyway, shield wall or not. And against heavies with shields, a Dervish can side-step into the back arc easily so flatout ignoring shields isn't as useful. Overtake is also cool in theory, but nobody is going to hand you a shield wall unit on a silver platter all bunched up for you to walk all over(and even then, you get 5 at most. No berserk or cleave to really drive the point home). In reality, Side-step actually tends to give you more range for kills since you can kill, side-step, kill, and then side-step somewhere with at least 1-3 other models in range to keep buying. Flame Trail is one of those cute rules that will never actually do much of anything consistently. The Purifier doesn't even have Parry to just do a "run to light everything on fire" activation. Basically, the Dervish does more for cheaper. The Purifier needs something else to justify it's existence, like Fuel for the Flames+Caustic Presence. If it was a cheap-ish beacon for buffed fire damage(basically Protectorate's Firefly) then it would be useful. So yeah, you really nailed it Provengreil. I'll probably buy 2 kits eventually and magnetize them, but I doubt the Purifier loadout will see much use till it goes back into CID.
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Post by chillychinaman on May 28, 2017 4:57:01 GMT
Ahh...I'm drooling at the thought of a Protectorate Firefly. But I agree with the above, for all practical purposes, the Dervish renders the Purifier obsolete and does just about every aspect of its job better and for cheaper too.
Just an out there idea, but what if had chain attack-knockdown+reposition? It'd make for a neat enabler piece. An even more outlandish idea, but what about a self-contained synergy?
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Post by greytemplar on May 28, 2017 5:03:30 GMT
Chain-attack Knockdown+walk away would be good, but not super fluffy. That would basically fix the underpowered part, but not the "lacking flavor" part.
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Purifier
May 28, 2017 6:47:20 GMT
via mobile
Post by W0lfBane on May 28, 2017 6:47:20 GMT
Actually speaking of chain attacks. A chain attack combustion. Or chain attack the miracle that pushes on the battle engine would be cool. With the latter it could charge into a zone and push things out if it.
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Purifier
May 28, 2017 6:52:47 GMT
via mobile
Post by WolfsSOL on May 28, 2017 6:52:47 GMT
Actually speaking of chain attacks. A chain attack combustion. Or chain attack the miracle that pushes on the battle engine would be cool. With the latter it could charge into a zone and push things out if it. In the MkII rules for the purifier it did have chain attack combustion, they changed them before the model was even released.
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spideredd
Junior Strategist
Summer Gamer
Posts: 588
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Post by spideredd on May 28, 2017 7:16:38 GMT
Actually speaking of chain attacks. A chain attack combustion. Or chain attack the miracle that pushes on the battle engine would be cool. With the latter it could charge into a zone and push things out if it. In the MkII rules for the purifier it did have chain attack combustion, they changed them before the model was even released. And it still looked boring in mkII.
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Provengreil
Junior Strategist
Choir Kills: 12
Posts: 850
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Post by Provengreil on May 28, 2017 12:53:57 GMT
it's not even a poor man's dervish: it's more expensive and now they're the same kit!
The purifier is actually representative of much of our faction right now: soft countering something not seen too much with a vague theory about burning things without being all that interesting about it.
100% this^ The Purifier is basically a fix for a problem that doesn't exist. Chain weapon is cute, but when you hit for P+S15 most warrior models are dying anyway, shield wall or not. And against heavies with shields, a Dervish can side-step into the back arc easily so flatout ignoring shields isn't as useful. Overtake is also cool in theory, but nobody is going to hand you a shield wall unit on a silver platter all bunched up for you to walk all over(and even then, you get 5 at most. No berserk or cleave to really drive the point home). In reality, Side-step actually tends to give you more range for kills since you can kill, side-step, kill, and then side-step somewhere with at least 1-3 other models in range to keep buying. Flame Trail is one of those cute rules that will never actually do much of anything consistently. The Purifier doesn't even have Parry to just do a "run to light everything on fire" activation. Basically, the Dervish does more for cheaper. The Purifier needs something else to justify it's existence, like Fuel for the Flames+Caustic Presence. If it was a cheap-ish beacon for buffed fire damage(basically Protectorate's Firefly) then it would be useful. So yeah, you really nailed it Provengreil. I'll probably buy 2 kits eventually and magnetize them, but I doubt the Purifier loadout will see much use till it goes back into CID. Emphasis mine. I bought 3, but until now I had no devouts (droopy metal spears can DIAF) and only one dervish. You'll be happy to know they magnetize super easily, there's a nice joint at the wrists to do it at and every weapon comes with a hand that holds it, even the shield.
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