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Post by Trollock on Nov 20, 2017 15:09:51 GMT
Now i believe that almost everything here should be up to date. Changes to themes, minions and northkin releases. Feel free to tell me if you find anything that is obviously mad or plain wrong. Updating this guide continously to fit an ever changing meta will not be doable though
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Post by Trollock on Nov 29, 2017 12:15:58 GMT
I added some 50 point sample lists, one for each theme. These lists are not super optimized, but they gives you a good idea on how a list could look, and most importantly: they contain only models that will be useful in many lists (and the lights you get in the battle box, even though they are not as useful as most of the heavies, but you probably own them anyway).
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Post by trout on Jan 16, 2018 15:35:46 GMT
This is an awesome post Trollock, I found it a great help and reference when making the switch to Trolls. Every once in a while I still come back and browse it when looking at/considering something new.
How do you feel about Borka2's three star power rating now that you've got some post CiD games in?
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Post by Trollock on Jan 16, 2018 20:51:46 GMT
This is an awesome post Trollock, I found it a great help and reference when making the switch to Trolls. Every once in a while I still come back and browse it when looking at/considering something new. How do you feel about Borka2's three star power rating now that you've got some post CiD games in? Ill add another star right away Glad you like the article. It is always fun when some one reads what you write
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Post by Trollock on Jan 29, 2018 10:13:40 GMT
Did a few minor updates, but also re-formatted the whole thing to use spoiler tags. Should be easier to browse now.
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Post by Bellissimo on Feb 12, 2018 4:45:08 GMT
Is Skaldi missing or am I blind...
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Post by grabsnikk on Feb 12, 2018 6:13:34 GMT
Is Skaldi missing or am I blind... There is one sentence about him under Champions.
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Post by Trollock on Feb 12, 2018 7:21:44 GMT
Is Skaldi missing or am I blind... Attachments are discussed under the unit they are attached to. Skaldi is not always played if you have champions, but very often. If you buy one, you should buy the other while you are at it
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Post by beardmonk on May 3, 2018 8:51:18 GMT
I have been playing Night Trolls quite a bit over the last few months and I think you may have underrated them somewhat in the guide. Their natural 3 attacks and ability to "pull" troops in is a huge benefit. Most of the recent CID’s seem to be making medium based infantry more viable and IMO, that is the primary target for Night Trolls alongside key solos.
Grissel1 turns the beast up to 11 through Heroic Ballad, giving it 3xP+S12 and 1xP+S11 attacks. (P+S15 & P+S14 if you cast Maulers Animus). It charges for free against warrior models.
The combined with natural stealth they are harder to remove at range as your opponent needs to commit resources to do so, drawing attention away from your other troops or beasts. All this for 7pts is a great package for trolls. I often take a pair of Night Trolls. I have had great success against Arcuarii/Cetrati/Incindiarii and Tharns (pre impending CID)
Anybody else trying these great light beasts out?
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Post by Trollock on May 3, 2018 9:01:24 GMT
I have been playing Night Trolls quite a bit over the last few months and I think you may have underrated them somewhat in the guide. Their natural 3 attacks and ability to "pull" troops in is a huge benefit. Most of the recent CID’s seem to be making medium based infantry more viable and IMO, that is the primary target for Night Trolls alongside key solos. Grissel1 turns the beast up to 11 through Heroic Ballad, giving it 3xP+S12 and 1xP+S11 attacks. (P+S15 & P+S14 if you cast Maulers Animus). It charges for free against warrior models. The combined with natural stealth they are harder to remove at range as your opponent needs to commit resources to do so, drawing attention away from your other troops or beasts. All this for 7pts is a great package for trolls. I often take a pair of Night Trolls. I have had great success against Arcuarii/Cetrati/Incindiarii and Tharns (pre impending CID) Anybody else trying these great light beasts out? You like him even without Grissel 1? My assessment has been "Grissel 1 or not at all", but do you like him as a general beast with any caster?
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Post by beardmonk on May 3, 2018 11:00:56 GMT
I have been playing Night Trolls quite a bit over the last few months and I think you may have underrated them somewhat in the guide. Their natural 3 attacks and ability to "pull" troops in is a huge benefit. Most of the recent CID’s seem to be making medium based infantry more viable and IMO, that is the primary target for Night Trolls alongside key solos. Grissel1 turns the beast up to 11 through Heroic Ballad, giving it 3xP+S12 and 1xP+S11 attacks. (P+S15 & P+S14 if you cast Maulers Animus). It charges for free against warrior models. The combined with natural stealth they are harder to remove at range as your opponent needs to commit resources to do so, drawing attention away from your other troops or beasts. All this for 7pts is a great package for trolls. I often take a pair of Night Trolls. I have had great success against Arcuarii/Cetrati/Incindiarii and Tharns (pre impending CID) Anybody else trying these great light beasts out? You like him even without Grissel 1? My assessment has been "Grissel 1 or not at all", but do you like him as a general beast with any caster? I do. I'm new-ish at troll but I have run 2 of them with Grissel1, Horgel2 and Doomy1. While Grissel1 is the best caster for them I think that a pair of Night Trolls working together is very very viable. Some observations: - The people I play against regularly like using medium based infantry. Skorne, Circle, Minions, Grymkin and CoC. I have found that 2 Night Trolls can normally wipe out a 5 man Med based unit or to enough damage to make that unit irrelevant and easy to mop up. Would this work against massed small based infantry? I don't know.
- They tend to be the first of my beasts to get into combat. Rage animus on one makes a massive difference. This is a given fact for Trolls however that does mean that you need get you Night Trolls into combat ahead of the rest of your beasts.
- 2 x night Trolls = 14pts = Earthborn. It can be argued that the Earthborn is a heavier hitter but you get more natural attacks from 2 Night Trolls and the ability to go after 2 targets at once (an objective AND a key solo in on round for example)
- I have not played them into some of the classic gunline armies, Trenchers, Winterguard or armies with massed anti stealth tech. Would they survive that? I don't know.
- I am not the worlds best player......
That being said, I think they are better than many people give them credit for and as the meta seems to shift towards and CID seems to buff multi wound medium infantry, troll players should look into them.
Or maybe I'm the only person in the world who bought 2 of them and I'm trying to justify it to myself ;-)
If any other players have data or experiences, love to hear them
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Post by Trollock on May 3, 2018 14:21:56 GMT
Outside Grissel 1 i have played a single night troll in some lists and e vastly prefer the 8 point options that have guns as i find them way more universally useful. The night troll hasnt really hindered me, but i have never felt like it was the obvious correct choice. Its more like "i guess you could play one and it wont make a big difference".
I love that you bring some detailed data on why you like them. Against slow medium based infantry they might get the charge, but either one of those units you mention will tie for threat range, or out threat the night troll, and they can easily dispatch one of your night trolls if they get the charge. Then your second one comes in and kills 1-2 medium guys, and the remaining 3-4 wipe out your second night troll. All of a sudden your trade has been 14 points to kill 2 medium bases. It feels a bit unreliable, especially since you do not have pathfinder, so you have no reliable way to get the drop on them. It can still happen for sure, but it is very unreliable.
The comparison with an EBDT is interesting, but the EBDT usually DOES out threat medium based infantry. If you count on your beast having Rage, the EBDT can charge and kill 2-3 medium bases, and the remianing 2-3 guys will not be able to one round it. It can mop them up the next turn.
Im not trying to invalidate your experience here. Under the right circumstances they will be a nifty idea. This however is sort of a guide on what to buy for new players, and my conscience will not allow me to recommend new players to buy more than a single night troll (if even that) unless they plan on playing Grissel 1.
Maybe they are on the uprise though as you say. If they can fight medium bases well, and medium bases are more common now, perhaps they will be a staple in 6 months. Please keep us posted on your experience. Maybe other ppl will follow in your footsteps and we shall see night trolls more commonly in lists in the future!
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Post by vasquez21 on May 16, 2018 9:47:00 GMT
I have tested list some time ago and played 6 of them latetly to test them with Borka, and have to say they work very good. Instead of Rage, I have used Primal (+2STR, +2MAT) from Rok on them. With so much of them my opponent have difficulty to handle them somehow and if you use Rok Animus you have beast with MAT 8, who is hitting 3 times with pow: 15, 15, 14, for 7 points that's great IMO. The only problem with that list was managing fury with so many beast. So next time I will try this list with 4 of them.
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Arcaux
Junior Strategist
Posts: 724
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Post by Arcaux on May 16, 2018 10:16:47 GMT
Is Skaldi missing or am I blind... Attachments are discussed under the unit they are attached to. Skaldi is not always played if you have champions, but very often. If you buy one, you should buy the other while you are at it Woah woah woah...
I've owned skaldi for years and he has seen the table like twice. Easily one of the most overrated models we have. Especially when he's competing with Fell Caller, Runebearer and Valka for free solo spots in Storm of the North.
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Post by macdaddy on May 16, 2018 13:05:08 GMT
Attachments are discussed under the unit they are attached to. Skaldi is not always played if you have champions, but very often. If you buy one, you should buy the other while you are at it Woah woah woah...
I've owned skaldi for years and he has seen the table like twice. Easily one of the most overrated models we have. Especially when he's competing with Fell Caller, Runebearer and Valka for free solo spots in Storm of the North.
Woah Woah Woah Woah..... Overrated seems like a but of leap there bud. Skaldi is so worth it if you are running a single brick of champs. He adds 8 boxes to the unit, gives them overtake (an underrated ability on them) and relentless charge (letting them not always need a feel caller for PF and allowing them to benefit from things like War Cry. Consider a regular champ costs 3 ish points and skaldi is only 2 points more for: 3 boxes, +1 Mat, relentless charge and overtake for the unit. As well as giving them immunity cold (matters into some lists) He is for sure worth it
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